Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FYI
1 posted on 01/03/2002 3:41:26 AM PST by dtom
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies ]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-2021-25 next last
To: dtom
Forced clerical celibacy simply has to go. It is directly connected to the widespread existence of pedophilia and homosexuality in the priesthood.

Yawn. This has been debunked repeatedly. I notice he doesn't provide any proof.

2 posted on 01/03/2002 3:52:19 AM PST by B Knotts
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: dtom
OK..some doctors commit malpractice.....therefore, let's abolish medicine?
3 posted on 01/03/2002 3:53:27 AM PST by ken5050
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: dtom
FYI

Good to see how someone can take a minority representation of a group and twist it to fit their beliefs. By saying that a priest is a child molester, then forced celibacy is wrong.

First the writer is wrong in saying it is forced celibacy. Men who join the priesthood know about it being celibate before joining. So no one is FORCED to be celibate. Secondly, if someone is being celibate it does not mean they become child molesters.

But based on this rational, then the use of firearms, alchohol, free speach, and other rights/laws should be changed because there is a segment of our society that use firearms to commit crimes, drink and drive and promote hate through speach and print.

The writer if he does not like the view of the papacy should join a protestant group that fits his belief as opposed to twisting the facts and forcing his way on the majority of Roman Catholics. Yes majority, because it was not a majority supporting this, there would have already been another schism in the Roman Catholic Church.
4 posted on 01/03/2002 3:53:39 AM PST by BobWNY
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: patent, Catholic_list
FYI BUMP
5 posted on 01/03/2002 3:54:06 AM PST by B Knotts
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: dtom
This outrage is just another reminder of the serious problem that has grown within the Catholic Church as a result of the imposition of clerical celibacy.

The last statistics I saw on this showed an identical rate of offense between celibate Catholic priests and non-celibate Protestant ministers. Unless Mr. Glazov has some new information, his solution makes no sense.

The fact is that when women are demonized, pathology always emerges. It is so ingrained in many Catholic priests to believe that it would be dirty and evil for them to have sex with a woman, that some of them end up rationalizing that it is less sinful to molest a little boy -- or to have sex with a man.

As a Catholic, Mr. Glazov should know better than this. Women are certainly not demonized in Catholic ideology. If anything, having homosexual dalliances, which Mr. Glazov contends is a celibate priests rationalized release for lustful desires, has been considerably more demonized than heterosexual dalliances since the rule of celibacy began.

7 posted on 01/03/2002 4:01:26 AM PST by Snuffington
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: dtom
Sexual assault is a crime of violence, not a sexual act. Abolishing celibacy in the priesthood will not stop rapists from raping.
9 posted on 01/03/2002 4:03:52 AM PST by Catspaw
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: dtom
Ah. THAT's why the episcopal church has so many lawsuits. And many protestant seminaries have 30-50 percent gay students.

Leftist catholic bashing of course. Notice the "priest" is 79 years old, and therefore one suspects the accusations are 30 years old? Or does he use viagra?

17 posted on 01/03/2002 4:38:23 AM PST by LadyDoc
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: dtom
The mandatory celibacy of priests was instituted by the Church in the 12th Century. Its doctrinal basis is not unquestionable, and a lot of historical evidence points to the fact that, conveniently for the Church, priests without heirs led the Church to amass vast amounts of wealth. The Orthodox, who are in schism and NOT heresy, allow for married clergy. I'm not an expert on canon law, but I don't think the idea is meritless.

That being said, I don't believe that the celibacy rule is "responsible" for this alleged pedophilia epidemic. While there certainly have been many shameful incidents that the Church unwisely hushed-up, this slander against the Catholic clergy is largely media bias, and an example of the only sanctioned religious bigotry allowed in our society.

18 posted on 01/03/2002 4:40:38 AM PST by LN2Campy
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: dtom
Forced clerical celibacy simply has to go.

Forced? As far as I know, the Catholic Church does not draft men into the priesthood - it is voluntary and everyone knows what is required.

