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To: Jonty30
It's not like 1962 at all ya moron.

In 1962 the Soviets parked nukes within spitting distance of the USA during a period of high tension and with wars being fought between Communism and the Free World. Since Medvedev came to power, Russia has been constantly menacing eastern Europe for no good reason and we know the Polish warned Ukraine and Georgia FIFTEEN YEARS AGO that Putin and Medvedev had invasion plans for them. In fact Russia has been waging a cyber war against NATO countries for close to two decades with a pathetic refrain of "Yeah but yeah but we mustn't poke the bear!" as an excuse for doing absolutely nothing about it.

History lesson. In 1962 the Soviets parked nukes within spitting distance of the USA during a period of war. That was provocative. From 1993 to 1999, Russia repeatedly agreed that the Cold War is over and the USSR no longer exists and it had no problem with eastern Europe joining EU-NATO; likewise the West repeatedly said the Cold War is over and the USSR is no longer a threat BECAUSE it no longer exists.

There was no reason AT ALL for pre-Putin Russia to feel threatened by NATO expansion, and Putin even knew that NATO was far more worried about ISLAMOFASCISM than Russia.

But along came Dugin, Putin and Medvedev, the triumvirate peddlers of a romantic myth projected out of their contrived butthurt over the sheer fact the Soviet Union collapsed in the first place.

They're the ones doing the provoking, not us - but they're blaming us for their obsession with a Russian empire that even at the height of Stalin's purges never really existed outside their own heads.

You do know that literally every excuse Putin's raised for this war is bullshit, right? Even the FSB backed DNR Ombudsman said as much... in December 2020, December 2021 AND in January 2022.

The result of all the collated figures in all the monthly and annual reports collected by Russia's own proxies is shown in the diagram below:

The 2020 source data is included in an annual report, and here it is. (Opens in new window)

2020 ANNUAL REPORT of the Human Rights Ombudsman in the Donetsk People’s Republic

Pertinent pages are 20-25, so the above link jumps to page 20.
Excerpts from page 21:

     Comparative diagram representing death toll, as of 1 December 2020

     It is worth noting that the signing of peace agreements helped
     to reduce the intensity of hostilities. Thus, the number of deaths
     among the residents of the Donetsk People's Republic decreased by 
     9 times in 2017 compared to 2014, in 2019 – almost by 17 times, 
     in 2020 – by 50 times...

     At the same time, a decrease in casualties among the civilian 
     population was facilitated by the unlimited truce announced in 
     Donbass on 21 July 2019.

     Since 1 January 2020, as a result of the armed conflict in the 
     territory of the Donetsk People's Republic, 44 people have been 
     killed (Diagram 6).

The 2021 data that should've gone into another annual summary PDF was so unfavorable to Russian propaganda that it was left obfuscated inside the monthly reports, never making it into an annual summary.

Example 1: Dec 2021 monthly report | ombudsman-dnr.ru

     The overview of the current social and humanitarian situation 
     in the territory of the Donetsk People`s Republic as a result of 
     hostilities between 25 and 30 December 2021

     Within the period between 1 January and 30 December 2021, in the 
     territory of the DPR, 129 people sustained injuries ... 
     97 servicemen of the Republic and 32 civilians. 

     Within the period between 1 January and 30 December 2021, in the 
     territory of the DPR, 7 civilians and 70 servicemen of the 
     Republic died ... 

Example 2: Jan 2022 monthly report | ombudsman-dnr.ru

     CASES OF INJURIES AND TRAUMAS OF VARYING SEVERITY AS A RESULT OF 
     ARMED AGGRESSION BY UKRAINE IN THE TERRITORY OF THE DPR FROM 
     JANUARY 01, 2022 TO JANUARY 28, 2022 
     CIVILIANS: 0 
     SERVICEMEN OF THE REPUBLIC: 2 
     IN TOTAL: 2 

     DEATH TOLL AS A RESULT OF ARMED AGGRESSION BY UKRAINE IN THE 
     TERRITORY OF THE DPR FROM JANUARY  01, 2022 TO JANUARY 21, 2022 
     CIVILIANS: 0
     SERVICEMEN: 1 

There's no equivalent data summarised in the Feb 2022 monthly report because the DNR didn't want to advertise the difference between the single digit deaths in that month pre-invasion and the multi-digit numbers after it. Doing so would've conclusively proved that the invasion on a "genocide" pretext was a false flag. But you can forensically gather their metrics by reading subsequent articles, add the numbers up, and see that from December 2019 to mid-Feb 2022, there was no genocide in the Donbas. None at all. All Putin had was a "Minority Report" allegation from Pushilin to the effect of, a genocide was imminent - an allegation that has ZERO evidence to support it.

195 posted on 11/21/2023 9:48:56 AM PST by MalPearce ("You see, but you do not observe" - Holmes to Watson, A Scandal in Bohemia)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 167 | View Replies ]


To: MalPearce

Putin did what he did in response to what we did.
If we have a right to object militarily what we view as threats to our exists, so does he.

Our military hardware around Russia is no different than his military hardware around us.


197 posted on 11/21/2023 12:51:44 PM PST by Jonty30 (It turns out that I did not buy my cell phone for all the calls I might be missing at home.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 195 | View Replies ]

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