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John Calhoun's Mouse Utopia Experiment
The Physics of Life ^ | no date | Jan Kuban

Posted on 12/07/2022 1:56:17 PM PST by packagingguy

In July 1968 four pairs of mice were introduced into the Utopian universe. The universe was a 9-foot (2.7 m) square metal pen with 54-inch-high (1.4 m) sides. Each side had four groups of four vertical, wire mesh "tunnels". The "tunnels" gave access to nesting boxes, food hoppers, and water dispensers. There was no shortage of food or water or nesting material. There were no predators. The only adversity was the limit on space.

Initially the population grew rapidly, doubling every 55 days. The population reached 620 by day 315, after which the population growth dropped markedly. The last surviving birth was on day 600. This period between day 315 and day 600 saw a breakdown in social structure and in normal social behavior. Among the aberrations in behavior were the following:

1. expulsion of young before weaning was complete, 2. wounding of young, 3. inability of dominant males to maintain the defense of their territory and females, 4. aggressive behavior of females, 5. passivity of non-dominant males with increased attacks on each other which were not defended against.

After day 600, the social breakdown continued and the population declined toward extinction. During this period females ceased to reproduce. Their male counterparts withdrew completely, never engaging in courtship or fighting. They ate, drank, slept, and groomed themselves – all solitary pursuits. Sleek, healthy coats and an absence of scars characterized these males. They were named "the beautiful ones".

(Excerpt) Read more at physicsoflife.pl ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Miscellaneous
KEYWORDS: decadence; extinction; societaldecay; utopia
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In this experiment carried out half a century ago ethologist (one who studies animal behavior) John Calhoun started with eight mice who were housed in ideal conditions with no lack of food or water and absence of predators.

After several generations the mice began to behave differently. There was much more aggression between males, females themselves became more aggressive to their young and eventually stopped successful reproduction and many males simply withdrew.

Lessons on how to be a successful mouse were not transmitted to the young, and often young were cast off before weaning.

Some males called the "beautiful ones" did not fight, constantly engaged in grooming and looked intelligent but actually were quite dumb.

Other males mounted other males or mice who had not reached reproductive age.

Eventually, and long before space was exhausted, the colony collapsed and became extinct. So exhaustion of space and resources did not cause colony collapse.

The experiment was repeated several times with the same result. Even the dominant animals could not survive because the lessons of how to be a successful mouse was not transmitted to them.

Neither could mice be withdrawn from the middle of the experiment and allowed to establish colonies do so. They lacked the knowledge of how to be a successful mouse.

The author concluded:

"The lack of challenges gradually spoils the behaviour of subsequent generations of a population.

This degeneration is inevitable and leads to eventual self-extinction.

Due to the lack of challenges, the extinction of a population is inevitable.

It lasts several generations, but is inexorable."

May these series of experiments be a possible explanation of the befuddling behavior we see in today's society? Might they explain why cities are almost invariably blue but less densely populated areas tend to be red?

Of mice and men, yes, but mice too have complex lives of finding food, avoiding predators, making shelters, acquiring mates and raising young.

1 posted on 12/07/2022 1:56:17 PM PST by packagingguy
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To: packagingguy

Damn! This is going to require a lot of further study. Never heard of this experiment.

THANKS!


2 posted on 12/07/2022 1:59:47 PM PST by Travis McGee (EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com)
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To: Travis McGee

Mouseville, the place for Mr. Jangles. (The Green Mile)


3 posted on 12/07/2022 2:02:10 PM PST by citizen (Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people - John Adams 1798)
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To: Travis McGee

We studied it in high school. One kid wanted to replicate it but our teacher said it would be too cruel. This was back when actual science was taught in Science class.

L


4 posted on 12/07/2022 2:03:01 PM PST by Lurker (Peaceful coexistence with the Left is not possible. Stop pretending that it is.)
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To: Travis McGee

I would think your posted text is from the BBee but it surely seems to be mirroring the emasculating of men the last several generations.

Gov’t run blue cities & States have us on the road to the world of Idiocracy.


5 posted on 12/07/2022 2:07:29 PM PST by citizen (Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people - John Adams 1798)
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To: citizen

Oh, sorry. My post was meant for packingguy.


6 posted on 12/07/2022 2:08:20 PM PST by citizen (Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people - John Adams 1798)
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To: packagingguy

During this time period Americans were being widely taught this experiment and the death spiral of over-population, this followed decades of teaching about the ills of China and India being caused largely by over-population.

White America and Western Civ. embraced this science and quit having babies, remember the new culture of 1.2 children per marriage, or not having children at all?

The 60s was also when the Western and American left changed the immigration laws to colonize the US and Europe with the highly reproductive third world.


7 posted on 12/07/2022 2:09:06 PM PST by ansel12 (NATO warrior under Reagan, and RA under Nixon, bemoaning the pro-Russians from Vietnam to Ukraine.)
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To: packagingguy

Similar to how zoo-raised animals can not survive in the wild.


