Posted on 06/14/2009 10:54:24 AM PDT by yetidog
I am generally reluctant to argue politics with friends or acquaintances in social settings, but was pushed to it last night at my daughter’s house…and probably lost the friendship of more than one or two people who observed the whole thing and were disturbed by the intensity and mean-spirited content of the comments I directed to my liberal adversary
1. Don’t avoid the arguments. I used to, but the times in which we live, the malignant character of American governmental leadership and the irresponsibility of the American media demands confrontation with liberal ideologues who may be “friends” , coworkers or relatives etc. No longer will I be an agreeable conversationalist and consensus-seeker on matters political, but a forceful advocate of conservative fact and opinion who has absolutely no problem denigrating and ridiculing the point of view of others when I know it to false, ill-informed or indicative of liberal group think (i.e. Bush Derangement Syndrome or BDS).
2. In framing your arguments, don’t bother to defend conservatism with arguments of smaller government, low taxation and the like; instead, spend your energy attacking liberalism using sarcasm, ridicule and parody to the fullest extent possible. In response, liberals will usually emote. For example, my adversary last night told me he didn’t need know things, because --in all seriousness-- his heart told him what to think . Emotional rationales often self-embarrass liberals with silly counterpoints.
3. Likewise, lead liberals into the world of fact and they will try to follow…very unsuccessfully. Learn some (not all) relevant facts (and their origins) and use them judiciously and only when they substantiate a point that you have raised. Contrawise, always ask a liberal for facts and they will generally be embarrassed by their incapacity to do so in a precise and convincing manner.
4. Bush Derrangement Syndrome should be aggressively faced with moral equivalency and the apt comparison is not the incompetent Jimmy Carter, but Lyndon Johnson, the big-spending liberal Democrat who knowingly took us into a war he manufactured and that resulted in the deaths of 59,000 American soldiers. This is a very credible approach if you are a veteran,-- particularly of the Vietnam era variety --who can speak eloquently to an experience most do not have and with which any detrimental effects of Iraq and Afghanistan pale by comparison. I find bringing up LBJ mutes liberals with BDS as any retort that LBJ is not longer president is obviated by the fact that neither is Bush.
5. Do not be apprehensive that a liberal knows more about politics that you do. This is a mistaken artifact of American education that presupposes liberalism’s intellectual superiority. If you are not familiar with the incidence of Marxist class theory in the social science disciplines of American higher education, you should become so in order to argue eloquently (1) the group-think intellectual poverty of liberalism and (2) an explanation of American voting behavior amongst so the so-called educational class of America.
6. Never accept the argument of Republican “wealth” and by inference greed. Never say, “well I know some wealthy Democrats, too.” Point out big names…Soros, Spielberg, Buffett etc. that have aligned themselves with liberal causes. And the notion that conservatives give more to charity that liberals can also be worked in here as well.
7. Lastly, always conclude with this question of something like it: What circumstance, condition or consequence would have to develop in the United States that might cause you to consider that the election of Obama was one big--- mistake? I find this question compelling on two counts. One, the question will sometimes provoke a response that is part of the conservative narrative. Second Amendment issues come to mind. Secondly, the question may not provoke any response, a situation which makes self-evident the narrow intellectual, conceptual and behavioral parameters of liberal ideology.
Get mean, show your teeth…just don’t get them knocked out.
7 great points, Thanks for the post!
Your post hits close to home.
Had it out with a iberal reletive (by marriage) this week-end.
What was his wifes main complaint?
I was “mean”.
All I did was point out that Obama was not “saving” anyhting or anyone. That his bailouts were paid for and borne by the TAXPAYER - ME and others like me.
The truth is I was too angry and I don't like anger between family members.
“Get mean, show your teeth…”
Reminds me of the end of “I was a Teenage werewolf” when the dad growled at the principal who had been his classmate.
The principal wet his pants! Yes! SHOW YOUR TEETH! Politeness has been thrown out the window by the liberals and we must fight their way.
Your suggestion of sarcasm as a sword and shield is absolutely correct. One of the greatest defenders of free speech in the past 100 years...was Will Rogers. Will could tear apart any political argument with sarcastic wit and cynical charm. The failures of almost every CNN “talker” is because of a absolute lack of sarcastic ability and the total lack of strength on facts.
How can you argue with that total state of denial?
great post, thanks
Lately I have tended to just point out that Democrats are racist in every policy they espouse, and that everything a Democrat advocates is based on theft. Everything. There is no Democrat policy that is not based on taking something away from one person to purchase the loyalty of another person, which destroys the person from whom they steal, and the person to whom the spoils are given. All of this is done at gunpoint, and if you don’t believe me just try not paying your taxes and see how fast the people with guns come knocking at your door.
>>he didn’t need know things, because —in all seriousness— his heart told him what to think
Most arguments with liberals eventually reach this point. You are giving them facts and they are telling you that they “feel” that you are wrong.
When they say that, I say that I “feel” that I am right AND I have verifiable facts. Once our feelings have cancelled each other out, they will just claim that they have “better feelings” or “more humane feelings” or some similar claim to moral superiority.
That’s where you need to have read and understand The Communist Manifesto and The Law. Start comparing what they “feel” to what’s in those two 150 year old books and prove to them that their feelings are consistent with Marx and that it was disproven by Bastiat long before the first communist ever shipped the first counter-revolutionary off to die!
But, sadly, you still won’t win because you are arguing with an insane person. It’s amusing, so enjoy the fun, but their minds are already spoiled.
You can only LAUGH at them.....flagrantly, in front of them...hilariously....and let them try and figure out why you are laughing....
You can only LAUGH at them.....flagrantly, in front of them...hilariously....and let them try and figure out why you are laughing....
We heard that we were ‘mean’ too, when we sponsored a Yes on 8 (Traditional Marriage) booth at the Farmers’ Market. Ohhh, cut to the quick. Well, yes, we were spat upon as well and frothed at. Really got the libbies’ ire up. One guy baited ME, sitting quietly in the background — “Why don’t YOU come up here and argue with me?” “Because??...”
I've never liked the phrase that Rand chose. But I think it's basically that You and people like you ought to pay the costs and bear the burdens of the policies that are put in place by the people who despise you. And you ought to do so willingly -- you are so strong and capable, that it is just "mean" of you to show reluctance in stepping up and doing your patriotic duty of paying taxes.
My daughter is a true believing feminist. She gets nasty and mean. My other three kids are conservatives.
But I’m in a master’s degree class on multiculturalism of all things, where the crap is so thick, my instructor actually enjoys reading a point of view that is diametrically different from dogma. So I’m getting straight hundreds so far.
There’s no set way to argue with a liberal because some of them are misinformed, others are absolutely brainwashed, and you never really know whose mind might open a little bit when exposed to something different. Mostly, it’s pointless.
At some point during the conversation, you will have to decide whether you want to drag this out tooth and nail-- or just back away. Just like at the bar, or when fighting for a parking space, or at the Department Store during the Holidays-- sometimes it's not worth it.
Good post..
Liberalism is a state of denial.
Perpetuating that state is not helpful to them.
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