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What Is Man?
Various | September 25, 2003 | betty boop

Posted on 09/24/2003 11:25:56 PM PDT by betty boop

The Platonic Soul

It is fitting to give Plato the first word on the question, “What Is Man?” For Plato was the first thinker to isolate man out of his connection to clan and tribe, making the human individual -- man as he is in himself -- a proper subject of investigation.

This shift of attention to the individual psyche marks a decisive, revolutionary break with the characteristic habits of thought of the ancient world, the cosmological consciousness, which conceived of man mainly in terms of his connections to units larger than the individual, and envisioned a cosmos filled with gods. For Plato’s life-long meditation on the psyche – the human soul -- was deeply implicated in his speculation on the nature of the divine, which radically departed from the Hellenic people’s myth of the gods. Psyche also was the basis of Plato’s life-long meditation on “the best possible” political order.

Platonic thought can probably best be understood as a kind of spiritual autobiography. Great philosopher that he was (perhaps the greatest), Plato was not a “system builder”; he did not propound any positivist doctrine on any subject at all.

This aspect of Platonic thought is difficult for the modern imagination to grasp; for when we moderns think of a “philosopher,” we think of an intellectual who investigates propositions about truth and draws conclusive answers about the objects of his investigation. The philosopher then assembles his insights into systematic form allegedly useful in telling us about the real nature of things. (Plato called this sort of thing “philodoxy,” – love of transitory opinion -- the specialty of the Sophists, his adversaries. He would not call it “philosophy” – love of wisdom. This issue, however, is beyond the scope of the present essay.)

Although Plato is usually classed as an Idealist, his own instinct in philosophizing was uncompromisingly Realist, in the sense that he knew that certain questions can never be “closed” in principle. For the truth of existence, of Reality, is the object of zetesis -- of a search or quest -- that cannot be completed by any human being in the time of his own existence. Rather, it is a quest engaging all mankind proceeding through countless generations. Plato could point out the way. But the student must engage in the quest by and for himself, and understand it as he experiences it, according to his love for divine things.

On that note, we turn now to the consideration of psyche proper. Plato conceived of the individual human being as psyche-in-soma: an eternal soul incarnated in finite bodily existence.

The soul has a characteristic structure, a hierarchy of dynamic forces: the rational element, whose ordering power is sophia, wisdom; the spirited, whose ordering power is andreia, or manly virtue/courage; and the appetitive, whose ordering power is to “feel the pull” of physis, or bodily nature. The well-ordered soul is the healthy integration of the three forces, giving each its proper role and function.

In addition to elaborating a hierarchy of forces in the soul, the Platonic meditation also elaborates its hierarchical “structure”: At psyche’s “summit” is nous, intellect; followed by the conscious mind – including feeling, sensation; and “at bottom,” the unconscious mind, with its root in the “depth” of the soul, in which the soul’s “ground of being” can be found.

I’ve used a lot of quotation marks in the above passage for a reason. To use language like this is to intend as reified objects what are really processes on-going in the soul. We aren’t speaking of “thing-like objects” here. Processes aren’t things at all. But they are real all the same.

With that caution in mind, we have, so far, a “force field” and a “structure” for the soul, and importantly, the suggestion that the soul ought to be well-ordered.

And so the question arises: By what criteria does the soul order itself? And why would it even want to order itself?

To answer such we questions, we have to remember that the Platonic speculation maintains the immortality of the soul. The soul coming into bodily existence, however, does not remember its pre-existence at all; for at its birth into the present existence, the “circuits of the brain” become “deranged,” so the soul cannot remember anything about its life prior to its birth in this one. So it comes as a shock to the soul to discover that its body will die someday. The anxiety is acute, for the soul does not yet realize that its life is not dependent on the body, and is not destroyed with the body.

It is here (The Republic) that Plato inserts a drama in which the soul must act, the Pamphylian myth.

In the myth, “dead souls” – that is, souls separated from the body at physical death – receive reward or punishment according to their conduct in life, the bad souls going to their suffering beneath the earth, the good souls to their blessed existence in heaven. Then, after a thousand years, all the dead souls are brought into the Judgment of Lachesis, the daughter of Ananke (Necessity). And there the dead souls must draw their several lots and choose their individual fate for their next period of incarnated existence:
 

Ananke’s daughter, the maiden Lachesis, her word:
Souls of a day! Beginning of a new cycle, for the mortal race, to end in death!
The daemon will not be allotted to you; but you shall select the daemon.
The first by the lot, shall the first select the life to which he will be bound by necessity.
Arete has no master; and as a man honors or dishonors her, he will have her increased or diminished.
The guilt is the chooser’s; God is guiltless.

