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A cursory examination of ballistics suggests that the basic concept for this round is nothing all that new.

The old C-96 "Broomhandle" Mauser was designed around a revoutionary cartridge for the time - the bottle-necked .30 Mauser which could kick out a 90-grain .308" round-nose FMJ slug at velocities exceeding 1,000 FPS. It had a reputation for impressive accuracy and effectiveness at ranges well beyond those normally considered for other handguns of the period, especially when equipped with a detatchable combination holster / shoulder stock.

Sir Winston Churchill in his youger Military days supposedly used and was quite fond of one - as were many Russians.

Knowing a good thing when they saw it, the Russians developed a Browning-inspired T-33 TOKAREV pistol around a rather "juiced-up" version of the .30 Mauser, the .30 Tokarev which in normal service loadings achieves velocities in the 1,400 to 1,600FPS range - pretty impressive for a handgun, and I have read claims that it was, and perhaps still is, the most powerful conventional Military handgun cartridge. It blows the 9X19 MM NATO away, and has a reputation for defeating many types of soft body armor.

In the 1950's Czeckoslovakia modified the rolling-lock breech system of the German MP-40 (also used, we are told, in the P-5) to a semi-auto Military pistol; the CZ-52 chambered for the .30 TOK, also known as the 7.62 X 25MM.

This round was used with some success in submachine guns of several Nations, including the Russian PPSH, and remained popular until obsoleted by the 7.62 X 39 Kalisnakov.

I recently bought a CZ-52, and it is a well made, interesting pistol. The 7.62X25 is a peppy little round indeed, and apparently can be reloaded with a 55 grain saboted .223" (5.56MM) bullet and stepped up to around (as I recall) around 2,300FPS - not bad for a sidearm!

One might speculate that simply necking the .30 TOKAREV to 5.56MM might provide similar carachteristics to the 5.7X28MM developed for this new system. I would not be the least bit surprised if that is essentially just what it is.

If I had my 'druthers and no limit of funds and machine-shop resources, I would be inclined to go with a 7MM using a 65-75 grain projectile.

This new P90 looks as if it might have potential for use as a Police primary weapon; nearly as compact as a pistol but at close ranges nearly as effective as a subgun. The 5.7MM HV round would not be so apt to riccochet off of pavement, vehicles, buildings etc. and pose a threat to innocents downrange as the 9MM etc. would, as these rounds tend to disintegrate on impact. After a couple of hundred Meters, velocity would drop off so as to minimize collatteral damage downrange. How often do LEOs have to engage beyond 25 Meters, anyway?

Rip a couple of punks in two (justly, of course) with one of these little dandies and I'll guarentee that the local Hooligans will treat your Officers with a whole lot more respect for a while!

In the 1950's Czeckoslovakia modified the rolling-lock breech system of the German MP-40 (also used, we are told, in the P-5) to a semi-auto Military pistol; the CZ-52 chambered for the .30 TOK, also known as the 7.62 X 25MM.

Well, no. The MP40 is straight blowback. The Stecke-lock roller locking of the Cz52 is more akin to that found on the German MG42 and developmental Stg-45 assault rifle designs, said to be German developments of prototypes taken during the invasions of Poland and Czechoslovokia.

The German Walther P5 pistol is a development of the wartime P.38 with a lifting wedge type locking system- though if you meant the H&K MP-5 submachinegun, yes, it does indeed have a roller-locked mechanism.

I recently bought a CZ-52, and it is a well made, interesting pistol. The 7.62X25 is a peppy little round indeed, and apparently can be reloaded with a 55 grain saboted .223" (5.56MM) bullet and stepped up to around (as I recall) around 2,300FPS - not bad for a sidearm!

The 7,62x25 is indeed *peppy*, a very reliably fed cartridge due to its bottlenecked configuration, and very suitable with reloading with bullets of .308 to .311 in diameter, both lead and jacketed...and the 109-grain tracer bullet of the .30 carbine works nicely, too.

One might speculate that simply necking the .30 TOKAREV to 5.56MM might provide similar carachteristics to the 5.7X28MM developed for this new system. I would not be the least bit surprised if that is essentially just what it is.

