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Proof: Islam could not possibly have originated the way canonical Islamic texts claim [Book]
Jihad Watch ^ | July 3, 2021 | Robert Spencer

Posted on 07/05/2021 2:00:24 AM PDT by Jyotishi

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To: Renfrew

Correct.

I can only imagine the awe that neighbours of Rome felt for Rome. Just like the barbarians surrounding China. They saw this eternal empire that dominated culturally, religiously and economically not to mention militarily.

So they wanted to differentiate themselves from it.

This is probably analogous to the Bulgarian setting up their Autocephalous church when the Bulgarian Tsar was in conflict with the Roman Basileus.

I think if we dial back to 400 AD and see the monophysite controversy, which to me seems like arguing over eating the egg big end up it small end up. The camps fell into
Monophysite: the non Greek parts of the empire, mainly the Egyptians and Armenians. This was a way to differentiate themselves from the Roman’s.

Perhaps this is Lso related to the Khazars embracing Judaism when they were stuck between a Christian Roman empire and a muslim Abbassid caliphate.

Also analogous is https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Safavid_conversion_of_Iran_to_Shia_Islam#:~:text=The%20Safavid%20conversion%20of%20Iran,spiritual%20bastion%20of%20Shia%20Islam.

The Safavid conversion of Iran to Shia Islam was a process that took place roughly over the 16th through 18th centuries and turned Iran (Persia), which previously had a Sunni majority, into the spiritual bastion of Shia Islam

The Safavids created a distinctive Iranian identity once more by embracing Twelver Shiaism.


21 posted on 07/05/2021 11:51:38 AM PDT by Cronos ( )
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To: Renfrew

Pardon me for yapping on, but I’m thinking of more examples where the rulers would encourage a distinct religious belief to distinguish themselves from their neighbours and rivals

1. The Irish and Polish with Catholicism, though this seems to have been first local before the elite hopped on

2. The northern German nations with Lutheranism.

3. Druze, Alawites, even Jews and Parsis.

Religion, culture m language are all intermixed. Change one and you have a nation created, or killed off. The Manchu are dead, assimilated into Han China, the Turks subsumed all the Anatolian nations, the Bulgarian Turkic rulers were subsumed into their slavic subjects just as the Viking Getmanuc Rus were subsumed into their slavic people.

Further east the Kushans, originally Tocharians became absorbed into Indian Indian Hindu culture obtaining a distinct sub caste of kshatriya.


22 posted on 07/05/2021 12:07:05 PM PDT by Cronos ( )
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To: Cronos

Good points.

One of the patterns is that if you are a small power next to a large one you embrace a faith different enough to keep your cultural independence, but similar enough that you can still claim to be coreligionists of the hegemon next door.

One example of this is the Alawites, whose beliefs have next to nothing to do with Islam, but who claim fervently to be a branch of Islam as that allows them to survive in their part of the world.

If the Islamic conquests had stopped upon the death of Mohammed, they would have been a small state next to the strong Byzantine one. The movement may well have adopted a Christian identity to survive.

Instead the Muslim Empire became the most powerful state in the world. It is only at that point that Islam was asserted as a distinct religion superior to all others.


23 posted on 07/05/2021 12:41:25 PM PDT by Renfrew
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To: Noumenon

You mean the Church of Climatology?


24 posted on 07/05/2021 12:52:11 PM PDT by Secret Agent Man (Gone Galt; Not Averse to Going Bronson.)
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To: Secret Agent Man

That’s the one. All genuflect before the Saints Barnum, Hubbard and the Holy Lysenko.


25 posted on 07/05/2021 1:15:34 PM PDT by Noumenon (The Second Amendment exists primarily to deal with those who just won't take no for an answer. KTF)
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To: Cronos

Thanks!


26 posted on 07/05/2021 2:10:10 PM PDT by spirited irish ( )
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To: Jyotishi

Moho was just one of many “magicians” vying for control of trade routes and settlements after the power vacuum that resulted from the decline of Byzantium and Sasanian empires.

Archeological evidence, which we’re not supposed to recognize, shows violence and decline of centralized rule before and during the time of the rise of Islam.


27 posted on 07/05/2021 3:21:56 PM PDT by nicollo (I said no!)
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To: spirited irish; Jyotishi
watch link "In Islam it is the Cardinal sin to leave Islam. This must be punishable by death to protect Islam and Muslims"
28 posted on 07/11/2021 11:00:16 PM PDT by Cronos ( )
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To: Cronos
" hating non-Muslims is an Islamic command. In the words of Koran 60:4, “We [Muslims] renounce you [non-Muslims]. Enmity and hate shall forever reign between us—till you believe in Allah alone.” Such sentiments are to be applied to all non-Muslims—“even if they be their parents, children, siblings, or extended family,” says the Koran (58:22; see also 3:28, 4:89, 4:144, 5:54, 6:40, 9:23). Based on such verses, any number of fatwas, authoritative Islamic decrees from venerable sheikhs, call on Muslims to do things like hate their non-Muslim wives (while “physically” enjoying or benefitting from them) and to hate and be disloyal to the Western nations they reside in.

In short, and as the Islamic State once explained in an unambiguously titled article, “Why We Hate You & Why We Fight You,” “We hate you, first and foremost, because you are disbelievers.”

Read More: https://www.frontpagemag.com/fpm/2021/05/islamic-temper-tantrums-raymond-ibrahim/

29 posted on 07/13/2021 11:25:11 AM PDT by spirited irish ( )
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