Armed stake-out for big cats (in Wales)

BBC ^ | Tuesday, 7 January, 2003, 22:03 GMT

[gd124]

It would be good if ligers could mate with ligers producing fertile offspring - that would be interesting

[Rollee]

Sick, and typical of a socialist government. Don't allow the peons to defend themselves.

[Rollee]

Some of those look prehistoric. The "liger" is freaking me completely out. Thanks for the pictures, they're monsters, and they're fascinating.

[PsyOp]

I think I'd have to agree with you on the Puma being the most likely culprit. I've had my own run in with them in the Santa Cruz mountains. In fact, I came face to face with one less than a mile from where I lived.

I attended Santa Cruz High in the last half of the 70's (class of 80). The high school is nestled in a canyon. The thickly forested hills on three sides are criss-crossed with fire roads and trails. I used to hike them a lot as I lived near the school. In the summer, I would go up there and practice with my black-powder firearms.

One day I was on my way up to where I liked to shoot (an old stagnant pond). As I was walking up the fire-road to the pond a Puma dropped down into the road in front of me, from the uphill side. Don't know if it was a he or she, but it was quite large for a puma, and I guessed it weighed in the 400lb range.

So anyway, I'm standing there having a staring contest with a Puma about 20 feet in front of me. I have two fully loaded .44 caliber black powder revolvers on my hips. Both absolutely worthless, I was sure, as I wondered if I could skin leather and bust a cap before the cat was all over me. Fortunately, the cat decided I was not threat and continued on it's way after about 30 seconds of sizing me up (it seemed like a good hour to me at the time).

For over a year I had been seeing tracks up there, but everyone said that Mountain Lion were long gone from that part of California. Even though I had identified the tracks people refused to believe it. Years later I was not as surprised as everyone else seemed to be when mountain lion attacks started occuring in the mountains east of LA (remember the female jogger who became kitty-chow).

There were plenty of deer and and feral cats and dogs for them to feed on in the Santa Cruz mountains. That, and the lack of hunting, seems to have made them unafraid of people.

Even with a pair of revolvers, that cat scared the hell out of me. Though on reflection, if I hadn't had them, I may have been compelled to run which could have been fatal. So who knows.

BTW, when I was in the Army one of my friends had been stationed in Alaska and had hunted bear. He told me that the rangers there carried shot guns or large caliber pistols (.44 revolvers) loaded with snake shot in case they had to defend against bears. It was not meant to kill, but if charged, they would shoot the bear in the face, blinding them and damaging their sensitive noses - which would cause the bear such pain it would forget about trying to kill you long enough for you to get moving. I imagine that might work with a big cat as well. Most things tend to lose their fight when shot in the face.

[HiTech RedNeck]

LIGER(male lion plus tigress, and due to getting the best of both species certain specimens have reached over 12 feet standing on their hind legs, and can weigh up to 1000 pounds ....for comparison an average African lion weighs aroung half that)

That particular "liger" looks like a photoshop job. What a hoot, tiger from the armpits back and lion the rest of the way.

[afraidfortherepublic]

Are you serious? That is the most fascinating post I've read in a long time. Reading your bio, I think you must be serious; but I'm speechless at the thought of you gamboling about the jungle evading big cats!

[Fiddlstix]

Gweld cath fawr eto yn ardal Llangadog

I keep saying that I really must learn Gallic someday

[kako]

The whole issue of the British big cats is a fascinating one.

Me too. There have always been lots of credible stories coming out of Britain about ABC's.

[gd124]

I think you mean Gaelic. Gallic means French! :)

[afraidfortherepublic]

For over a year I had been seeing tracks up there, but everyone said that Mountain Lion were long gone from that part of California.

I once owned a house on wooded acreage that backed up to 1000 acres of state land in Washington north of Seattle. There were trails through the woods in the back. I would go walking out there with my dogs and cats as company. Every time I came to a certain place, the animals would refuse to go any further, no matter how much I encouraged them. The dogs would stop, and one of the cats would scale a tree and meow at me.

