Can the radicalization of ‘incels’ be stopped? (“involuntary celibate” Toronto van attack)

Canada Globe and Mail ^ | 26 April 2018 | David Futrelle

[Drew68]

When I learned that the suspect in the Toronto van attack had apparently posted a Facebook message identifying himself as a foot soldier in what he called the “incel rebellion,” I was saddened but not at all surprised. As the keeper of a blog devoted to tracking the culture of misogyny online, I have been watching the “incel” subculture for seven years – and I find its rise in the past several years to be nearly as disturbing as the recent rebirth of the neo-Nazi right.

Incel, as many Canadians have learned this past week, is short for “involuntary celibate,” and is the preferred moniker of a number of mostly young men united by a shared bitterness over their inability to persuade women to sleep with them. They let this fact define their entire lives, and devote much of their time online lashing out at the women who don’t want them – and picking over the supposed flaws in their own appearances that they think render them forever unlovable.

When you combine this sort of anger and self-pity, you often get violence. Four years ago, a man named Elliot Rodger murdered six in Isla Vista, Calif., in an attempt, as he explained in the 137-page manifesto he left behind, to take his “retribution” against women. Incels have embraced “Saint Elliot’” as a martyr and role model – and so, evidently, did Alek Minassian, who hailed “the Supreme Gentleman Elliot Rodger” in his Facebook post.

So is there any way we can prevent more tragedies such as this?

Remarkably, there have been some very patient “normies” – that’s how incels deem average people – who have waded into these hateful spaces in an attempt to convince the obviously damaged incels who inhabit them to seek out the professional help...

[Drew68]

First I ever heard of the "incel" movement. Didn't realize "I can't get laid" had an official name these days.

Many links at the source.

[cardinal4]

Is this a joke?

[Dilbert San Diego]

Yet another officially recognized “disability” or “handicap”?

This thread may get some joking responses. I would just say, that if someone is that obsessed about sex, or lack of sex, in his life, he’s got problems.

So what is the solution? Official prostitution? But would that even solve the problems of such men, because they would be paying for it; the women involved would not be loving them for them?

Something is clearly wrong with such men.

Not to get too graphic, but I think many men here have “struck out” with women we hoped to connect with. These are among life’s disappointments which we all, all of us normal people anyway, learn to cope with and move on with life. If we can’t absorb such disappointments and move on, then again, something is very wrong with such an individual. He needs help before he explodes in a rampage.

[jiggyboy]

Can the radicalization of ‘incels’ be stopped?

Start-up tech companies in China have come up with an unusual way to keep their employees — namely coders, programmers and engineers — happy and relaxed. Officially they’re called “programmer motivators” but they sound more like flirtatious cheerleaders.

Their role is to keep the other, predominantly male employees of the business content by chatting them up and looking after them.

https://nypost.com/2018/04/26/chinese-start-ups-hire-attractive-women-to-motivate-male-coders/

All together now: "If it saves just one life..."

[Wilhelm Tell]

Could it be that some of these “incels” are the ones you hear about that convert to Islam and soon thereafter commit a terrorist act (with the promise of paradise)? I hadn’t heard if the term “incel” either. But maybe some (not all) are radicalized into Islam. That would explain a lot. No normal 20 year old Western male is likely to be enticed with the prospects of martyrdom and the promise of paradise, but it might be just the sort of thing an “incel” might find attractive to channel his energy and hatred.

[thoughtomator]

It IS a joke - made up by shitposters on 4chan or something similar - but the media doesn’t realize it and is running with it like it’s serious.

[Drew68]

Is this a joke?

I honestly don't know.

[beethovenfan]

Why don’t these guys just rent for a night?

[Drew68]

Something is clearly wrong with such men.

For an increasing number of people, the only socialization they do is on-line. They have no friends, no girlfriends, only co-workers. The only sexual release they have is from pornography, the vast amounts of it give them the false impression that making porn is something every woman participates in. In short, they think all women have sex upon request with anyone who asks and for any reason and when these men aren't having sex, they're bewildered and angry.

[Navy Patriot]

Incels?

I think we should create a new Protected Class and immediately apply Affirmative Action to mitigate the problem.

Just think of the fun in determining where in the pecking order of Protected Classes Incel would fall!

If they're more important than Feminists we could make popcorn.

[Pollster1]

They . . . devote much of their time online lashing out at the women who don’t want them – and picking over the supposed flaws in their own appearances that they think render them forever unlovable.

As a man who was at best average in appearance, I can say these losers are morons. In the real world of dating (which I left long ago but still remember well), a man's wallet is far more important than his features, and his personality is at least as important as his wallet. In the real world of dating, I met many exceptionally beautiful women who liked my wallet and who I could not stand to be near even for an evening. As shallow as men and women are made out to be, most of us care about personality in the people we date. Psychopaths who would murder strangers because being an "incel" is lonely are probably not being rejected primarily for their looks; they are being rejected by women who recognize crazy.

[Dilbert San Diego]

So while people focus on the sex aspect of this, it’s part of a larger problem of social isolation of too many people.

[Pikachu_Dad]

They reference a site called incels.me

“Seeing we’re getting attention from many sources, we’d like to clarify some things:

Alek Minassian has never posted on Incels.me.
As far as we are concerned, no one on the forum heard of him before these latest news.

Being incel has no relation whatsoever with violence, aggression, misogyny, or any other negative connotation.

While he may have called himself an incel, he does NOT in any way represent the community. One person does not represent communities, this should be known by now.

Incels.me does NOT allow any kind of discussion of illegal activities. If you see any, report it.

If you don’t understand what the whole Incel thing is about in the first place, please read the Intro to Incel

https://incels.me/threads/intro-to-inceldom.15406/

Our rules:
https://incels.me/threads/rules-terminology-and-faq.799/

Thank you.”

[CtBigPat]

NPR did a segment on this yesterday:

http://www.wbur.org/onpoint/2018/04/27/incels-toronto-van-attack

I'm a nerd who hangs out with other nerds and this is a very real thing. Many of today's kids have grown up in front of video screens and have NO social skills. The feminist movement has created the notion that women are perfect and virtuous and good and if you dare to question that you are a hate filled misogynist. And the internet gives lonely, frustrated men a place to vent their feelings. Get therapy? Good luck with that. If you a a drunk, an addict or gay they have lots of help available. An unattractive guy with poor social skills? You're just a pathetic loser who needs to "man up".

[Pikachu_Dad]

Can they be stopped?

Why yes - feminists must seek them out and sleep with them !

That will stop he movement in its tracks !!!

But create a new one.

A jaillaid group as all the feminists cry ‘rape’

[Pikachu_Dad]

Okay, new strategy for the feminists.

They don’t have to sleep with the guys - just give them each $1,000,000

[Pikachu_Dad]

Here is their definition. It’s a bit long !

“Intro to Inceldom

This is a small guide for newcomers who aren’t sure what the whole incel thing is all about.
If you have any suggestions or further questions feel free to PM a mod.

NOTE: There are many incels with different ideologies. We tried to be as generic as possible, but at the end of the day everyone will have their own answer.

—

What does Incel mean?
Incel means Involuntary Celibate, a person who, if you take the term literally, can’t have sex despite wanting to. In practice this goes beyond simply having sex and enters the realm of having no possibility of finding a partner, either to get validation, love, or acceptance from. Sex is mostly secundary, though just like in every group a minority of incels disagrees.

What is the -cel suffix?
With one L, it’s used to denote different types of incels. You can see terminology for the most common types in the rules.
Copied from there, the most common types are:
Incel: Person who is not in a relationship nor has had sex in a significant amount of time, despite numerous attempts.
Truecel: Type of incel who hasn’t ever had sex or been in a relationship, despite numerous attempts.
Mentalcel: Type of incel whose reason for failure in relationships/sex is related to mental illness or major insecurities.
Volcel: Person who, for various reasons, is abstinent and does not engage in sex.
Fakecel: Person who claims to be incel but has recently had sex or been in a relationship.

Is being an incel just being a virgin? Is sex all you want?
Being incel is more of a status as you are generally unable to escape it, unlike virginity which normal people do during their teens or early adulthood. Sex is part of what incels want, yes, but not as much as they want validation, love, care, and friendship.

Can you be Incel if you have had sex in the past?
The community is highly divided in this respect. Here we assume the answer to be yes to avoid subjectivity, but we expect zero bragging or mention of their experiences from these users. To put an example as to why we allow them, a boy who is forced to have sex at a very young age despite not wanting to, and who grows to be 40 and never have a sexual or romantic experience again despite wanting to, most would agree should be considered incel.

Have you tried to approach girls? Why don’t you just go to an escort otherwise?
Inceldom requires having tried repeatedly to approach females, otherwise a person is considered a mentalcel, someone with insecurities or mental health issues. While some do go to escorts, sex isn’t the main point of inceldom, as stated above.

Is there are minimum required age before you can claim you are incel?
Most say yes, as you are otherwise still young and with opportunities to find love or have sex. Virtually no one would say that a 12 year old can be incel. However, there is no consensus on the exact age at which one can claim inceldom: 16, 18, 21, the exact age varies.

Would therapy help?
While therapy is a valid source of help for many people, it is not a catch-all solution for every problem, especially one that is most of the time radicalized in the appearance of the person. A great personality and a positive attitude won’t give you any chances to get a relationship if your self-esteem is crushed and you are naturally unattractive. Most of all, it is an overused platitude that assumes incels are ignorant of its existence.

Can females be incel? Can gay people?
It’s vastly easier for a female to get validation and sex than a male in today’s society. Unless a female belongs to the bottom percentile in terms of appearance, it’s going to be very hard for them not to be able to find many suitors for any kind of romantic/sexual activity.
While not discussed as often, it is believed homosexual men have it easier than heterosexual men. For a good example of why, try changing your preferences on Tinder to men if you are one yourself and see how many matches you get.

I’ve heard about Incels encouraging violence or hatred of women, is that true?
Inceldom has no relation with violence, misogyny, or illegal activities of any kind.
Every once in a while when a tragedy happens, the term incel is thrown around and we get an influx of guests. We do not advocate any illegal activity, nor we allow it on the site.

Is being incel caused by your personality?
It is a common mistake to assume that incels intrinsically have terrible personalities, most have a normal life (study, work, have friends and hobbies) and are just another member of the community. If you believe Incels here have a bad personality, you should remember this is a place to vent and discuss the problems we face without being censored.

What do you think would improve your situation?
The sad truth is that for many there is no permanent solution. Some consider surgery a way out, some that having sex for the first time would help. Most of all, having a serious partner who provided love would be ideal.

Do you have anything to do with TRP and/or MGTOW?
No, but although our ideals point in different directions we certainly do find intersections at times. They might be the closest to incels in terms of ideology.

Who’s Chad?
Chad is what incels are not: Charismatic, tall, good-looking, confident, muscular. He can be perceived as good or bad. It’s a meme mostly.

What is the Blackpill/Redpill/Bluepill?
Based on the movie “The Matrix”, where Morpheus offers Neo one of two pills: A red and blue one.
The Redpill is an ideology based on trying to win the game that is seduction and interactions in general, implying there are a set of rules and methods that one can use to maximize their odds, almost methodically with enough practice.
The Blackpill is the ideology that the game is rigged from the start, that being attractive is far more important than personality or techniques. It can be extended to the idea that there is little to no benefit in playing at all if you were dealt a bad hand in terms of appearance.
The Bluepill is what the red and black aren’t; the ideology that “what’s inside” is what counts, and that being yourself is the best way to conduct yourself in life.”

[cardinal4]

Why yes - feminists must seek them out and sleep with them !

Hmmm, Im not sure about that, have you seen some of these feminists?

[BenLurkin]

Losers.

[Harmless Teddy Bear]

So what is the solution?

How about we stop teaching children that sex is the be all and end all of life?

Starting in kindergarten the teachers push sex on the children like it was jelly beans. There is almost nothing they do not manage to work sex into.

Books for children and "young adults" are about nothing but sex, so are TV shows. Sex is the center of the world and getting laid is the ultimate must do.

What you eat, what hobbies you have, what you wear and where you go is all build about being sexy so you can have a, on average, ten minute physical encounter with someone you will hopefully never see again.

In what sane world does this make sense?