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To: OESY; All
I recall you were fervently supportive of the official version of the TW800 disaster, but offered only accusations against those with opposing views and no evidence.

Then your recollection is faulty, or you are being untruthful. But hey, I will offer some of the evidence again, just cause I'm a nice guy and not rude like some folks... or too lazy to look things up myself.

I have posted hundreds of links over the years dismantling the ever-shifting conspiracy theories of people like Jack Cashill (who has made money off the bereaved family members -- that's despicable, isn't it?) and Sanders (who, before he became a convicted felon by his own admission, never had any higher qualification in aviation than: flight attendant. Not a pilot, not an engineer, not an accident investigator. Nope. Male stewardess. He isn't even that now -- what airline would hire a criminal? Instead he's a full-time TWA 800 loon.

Incidentally, all of those negative qualifications (the things he's "not") apply to Cashill, too. (I do not think he is a felon, por a stewardess; however, he isn't a pilot, engineer or accident investigator).

Who are you, what are your qualifications and who are your sources?

Well, I'm not James Sanders: I am not a felon, and I've never sashayed down the aisles of an airliner offering people handi-wipes. I am a pilot. I am an engineer. I have never been an employee of any civilian federal agency (although I was once a schoolteacher working for my own city for a short time) and I have had a long military career on the active and reserve side.

I am a combat veteran of the GWOT and have served in other trouble spots around the world. I've owned an FAA Part 145 repair station, so I've had hands on a lot of airplane parts, even though, unlike Sanders, not the coffee maker. I have written extensively on aviation (many in the field know my byline).

I have been asked to participate in the accident investigation team of an aviation association (I had to decline the duty, based on workload, at the time, but remain interested in the subject). I have an extremely large library of aviation safety and accident investigation material, which I have read and understand in depth, and I have access to the library at a well-regarded aviation-oriented institution where I am a graduate student.

I know many of the luminaries in the aviation world, and in meatworld, they know me. I was there when the X-Prize was won. With a VIP all-access pass that I still have.

I will not post my name on this forum at this time, although a number of the forum regulars know exactly who I am. I am a member of many aviation, technology and engineering associations, which all have venues where professionals can discuss these things professionally.

But it doesn't matter so much "who I am." Because the truth of "what I say" can be determined, whoever I am. The sources I have used for my own education include many available to the public and some that are not, including professional contacts with investigators. I have not had any contact with the FBI side of the investigation and don't even know anyone in the FBI.

However, for the convenience of FReepers, and so that everybody can follow along, I have posted many, many links to support my statements. My links are not to Michael Rivero's hate site, some Loose Change nutball, or internet kooks. I'll give a précis of my case, with links, here. Everything linked in this post is: a public, governmental site; a research publication that is subject to qualified peer review; a disinterested non-profit like the Flight Safety Foundation, or, in some cases, the FAQ of the newsgroup alt.disasters.aviation and archived stories from professional air-safety pubs.

I don't recall noticing any links in Cashill's ever-changing World Nut Daily drivel (He's always trying to massage current events into the latest version of his conspiracy so he can go back and put the touch on the widows and orphans again, hence Sandy Berger as the new bad guy); and while Sanders's book contains such stuff as a chemical analysis of the "red residue" on the material he stole from the site, he doesn't provide a credible explanation of the analysis. (that's available here). [ADA FAQ]

I will say that from my long interest in rockets and space that these chemicals that Sanders "found" are not what goes into rocket engines. And I can say from 25+ years blowing things up that this isn't an explosive compound or explosion product.

The most common myths associated with TWA 800 are:

I'm tired of liars, frauds, and government-haters just repeating the same lies over and over and over again and thinking it makes them true. It doesn't.

For anybody interested in the truth of this accident, do what I did.

  1. Spend a lifetime learning about aviation, military operations, terrorism and counterterrorism. Also, get a good basic education... you don't need calculus but a lot of problems are caused by people who have forgotten (or never learned) high school physics and chemistry. It's hard to communicate with someone who doesn't know what flash point is or what Boyle's Law means, or what the three things you need for a fire or explosion are. Most of Rivero's and Cashill's tinhats don't know and don't care to learn, which is why it's hard to conceal my contempt for them. It's not a guy's fault if he's stupid, but if he's ignorant he sees the responsible person everytime he shaves. Most of the Art Bell crowd are not stupid, so they have no excuse.

