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Posted on 10/12/2007 1:36:12 PM PDT by NYer
.- If the United States presidential race comes down to candidates Rudy Giuliani and Hillary Clinton, the Catholic vote will swing to Clinton. That's the claim of Steve Wagner, a chief political strategist who helped George W. Bush win the majority of Catholics' votes in the 2000 and 2004 elections. He has argued that appealing to Mass-going Catholics is a key factor in a presidential candidate's electoral success.
Deal W. Hudson, of InsideCatholic.com, interviewed Wagner on the prospects of a Giuliani-Clinton match-up and the probable behavior of Catholic voters. According to Hudson's report, Wagner believes Giuliani's candidacy will be hampered by the contradictions between his professed faith and his pro-choice stand: "Kerry was punished for being a pro-abortion Catholic. Giuliani is wise not to talk about being a Catholic, or he will suffer the same fate."
In the absence of a pro-life candidate, Wagner sees economic hardship as a winning issue for Democrats. The housing market, employment, and high gas prices are issues that could benefit Senator Hillary Clinton. "Her message of helping the poor and those in need, in spite of her pro-abortion position, will be quite potent to Catholics when the GOP has nothing else to offer."
Wagner does not view the Iraq War as a pivotal issue in Catholic voters' behavior. "The Catholic discontent with Bush and the Republican Party is not about Iraq, or he would have lost their vote in 2004. It's about their failure to deliver on the promises they made to address the moral decline of our society."
Republicans' ambiguity will prove harmful to their campaign, says Wagner: "It's hard to say what Republicans are about these days. The GOP does not have an issue identity that Catholics are interested in buying into."
I’m not sure there is a Catholic vote anymore. Irish, Italian, German, and Hispanic is the bulk of the American Catholic vote . . . but Irish, Italian and German almost certainly cut Republican and Hispanic almost certainly cuts Democrat. I don’t really think there is a “Catholic vote” if it splits along racial lines.
I won’t waste my vote on either of them. They would only claim a mandate. I will look elsewhere. If you don’t vote for someone you agree with, your position will be unknown. Be counted.
I liked Giuliani as mayor of New York. But character does matter, and that’s where he’s deficient.
Please don’t tell me to be realistic. My entire family, all of my friends are the kind of Catholics that need a good slap upside the head. If Catholics listened to the teachings of our Holy Father instead of the TV/MSM, there really wouldn’t be much to debate. Also, my 15 yr. old Shi Tzu is more of a Roman Catholic that Rudy Guliani is, so his “faith” isn’t even a factor.
I’ve been told that if I don’t vote for the GOP and do so for a third party, my vote is wasted.
Guliani. He’s a Hobson’s Choice if there ever was one, but the Supreme Court is at risk if we don’t. A Hillary high court would essentially end what’s left of this Constitution and the rights and freedoms we have that are slipping away.
Think Canada and jailed pastors or businesses that are fined for living their faith.
Think abortion on demand at any time and the barbaric infanticide at term.
Think of open borders, more so than now and the country accountable to the world court and UN. Bush has let this happen, but it will go faster with her.
I see no difference between the parties, nor do I believe they have the best interests of the people at heart. They are all beholden to money, corporations, and those who pull the strings, but I will not vote for that wicked woman.
Oh, yes. How with 24% Catholics in the country how can we end up with 2 pro-abortion, pro-homosexual-marriage candidates like Hillary and Guilianni. Makes no sense.
In my KofC Council most of the younger guys are very conservative independents or Republicans. The older guys (70 and up) are a mix of GOP and Dem. In the parish the lefty women who are always trying to run the show are generally dems.
As a rule of thumb you can bet that the liberal Catholics are also political libs...in many many cases. I don't think a monolithic Catholic vote exists anymore.
I can tell you one thing...there's no way this Catholic will ever vote for either Rudy or Hillary. Pro abortion liberals are anethma to me whether they are dems or repubs.
I don’t know about the Catholic vote, but he would probably garner a large segment of the Italian-American vote.
So it appears that Catholics like cleavage and not cross dressers.
"The attitudes of the Catholic swing voters appear to be sympathetic to Bush. Only a minority of Catholics support what Wagner calls the "social justice" agenda that values tolerance over courage, and favors an activist national government, race and gender hiring preferences, and multiculturalism."
And, as it turned out, both of Bush's wins were based on two tide-turning trends -- Bush overwhelmingly taking the 25-50 segment of conservative Catholics, and also his 95% prowess in the 100 fastest-growing countys in the US. That was it. Period. End of sentence. Wasn't unmarried single women with child, wasn't the slight uptick in African-American and Latino GOP voters, wasn't soccer moms, or aliens from Mars or Monterrey Mexico -- it was conservative Catholics (who also generously overlapped with the 100 fastest-growing countys).
"The Catholic discontent with Bush and the Republican Party is not about Iraq, or he would have lost their vote in 2004. It's about their failure to deliver on the promises they made to address the moral decline of our society."We won the PDA ban courtesy of Roberts. Period. End of sentence.
Wagner strikes me as a stooper in an endless gutless parade of mercenary DC votes-for-hire weenies who are needlessly obsessed with a Hillary! in charge that ain't gonna happen; and are therefore acting out on purely trivial base emotion. Someone send this pissant an adult diaper.
Catholic vote
Is that like the ones in Mass who elected Kennedy and Kerry
Ditto! I'll visit the 'Right to Life' party's selection or possibly do a write-in vote. Fortunately, we're still more than 1 year from the next presidential election. The slate of candidates is pitiful.
Agreed! He tows the same tired old liberal line as the others. Where is the dark horse candidate who is not afraid to toss his uncompromising pro-life, pro-marriage, pro-Ten Commandments hat in the ring?
I’m not Catholic, but the day I vote for Hillary is the day the sun freezes solid.
Darn.. I totally forgot the sterling quality of Hillary's character.
Your words to their ears! Kudos on an excellent post!
Over the past few months, I have discovered many Catholics who are active in the Democratic party. For years I have been perplexed by what drives these catholic dems and have now gleaned some insight. They are the most generous and giving individuals I have ever met - so why their tenacious grip on a pro-death political party? My read on them is that they do not feel they should impose their faith views on the populace at large. They view themselves as defenders of everyone's right to practice what they believe, even if it is contrary to their faith.
While I don't agree with them, at least I have a clearer understanding of why they subscribe to these political issues.
(BTW - you should consider joining the Catholic ping list. Please freepmail me, if you are interested. )
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