Mars Melt Hints at Solar, Not Human, Cause for Warming, Scientist Says

National Geographic ^ | February 28, 2007 | Kate Ravilious

[palmer]

I doubt that Mars dropped from 1945 to 1975 because there were no particular changes in the sun over that period versus 1900 to 1945 and 1975 to present that would have caused such a drop.

[ricks_place]

PORPOISE ESCAPES EARTH FOR COOLER CLIMATE!

[palmer]

We do btw, have warm and cold cycles every 22 years, every 10 years in fact. They coincide with wet and dry cycles

Your post is interesting but I would like to see more data about it depicting the climate variations to the sunspot variations. If you have such data, please post, I will include it my global warming web page. I do know there is a slight global temperature variation over the 22 year sunspot cycle, but only very slight (doesn't rise above the noise in a Fourier transform).

[ken21]

one of my public libraries just got a new copy of "earth in balance!" by al goron.

i'm one of the few people that read it when it was first published.

it's written in the see-dick-and-jane-style. the thesis of the book is that we children of ma earth have made her sick.

it's such a s-t-u-p-i-d book!

[bmwcyle]

NOOOO, this means we don't need Socialist, Communist rule.

[Nathan Zachary]

"The sun's changes undoubtedly affect both planets in various ways, but there should be no appreciable lag in changes." That's hard to tell, because Mars has a much different atmosphere. Earth is 2/3 or so water, more gases.

[moneyrunner]

Palmer,

Can we agree on a few thing? Can we agree that the sun is a more powerful force than an SUV?

[palmer]

I agree that the sun is a more powerful force than all the SUV's in the world.

[Liberty Wins]

Only one explanation for global warming on Mars. Al's Hollywood friends have built too many 40-room mansions up there and are flying around Mars in all those fuel-wasting private jets.

[Nathan Zachary]

Here's some info on the effects of Cosmic radiation entering Earth's atmosphere. Exploding_Stars_Influence_Climate_Of_Earth

"It is already well-established that when cosmic rays, which are high-speed atomic particles originating in exploded stars far away in the Milky Way, penetrate Earth's atmosphere they produce substantial amounts of ions and release free electrons.

Now, results from the Danish experiment show that the released electrons significantly promote the formation of building blocks for cloud condensation nuclei on which water vapour condenses to make clouds.

Hence, a causal mechanism by which cosmic rays can facilitate the production of clouds in Earth's atmosphere has been experimentally identified for the first time."

Did solar activity drive 20th century global warming?

Little Ice Age (Solar Influence - Temperature)

many other articles

[moneyrunner]

Would you go a step farther and agree that the sun is orders of magnitude more important to global temperatures than all of the human activity ever performed?

[randog]

I doubt that Mars dropped from 1945 to 1975 because there were no particular changes in the sun over that period versus 1900 to 1945 and 1975 to present that would have caused such a drop.

This chart (from Wikipedia) would suggest otherwise:

[ProudFossil]

No, it is because of the two Mars Rovers

[moneyrunner]

Would you also agree that computer models of the climate are inexact and will give virtually any answer you want if you vary the input?

Would you also agree that you can prove virtually anything with a data series by simply moving the beginning and the endpoint?

[palmer]

The sun is orders of magnitude more important than any greenhouse effect and any changes in greenhouse effect that man may have caused. However, the changes in the sun are relatively small compared to changes in other natural and manmade factors. I also believe natural (including solar) are more important than any manmade changes, but I can't quantify how much more important.

[FDNYRHEROES]

If it takes Fuel, Heat, Oxygen and Chain Reaction for fire to exist...where is the sun getting all that oxygen from?

[palmer]

The cosmic ray influence is interesting, unknown and may be important. But the same process cannot occur on Mars because of lack of atmospheric water vapor.

[palmer]

The wikipedia diagram supports my argument. The lack of sunspots helped cause cooling in some way in the 1600's. A relative lack of sunspots from 1900 to 1945 correlated with warming. A relative glut of sunspots in the 1950's correlated with cooling. And there is no global temperature swing every 22 years to correspond to the short term cycle.

So long run, yeah, sunspots have an important influence and can explain some of the warming today. But it would have to be through the cosmic ray modulation effect or something like that which doesn't apply to Mars.

[TYVets]

The sun can not cause global warming because Algore invented the sun.

[ziravan]

This issue and debate has NOTHING to do with the Sun. Or climate in general, for that matter.

As a political debate, green is the new red.

THAT is all you need to know and understand about 'climate change'.

~faith.