Now a soul that had just spent one thousand years in purgative punishment in the netherworld would be most anxious to choose his daemon rightly, lest at the conclusion of the next life, he find himself returned to the suffering below for another thousand years. On the other hand, the blessed souls do not necessarily make better choices than the purged souls. And they are just as liable to wind up in punishment in the next round if they do not choose wisely.

But choose they must, and thereby bind themselves to their fate over the next cycle of life and death. A soul’s only guide in the choice is the character it had acquired during its preceding life. The choice is free, but the wisdom to make a good choice may be deficient. Under the circumstances, the best course would be to make the best choice one can, and then follow Arete – Virtue. To “diminish her” – to dishonor her call to justice, temperance, courage, love of wisdom, zealous search for true being – is to incur culpable guilt. The daemon is there to warn the soul when it wanders from Arete, endeavoring to push the soul up into the light.

The daemon might be thought of as the mediator or agent of cosmic spiritual substance in the soul, a little spark of the divine in man. Plato’s symbol for the divine substance is the Agathon, the Good.

The Agathon is utterly transcendent, so immanent propositions about it cannot be constructed in principle. Yet the soul, in an act of transcendence, may have a vision of the Agathon, of its eternally divine goodness, purity, beauty, truth, and justice. Such experiences of transcendence inform the soul, building up its just order by fortifying the Arete in the soul.
Thus the soul is drawn upward into the light of the vision of the Agathon, and participates in the divine life so far as that is possible for a man.

It is important to bear in mind that the Agathon is not God. Though Plato often refers to the One God “Beyond” the world of created things, and “Beyond” the generations of the intracosmic gods (the gods of the Age or Chronos, subsequently replaced by the Olympians under the rulership of Zeus), and strongly suggests that the Logos of divine Nous is the ordering principle of the Cosmos, he does not elaborate. That elaboration had to wait for the Revelation of Christ.

For Plato, the vision of the Agathon was the basis of the idea of the human family, of a common shared humanity, of the idea of the brotherhood of mankind. As Eric Voegelin noted (Order and History, Vol. III, Baton Rouge: LSU Press, 1957), “The understanding of a universal humanity originates in the experience of transcendence; and the ineffable kinship of men under God revealed in the experience can immanently be expressed only in a myth of descent from a common mother or father….”

In this, Plato seems to anticipate St. Paul’s one body of Christ, interjecting the idea that, despite their differences, all men are equal as brothers in the sight of God.

For Plato, the daimon-mediated tensional suspense of the soul “in between” (metaxy) its cosmic ground in the “depth” of the soul and its extracosmic height in a transcendental “beyond” in the one God, was the site and sensorium of human spiritual reality. The form of the metaxy might be seen as a faint foreshadowing of the mediating process of Christ in the salvation and perfection of the soul, uniting souls to the Father through Himself, as declared by Christian revelation, most clearly in John’s Gospel.

It is possible to imagine that there are certain seed ideas in Plato that could not come into full bloom until Jesus Christ irrupted into human history four centuries after Plato’s death.
 

The Great Hierarchy of Being

The Platonic answer to the question “What Is Man?” must take into account man’s place in the great hierarchy of Being: God-Man-World-Society. All the members of the hierarchy are in dynamic relation, mutually unfolding the cosmic pattern set up “in heaven” as an eternal cosmic process of being-in-becoming over time. Man’s place in the hierarchy is special; for man is the microcosm, or eikon (image or reflection) of the cosmic Logos manifesting creation as the intent of divine Nous. Man’s soul is the site of the intersection of time and timelessness, of the changing and the changeless, of being and becoming, of life and death, of the tensional play of freedom and necessity.

And man is unique among creatures, for he alone possess nous; and thus is capable of being drawn to the paradigm of divine Nous -- to the contemplation of divine things. Thus man is uniquely capable of ordering his soul according to the divine paradigm, in justice and in love. And by a process of transcendence, to attain wisdom, freedom, and true Being in the contemplation of the divine Idea, the Agathon.
 