Pretty close, though there are some questions as to whether to lean toward the light/fast 45-55 grain .224 bullets of the originam M16 M193 ball ammunition, or to switch to the 62-grain M855/SS109 style bullet [or heavier] for better penetration. Considerations of barrel twist rate arise, as they have with the 5,7mm MMJ, the .30 carbine cartridge necked to take a .224 bullet.

The .223 Timbs is the result of a co-development between Quality Cartridge and Joseph Timbs. It is the American answer to the proprietary .224 BOZ, bringing the CZ-52 into the new millenium. The .223 Timbs is a special loading of the 7.62x25 round for use only in the CZ-52 pistol. It consists of a sabot like the Remington "Accelerator" pushing a 50gr bullet over 2000fps. Concept was for devastating multi-purpose round, useable for small game, varmits, and defense. Accuracy has proven to be on-par with traditional rounds fired from the same pistol, and terminal ballistics are quite impressive with initial tests showing devastating expansion from the varmit-type bullets.

My old C96 broomhandle serves me well; The CZ 52 and Russian TT-33 Tokarev do as well and can handle MUCH higher pressure loads. And that 71-round drum of Shapagin's PPSh-41 submachinegun offers some interesting possibilitries, too:

Sabot ("Accelerator"*-Type) Loads

50gr SXSP (Hornady) $35.97

In the 1950's Czeckoslovakia modified the rolling-lock breech system of the German MP-40 (also used, we are told, in the P-5) to a semi-auto Military pistol; the CZ-52 chambered for the .30 TOK, also known as the 7.62 X 25MM.

Well, no. The MP40 is straight blowback. The Stecke-lock roller locking of the CZ52 is more akin to that found on the German MG42 and developmental Stg-45 assault rifle designs, said to be German developments of prototypes taken during the invasions of Poland and Czechoslovokia.

The German Walther P5 pistol is a development of the wartime P.38 with a lifting wedge type locking system- though if you meant the H&K MP-5 submachinegun, yes, it does indeed have a roller-locked mechanism.

I recently bought a CZ-52, and it is a well made, interesting pistol. The 7.62X25 is a peppy little round indeed, and apparently can be reloaded with a 55 grain saboted .223" (5.56MM) bullet and stepped up to around (as I recall) around 2,300FPS - not bad for a sidearm!

The 7,62x25 is indeed *peppy*, and offers a very reliably fed cartridge due to its bottlenecked configuration, and very suitable with reloading with bullets of .308 to .311 in diameter, both lead and jacketed...and the 109-grain tracer bullet of the .30 carbine works nicely, too.

One might speculate that simply necking the .30 TOKAREV to 5.56MM might provide similar carachteristics to the 5.7X28MM developed for this new system. I would not be the least bit surprised if that is essentially just what it is.

Pretty close, though there are some questions as to whether to lean toward the light/fast 45-55 grain .224 bullets of the original M16 M193 ball ammunition, or to switch to the 62-grain M855/SS109 style bullet [or heavier] for better penetration. Considerations of barrel twist rate arise, as they have with the 5,7mm MMJ, the .30 carbine cartridge necked to take a .224 bullet. But the Russians have certainly done some work with the 7,62x25mm necked down to 5,45mm, using bullets from everything from the PSM to that of the AK74 Kalishnikov assault rifle.

The .223 Timbs is the result of a co-development between Quality Cartridge and Joseph Timbs. It is the American answer to the proprietary .224 BOZ, bringing the CZ-52 into the new millenium. The .223 Timbs is a special loading of the 7.62x25 round for use only in the CZ-52 pistol. It consists of a sabot like the Remington "Accelerator" pushing a 50gr bullet over 2000fps. Concept was for devastating multi-purpose round, useable for small game, varmits, and defense. Accuracy has proven to be on-par with traditional rounds fired from the same pistol, and terminal ballistics are quite impressive with initial tests showing devastating expansion from the varmit-type bullets.

My old C96 broomhandle serves me well; The CZ 52 and Russian TT-33 Tokarev do as well and can handle MUCH higher pressure loads. And that 71-round drum of Shapagin's PPSh-41 submachinegun offers some interesting possibilitries, too:

Sabot ("Accelerator"*-Type) Loads

50gr SXSP (Hornady) $35.97