I didn't think anything about it until one day I noticed a large paw print in a muddy area where there was a trickle of a natural spring. The paw print was as large as my hand -- much larger than my Golden Retriever could make. I avoided walking there unless I had better company with me than the house pets. My husband said I was nuts; the print was big just because it was muddy.

We moved away and the County bought the house and land to serve as an entrance to the State land which they subsequently converted into a wilderness park. You can imagine my chagrin when I visited my former homestead several years later and found posted warnings from the County: "BEWARE of PANTHERS when walking on these trails!"

[Fiddlstix]

I think you mean Gaelic. Gallic means French! :)

LOL! See I said I needed to learn more.
(I can't even spell it right)
P.S. Thanks for the correction J

[HiTech RedNeck]

This looks like typing on a Dvorak keyboard with the fingering for a QWERTY, or something bizarre like that.

English translation???

[VRWC For Truth]

What would high powered torches do? Blind the animal? How goofy.

Torch is the Kings English word for flashlight, in this case a spot light.

[Consort]

I'm learning to use garlic.

[gd124]

It comes from the BBC website and is the Welsh version of this article. I don't think it is a direct translation, because there are names in the Welsh one which aren't in the English one.

[spectr17]

Don't know if it was a he or she, but it was quite large for a puma, and I guessed it weighed in the 400lb range.

Heaviest cougars I've seen on record have been just over 200 lbs. I doubt the cat you saw was anywhere near 400 lbs. People tend to overestimate the weight of cougars and bears.

[spetznaz]

Hi,

It was not really a 'skip-and-jump' through the jungle avoiding big cats. Doing that would be an easy way of commiting suicide. And i may be many things but suicidal is not one of them (LOL).

It is just me and some chums in my school would go to the national parks for a weekend (to the game lodges), and being schoolkids we would sneak ut at night on dares that i have to say (in hindsight) were some of the most stupid things we have done.

And the greatest threat was not the big cats but the animal that kills the most people in Africa every year. The Hippopotamus!

Most people think Hippos are the fat lazy oafs of the animal world but in reality they are probably the greatest danger you can face in the African bush! The reason for the danger is as follows: Hippos come out from the lakes and rivers at night to feed on vegetation on land (they are herbivores) and can travel miles inland. They are basically huge gentle creatures, and as i said before they are herbivores. However the danger lies in the fact that they hate noise, and will attack any creature that makes noise (or that comes between them and the path to the river).

Now, looking at a hippo it is easy to assume that they are slow and consequently easy to outrun! However the truth of the matter is that the size of the hippo belies the fact that it is extremely fast! The name 'hippopotamus' is Greek for 'river-horse' and those darn hippos can run faster than a horse ....literally! There is absolutely no way to run away from a charging hippopotamus, and seeing those things charging you can give you nightmares for decades!

And hippos have grotesque weapons in the forms of long curved teeth (also called tusks) on their bottom and upper jaws that are extremely sharp. Those teeth are used by the males for territorial battles, and are long and curved (as an aside on the first dayy at the game lodge the operators would pass around specimens of hippo teeth, easily the size of my forearm, to warn guest about taking 'ngihttime romantic walks' without an armed guard). Actually hippos have been known to bite crocs in half, and most of the several hundred people killed by hippos every year in africa are slain when the hippo (which can open its mouth wider than most animals) bites them across the midriff and literally slices them up into three pieces.

That is not an exageration. By three pieces i mean 3!

Anyways me and my chums decided to walk from one game lodge to another (a distance of around 150 feet) Simple, but the fact of the matter was that this was at night, and the hippos were out feeding. We decided to head out en masse (a group of 6 guys) basing that action on the logic that if we stumbled upon a hippo we would run, and because we could not outrun the hippo one of us would not make it ....but because we headed out in a group even thought 1 would be chopped liver at least the other 5 would survive.

In essence our logic was that 'a person had to take one for the team.'

And away we went, huddling together like some scared bunnies. Then we heard a noise! Or i think it was just one person who heard a noise and said to the group 'did you hear that?' Before he had even finished his sentence the other guys had already taken off at a full sprint towards the game lodge, since in our minds the only thing making 'noises' at this time of night was a marauding hippo. Gosh, we tore down at full speed and were halfway there when one person in our group tripped and fell!

The thought that flashed in our minds was 'darnit, hippo already got one person and we are still some distance away from the lodge!' Actually i believe the true thought was 'oh my gosh oh my gosh oh my gosh ......ad infinitum!

Then another guy tumbled over and then we were petrified at the thought maybe more than one beast was on our tails! When we reached the lodge i remember we started shouting as we made the corner 'open the door, open the door' and as a startled guest opened it we just leapt in a flying dive (rugby has its advantages) into the place!

We found out later that there was no hippo chasing us and the two guys who had tripped over had just snagged their feet on some projecting roots. As for the sound it could have been anything from a hooting owl to a fervent imagination!

Anyways hippos are the greatest killer of people in africa , killing more people than other animals combined! After all they can weigh 8,000 pounds, run faster than most horses, make a sound that is an ear splitting 113 decibels, and have a huge maw with fighting tusks!

However i enjoyed that whole trip so much the first thing i am going to do when i visit 'home' is go on an animal adventure (obviously i mean an orthodox adventure meaning i will be in a van with tourists looking at the animals instead of running in groups of 7 trying to use the law of permutation and probability against hippo and leopard attack).

And actually our group was not the craziest! In my school back home i had this close friend who was from switzerland (my school had a lot of europeans) and she was into marijuana (yeah yeah, weed is quite rampant outside the US too. I tried to make her stop smoking to no avail, but that is another story). Anyways she and her friends had come with us to the same gamepark, and she had snuck off with some other girls to smoke some stuff ...and the place they had chosen was a hippo trail (hippo trails are paths used by hippos to walk between the lake and their feeding ground). That was probably the most stupid thing i have ever had of because the last place you want to be at night is a hippo trail (why: because for one you may go -kissy-kissy' with an 8 thousand pound maw of death called a hippo, and secondly other animals like antelopes use the trails to get to drinking water, and that means predators like lions and leopards man the trails to see if they can get some passing antelope). Hence getting stoned there is just darn asinine! Thus i ahve consolation in that although my group did silly things at least we never smoked drugs, and we never tried any stunts on any hippo trail!

And that makes what we did feel much less stupid (although if we told our parents they would probably have shut down our allowances and other pertinent rights).

Anyways here are some pics of hippos. Take care of yourself and God bless.

[Elsie]

I do not have the FULL translation, but Llang means 'cateats'.

[afraidfortherepublic]

The name 'hippopotamus' is Greek for 'river-horse' and those darn hippos can run faster than a horse ....literally! There is absolutely no way to run away from a charging hippopotamus, and seeing those things charging you can give you nightmares for decades!

I did knonw that because I read a series of books by a South African at one time -- Smith (can't remember the first name at the moment). He spent a lot of time in The River God writing about the dangers of the Hippopotumus in Egypt during the days of the Pharohs. They are dangerous in the water too, if you are in a boat. And you're right. It is a surprise to most Americans to learn that they are more dangerous than lions and tigers.

You tell wonderful stories. I see by your home page that you are a Finance major. I certainly hope you never lose your knack for writing just to pursue wealth and fame in the financial field! Thank you for the pictures and memories of your school days, as hair raising as they are!

[PsyOp]

"I've seen on record have been just over 200 lbs."

You could be right on that. I've seen several in zoos, though, and this was Puma, and larger than any I've seen in captivity by a half. I weighed in at 180 in those days and that cat outweighed me for sure.