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To: Polycarp IV
Unfortunately with priests with whom I've discussed this book, the common concern was that the book belittles the first and primary hurdle for any priest, especially our retired priests here. These priests need to know exactly how they are going to make a living if they cut their ties to Rome, and what exactly it means in real terms to be suspended a divinis from the Church by a validly ordained bishop of the Church.

This recalls what we discussed a couple days ago about priests like Fr. Zigrang and the ones in the book, and even a priest like Fr. Haley of Arlington. They chose to renounce all comfort and financial security. They have made the heroic sacrifice for the sakes of the Catholic faith.

Personally I believe that a bigger hurdle than the financial one, although I agree with you that is a major issue, is the persecution and slander that you know you will suffer. The priest considering making the jump knows for sure that he will be vilified for his choice.

To me this is a sign that it is the right choice. We know with certainty that following Christ means a life of poverty and persecution. If we are rich and comfortable, then almost by definition we cannot be truly following the example of Christ. If everyone praises us, then we cannot really be acting Christ-like.

This message will reverberate with the right kind of priest. The Jesuit seminary in Douai that was sending priests into Elizabethan England had nothing to offer these men except the certainty of eventual arrest and torture and execution. Yet they found many who were willing to accept this bargain.

Priests who wish to remain loyal to the traditional Catholic faith today realize that they must sacrifice financial security, position and prestige, but if they knew that they also had to sacrifice their lives, then the right kind of priest would respond even more eagerly.

37 posted on 07/18/2004 4:40:24 PM PDT by Maximilian
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To: Maximilian
The Jesuit seminary in Douai that was sending priests into Elizabethan England had nothing to offer these men except the certainty of eventual arrest and torture and execution. Yet they found many who were willing to accept this bargain. Priests who wish to remain loyal to the traditional Catholic faith today realize that they must sacrifice financial security, position and prestige, but if they knew that they also had to sacrifice their lives, then the right kind of priest would respond even more eagerly. 37 posted on 07/18/2004 4:40:24 PM PDT by Maximilian

Valid point. The church survived and emerged stronger having suffered through the dark penal times in England and Ireland. From the blood of martyrs.
She will again.

IHS+

39 posted on 07/18/2004 4:59:10 PM PDT by HowlinglyMind-BendingAbsurdity
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To: Maximilian; Viva Christo Rey; ELS; sinkspur

A couple of points should be mentioned.

Firstly, Fr. Wickens was originally a diocesan priest, who was evicted from his parish for vocaling objecting to Catholic Schools teaching sex education. He found greater merit in celebrating the Tridentine Mass and went on to found our Chapel, St. Anthony of Padua, as it stands today, an Independent Chapel.

It was my understanding months ago, even before Fr. Wickens became sick that the Chapel was supposed to be willed to the SSPX. Fr.'s choice. Now, I am not on any board of business at the Chapel, but as a regular parishoner, I have come to know a lot of things from people who were privied to Chapel business.

It wasn't announced from the pulpit, but I am sure that the Chapel staff had prior knowledge of his wishes. Perhaps Father knew that it would be difficult to get another independent priest to manage the Chapel, and he had a special place for the SSPX. This is only speculation on my part. Father was always a man with good sense and sound ideas, so I think he thought this through very carefully before making this decision.

It's not true that we were "compensated" by little gifts here and there. As ELS stated, Fr. Wickens regularly gave out books, rosaries, chaplets, scapulars, etc. to the congregation, not as "consolation prizes", but as sacramentals and tools to enhance our understanding of the Faith.

As I stated in another thread, the N.O. didn't cease to harrass Fr. Wickens even on his deathbed, asking him to recant his beliefs on the Traditional form of Mass and beliefs. It is heroes like this who exemplify what it means to Defend the Faith and its principals, and other priests who have had the courage to withstand the persecution they know they face.

If a Traditional Priest won't 'play ball' then they are cast out. And these Novus Ordo bishops are supposed to be examples of Catholicity? Sounds hypocritical, sort of like Caiphas and the other high priests.

Sinkspur, Traditional priests are not "renegade" as you call them. They are trying to preserve the Mass as it has been for hundreds of years, before the reforms of Vatican II. The Novus Ordo Mass is the "non-normative" mass.

Pax,
MMJ


48 posted on 07/18/2004 8:05:55 PM PDT by MarineMomJ (The truth only hurts when it's true.)
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To: Maximilian
Priests who wish to remain loyal to the traditional Catholic faith today realize that they must sacrifice financial security, position and prestige, but if they knew that they also had to sacrifice their lives, then the right kind of priest would respond even more eagerly.

I think more and more of the young priests are becoming aware of the great sacrifice that awaits them if they can survive the seminary. I spoke to a young priest several weeks ago who got into trouble here in Detroit because he saw a young man pocket the Host instead of putting it in his mouth, the young priest followed the boy to his seat and insisted he eat the Host. (Understand this young priest did not tell me what had happened, another close to him did), anyway he lost his position. Fortunately, there was a good conservative parish willing to hire him. He has now been given (and I have no clue how this was managed), another chance by the diocesean power structure. He will have to suffer many years until a certain monsignor decides he can have his own parish. For the most part it isn't the Cardinal who makes appointment decisions in Detroit but those in charge underneath him. So you see, for doing the simple act of protecting the soul of a young boy and the Host he has been crucified in this diocease. These young priests won't even have to stand up and declare their intention to say the Tridentine Mass, or the Novus Ordo in Latin, or sing a few chants, or teach the Faith before they are thrown to the wolves. They are being crudified daily for just being devout and doing what they are taught to do in the seminary.

Depending on the diocese the level of abuse against conservative priests can range from being punished for embarrasing a parishioner's son to having a dime (quarter) dropped on them and being ousted before there is any credible evidence brought forth. The police do not have to be involved. So, say you are a liberal wanting to get rid of a priest you don't agree with, bang they are gone so easily. Maybe it was easier to fight in 16th and 17th century England, at least you knew who your enemies were.

52 posted on 07/19/2004 6:21:55 AM PDT by Diva
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