 


TOPICS: Philosophy
KEYWORDS: agathon; immortalsoul; judgment; lifeanddeath; metaxy; plato; psyche
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To: betty boop
Incidentally, the situation is so touchy that Jesse's last post to you got him banned. The thread is yours.
341 posted on 10/06/2003 2:01:22 PM PDT by DittoJed2 (Liberty must at all hazards be supported. We have a right to it,derived from our Maker- John Adams)
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To: DittoJed2; Jim Robinson; Alamo-Girl; JesseShurun; HalfFull; f.Christian; gore3000
DJ2, I am truly sorry for what has happened -- to Jesse and you and the others. I will respect your wishes.
342 posted on 10/06/2003 2:04:02 PM PDT by betty boop (God used beautiful mathematics in creating the world. -- Paul Dirac)
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To: betty boop
Thank you.
343 posted on 10/06/2003 2:04:43 PM PDT by DittoJed2 (Liberty must at all hazards be supported. We have a right to it,derived from our Maker- John Adams)
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To: betty boop
I'm so glad you enjoyed the Martin Luther information!

I had not read the actual documents and his testimony. It was certainly astonishing to me, especially these words "my conscience is captive to the word of God. I cannot and will not recant anything, for to go against conscience is neither right nor safe. God help me. Amen."

Now, having learned of his personal ordeal from your post, those words are even more piercing. Thank you!!!

344 posted on 10/06/2003 2:25:24 PM PDT by Alamo-Girl
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To: DittoJed2
from another thread ...



To: Vindiciae Contra TyrannoSCOTUS

So just for the hell of it, I checked out one of Morris' bible citations, 2nd Timothy 3:2, 4-5. I'm not sure what it all means (verse 1-6 in it's entirety), but I'll be sure to eat my fiber when I'm older. Wouldn't want to upset god with my incontinence!

1. This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come.
2. For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,
3. Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good
4. Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
5. Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
6. For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with a divers lusts...


26 posted on 10/06/2003 2:07 PM PDT by whattajoke

345 posted on 10/06/2003 4:03:54 PM PDT by f.Christian (evolution vs intelligent design ... science3000 ... designeduniverse.com --- * architecture * !)
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To: betty boop
betty do you feel as though I have harrased you in any way? Just curious. I got a freepmail suggesting I have done so and I was wondering why.
346 posted on 10/06/2003 4:19:29 PM PDT by goodseedhomeschool (returned) (If history has shown us anything, darwinism/evolution is seriously wrong.)
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To: DittoJed2
Did I miss something here? I have been away from my computer for a while. Is my opinion of no value to this thread with someone? I know you love me anyway and I love you in the Lord. I was trying to understand the freepmail I got. If there is any person here who thinks I have done something wrong, I would love to hear it from that person. I would address this comment to "all" but under the situation here, I am afraid to talk to anyone now. Maybe that's how "some" want it.
Is Jesse banned now too? Pretty soon it will be a party of all who think the same and noone to disagree with them. (Shrugging). Oh well, maybe that's how they like it.
347 posted on 10/06/2003 4:24:35 PM PDT by goodseedhomeschool (returned) (If history has shown us anything, darwinism/evolution is seriously wrong.)
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To: goodseedhomeschool (returned)
OR MAYBE a certain person who hates all of us Christians put together a list of us to try to get banned in the first place. Now that sounds pretty close to what I suspect. Well AG I won't post to you any more, be sure of that.
In fact I can't think of very often I have posted to you of late. Betty, I thought you wanted to discuss this stuff. AG set it up. Is this a discussion for an "elite" group only? AG went to my website trying to get "dirt" on me to get me banned again a month or so ago, it looks like she is not happy with me just leaving her alone, she wants blood too. I have no idea why she feels so compelled to attack me personally. I have left her alone now SHE NEEDS TO LEAVE ME ALONE AS WELL. Stop with the mindgames already. I know real Christians get under the skin of new agers, but that is not my fault, it's hers.
348 posted on 10/06/2003 4:39:54 PM PDT by goodseedhomeschool (returned) (If history has shown us anything, darwinism/evolution is seriously wrong.)
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To: DittoJed2
Ditto that for me ditto. I am through with any thread who has certain posters on it. I had no idea they were plotting such treachery. I thought backbiting and baiting was the liberal's job.
349 posted on 10/06/2003 4:53:02 PM PDT by goodseedhomeschool (returned) (If history has shown us anything, darwinism/evolution is seriously wrong.)
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To: goodseedhomeschool (returned)
You got the email too, I see. Well, all I have to say is don't invite everyone to a thread if you don't want to hear from everyone. I've never once been told to not post to certain people, though I've been on Virtual Ignore for a while. I've tried to genuinely engage in debate and even backed up a point or two. Doesn't matter. I won't be posting on this thread any more, goodseed, not that I did much to begin with. I've deliberately stayed away from it, but I guess I'm darned if I do darned if I don't.
350 posted on 10/06/2003 4:55:55 PM PDT by DittoJed2 (Liberty must at all hazards be supported. We have a right to it,derived from our Maker- John Adams)
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To: DittoJed2
I know just how you feel. You can't win (darned if I do and darned if i don't). Yes I got the email too. It totally surprised me too, since I have conducted myself in a good manner and do not know why this happened. YOu know what the Bible says though about the Word and truth searing the ears of the unGodly. Perhaps this is what has happened. I thought these debates were for all. It would seem that if they wanted a private discussion rather than a debate, they would take it to a private source. I'll meet you in another thread somewhere ditto. You have been such a Blessing to me and others. Love in Christ, Goodseed.
351 posted on 10/06/2003 5:03:16 PM PDT by goodseedhomeschool (returned) (If history has shown us anything, darwinism/evolution is seriously wrong.)
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To: DittoJed2
it's especially pathetic when someone puts you on VI, tells you not to post to him/her, then jumps in the middle of a two-way discussion (uninvited) and starts hurling scripture as a weapon against a supposedly ignored person.

To use scripture to attack/make personal accusations is especially disturbing to me. BB and I were having a normal discourse but this individual would not let things alone.

352 posted on 10/06/2003 5:10:34 PM PDT by HalfFull
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To: HalfFull
HI HalfFull :)
I had to jump in here if it's ok. I know just what you mean. She has put all Christians on VI and then jumps in like that all the time. I wager she has been festering this setup for at least a month now. With the help of a few of her bosom buddies who always bash me and others, of which I'd be good money she has a lot to do with, truth be known. It is known to God though. They cannot hide from Him.
I have never seen such pettiness in my life. (shaking head). HOw sad she is.
353 posted on 10/06/2003 5:33:29 PM PDT by goodseedhomeschool (returned) (If history has shown us anything, darwinism/evolution is seriously wrong.)
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To: goodseedhomeschool (returned); Alamo-Girl; Hank Kerchief; Pietro; unspun; Jim Robinson
betty do you feel as though I have harrased you in any way?

No, not at all, gshs. I find you a perfectly lovely and gracious person to talk to.

I don't know the source of your FReepmail. But if it comes to you second hand -- that is, not from the person with whom some of your party, at least, seems to have a problem -- I wouldn't read too much into it, or take it too much to heart.

FWIW, there were no "winners" here today.

I've just got to get this off my chest: I have been posting at FR for five-and-a-half years now; and not once have I ever asked the AdminMod to pull a post, or ban anybody. There are two reasons for this:

(1) I truly believe free speech is a great blessing that is absolutely indispensable to the functioning of a civil society under law. It is something that must be defended, almost all of the time (incitement to crime, for instance, would be an exception to protected speech, and quite properly so, IMHO).

(2) I really do think it's better to leave "the public record" intact.

This might strike some readers as a Machiavellian insight; but sometimes what people say about each other sheds more light on the speaker than on his "target."

So I just say, leave it all up there -- let it all hang out. The careless speaker can discredit his entire line of argument by relying on ill-founded maneuvers. And if such backfires get posted "up there" in neon, indefinitely, there might be something there from which the rest of us might draw some timely and practical instruction.

Of course, that question is now moot, WRT some of my more "adversarial" friends at any rate. Good grief, but I find myself already missing them.

I don't mind adversity in the least. In fact, when I sponsor a thread, like this one, truly I want to encourage the broadest diversity of views.

I'll make my case as strongly and fairly as possible, and I expect others to do exactly the same. I just hope with civility and graciousness, if that's at all possible.

But the research! And the resource! that gets built up in this kind of process really is marvelous, extraordinary. So many have helped to make it so.

I humbly hope JimRob will reinstate any present persona non grata established as such on this thread as soon as possible. And that all the parties will make peace with each other. And then we can begin to move on together -- again.

Maybe there can be winners here today. Where do we go from here?

May God grant His grace and blessing on all today's "contestants."

In Christ's love....

354 posted on 10/06/2003 5:33:36 PM PDT by betty boop (God used beautiful mathematics in creating the world. -- Paul Dirac)
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To: betty boop
Bump for later.
355 posted on 10/06/2003 5:39:26 PM PDT by Bernard Marx
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To: betty boop
I had not thought I had done anything and I appreciate your saying so. YOu may not realize this but there is one who has gone out of her way to harm me and she even plays the VI game with me and I do not deserve it. At this point I have nothing to say to her anyway, but the email I got sure does show what she has been up to of late.
I hope it is ok to post this response, I would not want to get banned just for responing here. I believe in free speech very much. I also believe in truth. I may not be the brightest apple on the tree, but most people know that I tell the truth.

In all truth I do not know why that woman has made it her quest to have me and others banned from FR. She has successfully gotten 2 very good posters who represent true conservatism banned that I know of. When does it stop?
I will not bother you anymore betty. I would not want anyone to misread anything. Good luck in your future.
GSHS
356 posted on 10/06/2003 5:44:01 PM PDT by goodseedhomeschool (returned) (If history has shown us anything, darwinism/evolution is seriously wrong.)
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To: goodseedhomeschool (returned)
Afterthought. Maybe she made it her quest to get anyone banned from this site because she herself was banned from a wonderful Christian site for being dishonest. That makes sense. Oh and notice I posted this to myself as not to direct it to anyone.
357 posted on 10/06/2003 5:48:43 PM PDT by goodseedhomeschool (returned) (If history has shown us anything, darwinism/evolution is seriously wrong.)
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To: goodseedhomeschool (returned)
When I first came here to FR, I was seeking a great conservative website in which I could fellowship with other like-minded conservatives. Liberals are ruining this country. I was so sick and tired of the liberal left sidedness of television. FreeRepublic is a place where we as conservatives should all be working together to fight liberalism in America. I have to say in all honesty, I never thought that atheists could be conservatives. I have always associated them with liberalism. I don't think I am alone. Can you see my confusion here? I have learned that the evo pushers might well be voting "conservative" or at least since I began reading here. I am not trying to be ugly, I am telling you what I really think. It has surprised me so much to learn this. With all that goes with atheism, I still don't get it. Atheists do not want accountability. They do not want a God to be accountable to. They want to destroy our 10 commandments, push abortion, and so on. I am learning so much. I think there are still some people who come to conservative sites in order to spread disinformation in order to use it against our republican party. Am I the only one who sees this? Doesn't anyone eles get the connection here? True conservatives support the beliefs of our founding fathers in America. True conservatives are usually God fearing people. Someone tell me please, how can we be on the same side as someone who is trying to destroy all these things from within in this country?
I have learned that there are many different opinions here but what are we doing to support our party, our conservative rights as a nation? Will be nitpick our way right into destruction? I SAY NO!!! We have got to decide what we believe in and stick to it. We have got to learn that true conviction comes from God Almighty. Oh never mind, there will be some goof who will reply to this in some ugly way so why bother. Ask yourself this one question. What is this country going to be like for our kids in the next generation if we don't find our grassroots of conservatism and make sure it is not forgotten. Will we politically correctly debate our way into oblivion? I don't know about you guys (this is not directed to anyone who has me on VI) but my child's future is far more important to me than to let the two parties merge into one socialistic party for all because no one stood up for what is right. God says we are either for Him or against Him. This is not a grey philisophical area for me.
Have a Blessed day and pray for our country, our president, our schools and our people.
358 posted on 10/06/2003 6:15:31 PM PDT by goodseedhomeschool (returned) (Just for the record, Designeduniverse.com is a wonderful conservative site!)
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To: goodseedhomeschool (returned); Alamo-Girl
gshs, the one thing that must be stopped right now is this "she" language.

I have absolutely had this "she" language, or "the unspeakable one" language, right up to my gills by now; and as far as I'm concerned, it is totally indefensible.

It is completely inconceivable to me that a Christian would use such language in reference to another Christian.

End of story, right there, gshs.

359 posted on 10/06/2003 7:21:34 PM PDT by betty boop (God used beautiful mathematics in creating the world. -- Paul Dirac)
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To: betty boop
Nice set up betty. Thanks so much. Yeah I have had it myself. "She" might do to me what she did to a partner this past year. I wonder if she prayed for him too. Toodles.
360 posted on 10/06/2003 7:34:12 PM PDT by goodseedhomeschool (returned) (Just for the record, Designeduniverse.com is a wonderful conservative site!)
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