8 posted on 12/07/2022 2:10:44 PM PST by citizen (Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people - John Adams 1798)
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To: packagingguy

Any relation to the VP?


9 posted on 12/07/2022 2:15:52 PM PST by scrabblehack
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To: packagingguy

1. Only one repetition of the experiment, and taken as infallible “Gospel”.
2. Amazing how this fed into the Malthusian hysteria of its day (complete with hockey stick graph), “The Population Bomb.” It was an experiment that “proved” all of those hysterical in the minds of “science.”
3. Strangely, as I think this notes, we really don’t see this playing out in nature. Predators appear. Fertility declines (as I assume so does mating urges) as resources grow sparse. Diseases emerge. In short, nature takes care of business eventually long before resources go to zero.


10 posted on 12/07/2022 2:22:41 PM PST by TWohlford
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To: ansel12

The link provided explains that the over-population “academic” interpretation was incorrect as argued by the author.

Resources were not exhausted.

The cage was not overcrowded.

The experimenter asserted that it was the lack of challenges that debased the behavior of the mice.

The “official” interpretations (overpopulation) of this experiment by “experts”, and not the experimenter himself, were incorrect.

I’m not saying resources can’t be exhausted or degraded by outside forces to such extent that society collapses (like the drought that brought down the Mayan civilization).

It’s that there is something about too many organisms living in a given space with plenty of freebies that alters their psychology. Lack of challenges seems to be a big part of the puzzle.

Think about it. If you had to subsistence farm, hunt, fish and take care of a wife and kids you would have no time to fool with proper pronouns and such nonsense.

By the way, at least for India, they live in no utopia. They have to get by any way possible. Their lives present challenges. So it’s not overpopulation per se.


11 posted on 12/07/2022 2:24:19 PM PST by packagingguy
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To: Travis McGee
I THOUGHT I had read this sometime in the past, and reading it now proves I DID read it before.

There have been a TON of experiments that have proven invaluable to keep us out of where we are now, but our kids were never educated to know Pavlov's dogs (f'rinstance) and never acquire life saving or enhancing skills like critical thinking.

97% of native born Americans come through the public school system.

Y'wann'a reclaim and save America ?

Toss "the system"

12 posted on 12/07/2022 2:27:01 PM PST by knarf (I say things that are true . . . I have no proof, but they're true.)
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To: TWohlford

Overpopulation was not the problem in this experiment. The cage was not full, there was room, water and food for more animals.

It’s that the animals always got whatever they needed without having to learn to make it on their own.

People other than the original experimenter came to the incorrect conclusions, conclusions they wanted to see and not what was taught by the experiment.


13 posted on 12/07/2022 2:27:29 PM PST by packagingguy
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To: packagingguy
Interesting.

Thanks.

14 posted on 12/07/2022 2:28:09 PM PST by TChad (Progressives are in favor of removing healthy sex organs from children. Conservatives oppose this.)
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To: packagingguy

I wonder if cannibalism was factored into the study.

Marko


15 posted on 12/07/2022 2:30:22 PM PST by markoman (Cautiously cynical)
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To: packagingguy

Some males called the “beautiful ones” did not fight, constantly engaged in grooming and looked intelligent but actually were quite dumb.

We call them “elites”.


16 posted on 12/07/2022 2:31:50 PM PST by Flick Lives (Cui bono)
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To: packagingguy

there have been tribes that have lost their skills to survive notably a tribe near the artic circle who lost the ability to build shelter.


17 posted on 12/07/2022 2:32:40 PM PST by Chickensoup (Genocide is here. Leftist extremists are spearhheading the Genocide against conservatives. )
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To: packagingguy

Communism and Socialism. Proof that it don’t work.


18 posted on 12/07/2022 2:36:13 PM PST by hoagy62 (Evil won...again.)
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To: Lurker

We studied it in high school. One kid wanted to replicate it but our teacher said it would be too cruel. This was back when actual science was taught in Science class.

There were some pretty gnarly experiments done back then including the Milgram Shock (Obedience to Authority) experiment (probably one of the most disturbing about what it says about people).

https://www.simplypsychology.org/milgram.html


19 posted on 12/07/2022 2:36:27 PM PST by Flick Lives (Cui bono)
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To: TWohlford

About the experiment: I worked at a place nicknamed “Mousewitz” when young. The experiment was repeated with the deer mouse Peromyscus leucopus. This is one of North America’s native mice.

The professor I worked for found the same thing. There was no overpopulation with this species. The original experiment was performed on old-world mice, Mus Musculus.

My job was to remove the organs, weigh them, preserve them in formaldehyde and embed them for microscopy.

As I recall the professor thought the problem was overstimulation that resulted in excess stress and withdrawal.

I specifically remember having to remove adrenal glands where the stress hormone cortisol was made.


20 posted on 12/07/2022 2:38:28 PM PST by packagingguy
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