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To: Dr. Eckleburg; Forest Keeper; Marysecretary; Gamecock; 1000 silverlings; Lord_Calvinus
That's not what the text says. The text says David believes he will "go to him (his son.)" Not "follow him" or "mind-meld with him."

I said follow "in death." If you look up the Hebrew word "halak" its allegorical meaning, among others, is to die.

The Greek expression "poreusomai pros" (in Septuagint) has a nonsepcific meaning to journey at/nearby/to

Either way, the text expresses David's belief that he will "go" to/towards his son, literally or figuratively, wich is subjetc to interpretation.

Do I believe/know that he joined his son literally? I already told you: I don't know. I am not sure the Bible is clear on that. I know that the Bible says David believed he would. It doesn't say he did.

The fact you introduce doubt into this clear passage is troubling. Not for me, but obviously for you.

No need for toruble, the passage is not clear.

Or is heaven just another myth?

There was no heaven in Judaism of David's time, just Shoel. Post Babylonian (Messianic) Judaism speaks of Olam Ha-Ba (the World to Come) or Gan Eden (the Garden of Eden) as a place of spiritual reward for the righteous, butr doesn't go into any details.

Ancient and modern Judaism are very vague what afterlife entails, and allows for a variety of personal opinions, including reincarnation.

Because Judaism is silent on what afterlife is, the concept of (Christiab-like) heaven can also be believed by an Orthodox Jew.

435 posted on 09/06/2008 1:26:30 PM PDT by kosta50 (Eastern Orthodoxy is pure Christianity)
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To: kosta50

“There was no heaven in Judaism of David’s time, just Shoel. Post Babylonian (Messianic) Judaism speaks of Olam Ha-Ba (the World to Come) or Gan Eden (the Garden of Eden) as a place of spiritual reward for the righteous, butr doesn’t go into any details.”

David would have been aware of Jacob’s dream from Genesis and also discusses “ascending the Hill of the Lord” from the 24th Psalm. “and who shall ascend the Hill of the Lord and who shall stand in his Holy place;he that hath clean hands and a pure heart, who hath not lifted up his soul unto vanity nor hath sworn deceitfully. These are the generations that seek thee, that seek thy face, O Jacob...selah”

Genesis 25:11-19
“Jacob left Beersheba, and went toward Haran. He came to the place and stayed there that night, because the sun had set. Taking one of the stones of the place, he put it under his head and lay down in that place to sleep. And he dreamed that there was a ladder set up on the earth, and the top of it reached to heaven; and behold, the angels of God were ascending and descending on it! And behold, the Lord stood above it [or “beside him”] and said, “I am the Lord, the God of Abraham your father and the God of Isaac; the land on which you lie I will give to you and to your descendants; and your descendants shall be like the dust of the earth, and you shall spread abroad to the west and to the east and to the north and to the south; and by you and your descendants shall all the families of the earth bless themselves. Behold, I am with you and will keep you wherever you go, and will bring you back to this land; for I will not leave you until I have done that of which I have spoken to you.” Then Jacob awoke from his sleep and said, “Surely the Lord is in this place; and I did not know it.” And he was afraid, and said, “This is none other than the house of God, and this is the gate of heaven.”

There certainly was a concept of heaven among learned Hebrews, the question was did men actually get to go there. The NT spoke of the factions that believed in the resurrection and those who said there was no resurrection. Of course Christ said he “was the resurrection and the life”. So from the Christian perspective, we understand that there is a Heaven and Christ was going there to prepare a place for us.


504 posted on 09/08/2008 10:10:21 AM PDT by mdmathis6
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