Skip to comments.The Great DHS Ammunition Stockpile Myth
Posted on 04/05/2013 6:42:29 AM PDT by Sir Napsalot
There are dozens of articles hyping government purchases of ammunition over the last nine months. After spending weeks researching this topic, this is a collection of commonly held myths that are based more on panic than fact.
With the recent release of a letter from the Department of Homeland Security to Senator Coburn, the numbers we calculated independently seem to corroborate the narrative coming from DHS. The concerns surrounding DHS stockpiling ammunition are nothing but more fear-mongering and largely unwarranted. For once, here are the facts to set the record straight:
MYTH: DHS purchased 750 million rounds of several different types of ammunition in August 2012.
FACT: The DHS contract never stated 750 million rounds at any time. It is a five year contract with a maximum purchase of 70 million rounds over the life of the contract. Military Times recently addressed this issue as well.
MYTH: DHS purchased an unprecedented 450 million rounds of .40 S&W 180gr hollow point bullets in 2012.
FACT: This is a standard five year contract that follows a historical purchasing pattern of DHS. Furthermore, it is not an unprecedented purchase by DHS. In fact, it is not even a purchase by DHS but by Immigrations and Customs Enforcement (ICE).
Starting in 2003, orders of 50 million and 225 million .40 S&W hollow point ammunition totaling 275 million rounds were purchased. After the expiration of the five year contracts in 2008, ICE purchased an additional 575 million rounds of .40 S&W hollow point ammunition with two separate orders (200 million and 375 million). Now, with the expiration of the 2008 contract, ICE has ordered a maximum of 450 million rounds over the next five years.
(Excerpt) Read more at breitbart.com ...
Who you gonna’ believe?
Your own lyin’ eyes and ears or the people who burned down the Branch Davidian compound and used Army tanks to murder 82 men, women and children?
But remember, they did it “to save the children”.
Go to gunbroker.com ... you can get ANY ammo you want. Caliber, manufacturer, specific grain, etc.
The only place I know of that has any ammunition for sale around here, are the shooting ranges. They seem to have all popular calibers in stock...but who would pay $30 for 20rds of .30M1? The manufacturers don’t even package them in boxes of 50rds anymore for handguns.
LISLE, Ill., Jan. 10, 2011 /PRNewswire/ -- Navistar Defense, LLC received a $880 million delivery order today to upgrade 2,717 International® MaxxPro® Mine Resistant Ambush Protected (MRAP) vehicles. The order from the U.S. Marine Corps System Command calls for MaxxPro units to be upgraded with the company's rolling chassis solution. The award also includes engineering changes, supplies and services.
Work will begin at the company's West Point, Miss., assembly facility in January 2012 and is scheduled for completion in October 2013.
>>> Who you gonna believe?
I think you are right on and hit a nerve here.
That's probably why you aren't a manufacturer and I assume, don't own or operate any large manufacturing business. Large quantity contracts are a gold mine for these companies. Let's say you are going to make 100 million widgets. You can sell 100 million widgets, 100 at a time to 1 million customers at .10c each or would you sell all 100 million at one time at .09c (even if the customer doesn't take delivery of the order for but 10% of them, as long as they pay). Selling to 100 customers is an exponential increase in the costs associated with that process, sales, accounting, shipping, warehousing, etc. A single customer reduces the expenses in those areas drastically. I can't think of a single industry that doesn't give a decent discount for bulk orders specifically for this reason. A discount on the cost results in a much greater expense savings.
And don't forget, you are dealing with the government who probably isn't getting a whole lot of a discount and is probably paying up front for supplies they don't even take delivery on. They are that dumb.
Someone needs to be held accountable for getting the facts of the story wrong by an order of magnitude? Who was it? Where did the billion number come from?
You can't just plop this meme out there and not tell us who is responsible. This is a badly written piece.
So you are saying this actually COST the government, not saved the tax payers big bucks?
(even if the customer doesn't take delivery of the order for but 10% of them, as long as they pay).
Ammunition shortage fueled by rumor, fear [JUMP]Gun owners blame government, hoard bullets Gun owners blame government, hoard bullets
Posted April 4, 2013 at 11:02 p.m.
Why would the Government be buying .45 Long Colt cartridges? The others seem a little strange, but .45LC is beyond strange.
The government IS that stupid, yep. They operate on the 'saved or created' and 'cutting 2% in a 15% rate of growth' is a serious budget cut. So yes, I'm sure a serious financial auditor would find it probably cost taxpayers far more than it should have and certainly didn't save money.
The government, especially this administration, operates a budget like my wife. If she sees a purse that normally costs $900 and she gets it for $500, she will swear up and down she earned us $400 because she 'could' have spent $900.
Where are the vehicles now? How many have been completed and delivered? In whose hands? Who paid for it?
Sec Napolitano denied DHS purchasing them or refused to answer the question.
Probably some dumb government pencil pusher who was told to buy .40 and checked every box that started with .4
Sure, first, remember you are dealing with the government which is full of government employees (ie idiots). Second, if the goal is just to bottleneck the system, all they need to do is tie up the supply chain. Third, why store them yourselves when you can make the manufacturer store them for you to be on ready to deliver when you need it?
I can't think of a single industry that doesn't give a decent discount for bulk orders specifically for this reason.
According to this article under the supposed contract the customer in this case may actually buy hardly any widgets.
only guaranteeing to purchase as little as 1,000 or 100,000 rounds per year.
Right, but again, we are dealing with the government here, idiots but with a long track history. Historically they have been the largest purchaser so they will get you greater orders than the average Joe. Second, the government is idiots. I wouldn't put it past them, as it has happened in the past, where they actually pay for 100 million but only take delivery of 1 million. The manufacturer gets the money. The government is that stupid.
FWIW, I took an Army ROTC-sponsored Marksmanship in college as part of fulfilling the PE requirements.
We used bolt action .22s sans the magazine. That is, if you weren't careful in loading a round, it fell through...
I seem to remember that for the entire 1/2 semester course, I might have fired maybe 25 rounds, total.
Oh, and it was at the National Guard indoor range next town over.
You missed the point. DHS is now saying the reason for contracting such a large amount of ammo is to get a discounted price. If they are not taking delivery of that amount of ammo they won’t get the discount so they are LYING!!
Looking for him to dispel the “myth” about 30,000 drones that will soon fly over our skies.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.