  2. Given those tools, learn about the accident at NTSB's TWA 800 pages, especially the exhibits. It will take you about a week to read everything. (I mean, a week, full time, ten hours of reading and study a day). More if you have to hit the books to understand terminology (which even I did a couple times).

    You can speed things up, if you suspect a missile, but jumping to this .pdf. It basically says that there is no path by which a missile could have gotten to where the explosion happened from outside the airplane, without going through structure that doesn't have a hole in it. (See also the stuff in the report -- I can't remember which appendix, sorry -- about micrometeorites, which reaches the same conclusion and of course would apply to a missile also. "They say John was shot through a closed window but there is no bullet hole in the window").

  3. Learn all about the explosion at Cal Tech's Explosion Dynamics Laboratory. Read their Misconceptions page if you read nothing else. Jack Cashill tells a lot of lies about what the laboratory did and why. They don't mention him and the other moonbats by name, but they deal with his nonsense thoroughly.

  4. Read the Alt.Disasters.Aviation FAQ. No, it's not an official source, but it's quite thorough. The part on the eyewitnesses is particularly enlightening (Especially because the whole Sanders/Cashill/Rivero nutball theory is based on misrepresenting the witness statements as a body and cherry-picking the most agreeable to their theory -- in more than one case, from a guy who geometry demonstrates was not in a position to see the mishap).

Finally, consider occam's razor and what it means for this conspiracy theory (well, we'll assume for a minute it was one theory, rather than an ever-mutating nebula of bull puckey) to be true. Hundreds of investigators from a small Babel of different places are all tied into some strange code of omerta whereby they're protecting... what? Clinton? Berger? The Navy? Hez-flippin-bollah? For Christ's sake, the CIA can't keep its secrets out of the New York Times. We're gonna have all the NTSB guys and gals, the FBI g-people, the investigatory parties from Boeing, P&W, the pilots' union ALPA, not to mention the whole dang Navy, all part of some shady conspiracy to conceal... something. And oh yeah, I must be in on it too.

That's it... I'm breaking my vow of silence now. It was the -- gaaaack! Sandy Berger, what are you doing here--? Gaaaack!

d.o.l.

Criminal Number 18F

172 posted on 01/30/2007 9:35:41 PM PST by Criminal Number 18F (Kitchener faced a 'Mahdi Army' too... how'd that work out?)
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To: Criminal Number 18F
I am not a military expert but I've been involved in politics for many moons now and I know BS when I see it. As for your stand against anyone who goes after such twits as Sandy "Paper cut" Burglar, you give yourself away.

As for the Navy shooting down TW800, BULL!!! What is sad but rather humorous about your post, you claim to be a Vet which would lead one to think that would come with maturity but the maturity and articulation is not coming across.

Some of the vets stepping forward and taking the side of the very party (Democrats) that would only spit on the vets, if the spit served their purpose, is suspect at best.

Please give us all a break and toot your little whistle somewhere else....say perhaps the Left wing boards and blogs?
183 posted on 01/31/2007 4:33:19 AM PST by Paige
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To: Criminal Number 18F
Thank you for your response. I was hoping to provoke on this subject. Mission accomplished.

Let's let the reader decide who is rude, accusatory and fervently defending the official version.

I too am a pilot, but to escape your insults about laziness, I shall revisit the websites you linked.

Nevertheless, you have again avoided addressing the chief criticisms of NTSB report and elements of this news article: White House involvement, removal of whistleblower protections by executive order, spill patterns, double explosions, the widely discredited CIA graphic, missing evidence, Iranian claims as retribution, and other obvious flaws in the government's case.

Similarly, I have yet to understand your animosity toward Cashill, Sanders and Rivero. You attack them by innuendo rather than argument. More later.

Meanwhile, I am curious, do you have a comment about this link?:

TWA 800: The Disappearing ANTI-WhistleBlower Executive Order EO-13039

.

189 posted on 01/31/2007 6:49:14 AM PST by OESY
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