22 posted on 01/03/2002 4:56:09 AM PST by Mannaggia l'America
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: dtom
Apparently, he hasn't quite made it over to the conservative side as regards faith. Oh well…

On a brighter note, my wife and I had the pleasure of entertaining one of our priests and female religious last night for dinner. In the course of table talk, Father Anderson was explaining to Sister that he was being transferred to the Chicago Archdiocese within a week, and that he woule really miss the RCIA class.

Seems there's a couple in RCIA which Father has given to our resident seminarian for sponsorship. They were atheist/agnostic, until she gave birth to their child. Seems the pregnancy was particularly trying, and she coded three times. The doctors, however, pulled her through, and now the family is all hunky-dory. This experience gave them both a kick in the pants. Call it divine inspiration, intervention, or a happy coincidence, but it seems they heard 'the call' to reform, as it were. And they just happened to be in, you guessed it, a Catholic hospital.

So they're getting special treatment, since no one they know is RC, neither of them is, or was, RC and none of their immediate family is RC. But they're gonna be, come Easter...

I look forward to meeting them.

27 posted on 01/03/2002 5:18:12 AM PST by Mr. Thorne
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: dtom
I believe the Roman Catholic doctrine of clerical celibacy is a mistake, but it is their church and they have every right to run things as they see fit. Further, I've met a few Protestant ministers and a couple rabbis who I wouldn't trust to be alone with my daughters or my son.
29 posted on 01/03/2002 5:20:53 AM PST by katana
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: dtom
This author is both obsessed with sex and notorious for playing fast and loose with the facts. In his polemic on female circumsion he handily omitted the fact that the custom predates Islam, is practised by members of all relgious groups in East Africa, including Christians, and is not practised at all by Muslims in most parts of of Asia.

Here he somehow connects the sexual abuse of children with the lack of a marital sex life. Sorry. Any cop can tell you there is no such connection. Heck, the Dallas Cowboys had a player who molested a little girl while he was married to Joey Heatherton - one of the hottest TV babes of the go-go era.

32 posted on 01/03/2002 5:36:28 AM PST by The Iron Duke
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: dtom
I am a Catholic.

One of Dr. Glazov's many lies.

34 posted on 01/03/2002 5:45:43 AM PST by TankerKC
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: dtom
Glazov is right about this. He's one of the few conservatives I've read who are willing to come out and address very difficult issues. He was right about the sexual pathology of jihadist Islam; right about the horrors of female genital mutilation in Islamic countries, and he's also right about this.

Celibacy is not a dogmatic *mandate* of Catholicism. It is a *disciplinary practice* which can change. The Orthodox have always had a tradition of married priests, which goes back to the very beginnings of Christianity itself. In many Protestant denominations, a man *must* be married before he is called by the church's board of elders to be a minister.

Regarding pedophilia, there are two major kinds of pedophilia. There is the kind which is committed by married men against little girls. This type of pedophilia is NOT the most common. The other type, MORE common, is committed by *unmarried* men against boys. A subset of this group preys on boys that are older, i.e. teenagers. A largely-married priesthood combined with better screening for homosexual pedophilia would reduce the numbers of these men in the Catholic priesthood.

Western Catholics need to face the fact that the numbers of men going into the priesthood are very, very small, even when you include "conservative" orders like the Legionaries of Christ, Opus Dei, and the Priestly Fraternity of St. Peter. In my opinion, not only should the priesthood be opened to men who are married, but married permanent deacons should be considered for ordination as priests if they want it. Also, those men who left the priesthood over marriage should be invited to return and their marriages regularized (as long as they're not married to a divorced person w/o an annulment.) This would provide a large jump in the number of active priests in the West.

37 posted on 01/03/2002 7:06:13 AM PST by ikanakattara
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: Orual
Bon appetit.
41 posted on 01/03/2002 7:26:49 AM PST by dighton
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: dtom; JMJ333; proud2bRC
Forced clerical celibacy simply has to go. It is directly connected to the widespread existence of pedophilia and homosexuality in the priesthood.

The best way to challenge something is to make a broad statement that is totally unsupported by any facts and then base your argument on that broad statement. By the time people are finished with your argument, they forget that you never supported your underlying thesis.

I am not Roman Catholic and I'm not sure the Bible mandates celibacy for the priesthood. But, considering the large number of priests and the very small number of ordained pedophiles I am sure there is no basis in the above assertion. I have never heard that the ratio of pedophile priests is higher than the ratio of pedophiles in general. But to accept this author's point, you would need to believe it was. I am sure that a pedophile priest is more newsworthy than a pedophile in general so it can seem that becoming a priest makes one a pedophile.

Of course, we're also not evaluating how many priests engage in illicit adult heterosexual activity. That's because the author has an axe to grind.

If the Catholic church needs to take action, it needs to do a better job of protecting its boys from the few priests who do fall in this manner. It also needs to provide better help to the priests who believe they are falling - to let them know they can request help without fear of reprisal and receive the full forgiveness of Jesus so they can get on with their lives.

Of course, the Church needs to make sure she believes the requirement for celibate priests comes from G-d. But if she is sure, then she needs to stand by what G-d has said no matter what idiots like this author believe.

Shalom.

42 posted on 01/03/2002 7:33:00 AM PST by ArGee
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: dtom
What a terrible arguement for a good position. Clerical celibacy should go but not for any reason that has anything to do with child molestation. I was born in a family that was leaving the Catholic church, and clerical celibacy was one of the reasons, as my mom regularly put it: how can someone who avoids the bond of romantic love, someone that has never and will never enter into the relationship of marriage, someone that will never rear children, how can this person give any useful advice to his parishioners on the problems that are most common in their life (ie problems with the marriage and kids)?

And, of course, the answer to her question is that they can't. Sure they can quote the Bible. They can tell you how the Church interprets the passage, how they themselves interpret the passage. But good advice is a sharing of experience and as long as clerical celibacy is the rule Catholic clerics will not be able to give good advice on most of the problems people face.

46 posted on 01/03/2002 7:40:41 AM PST by discostu
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: dtom
What a terrible arguement for a good position. Clerical celibacy should go but not for any reason that has anything to do with child molestation. I was born in a family that was leaving the Catholic church, and clerical celibacy was one of the reasons, as my mom regularly put it: how can someone who avoids the bond of romantic love, someone that has never and will never enter into the relationship of marriage, someone that will never rear children, how can this person give any useful advice to his parishioners on the problems that are most common in their life (ie problems with the marriage and kids)?

And, of course, the answer to her question is that they can't. Sure they can quote the Bible. They can tell you how the Church interprets the passage, how they themselves interpret the passage. But good advice is a sharing of experience and as long as clerical celibacy is the rule Catholic clerics will not be able to give good advice on most of the problems people face.

47 posted on 01/03/2002 7:41:52 AM PST by discostu
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: dtom
Jamie Glazov holds a Ph.D. in History with a specialty in Soviet Studies. He is the author of 15 Tips on How to be a Good Leftist. Born in the U.S.S.R., Jamie is the son of prominent Soviet dissidents, and now resides in Vancouver, Canada. He writes the Dr. Progressive advice column for angst-ridden leftists at EnterStageRight.com. E-mail him at jglazov@home.com.

Oh yeah, let's follow what this guy has to say. Commie bastard.

59 posted on 01/03/2002 9:07:56 AM PST by hattend
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]

To: dtom
"Time to Abolish Clerical Celibacy"

I do clerical work in addition to my job as a court reporter.

Nobody told me about enforced celibacy. Who's going to come and arrest me, the Spanish Inquisition?

8')

67 posted on 01/03/2002 9:31:56 AM PST by BlueLancer
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies ]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-2021-25 next last

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson