Vatican condemns Israel for attacks on Lebanon

reuters ^ | 7/15/06 | reuters

[TheCrusader]

"Not harming civilians is an admirable thing to recommend. Since we can't avoid harming civilians in Iraq, I'd say that statement, along with "not harming the fragile democracy in Lebanon", are largely boilerplate to satisfy public consumption."

But none-the-less, my point is that Bush is calling for Israel to restrain themselves, (and he used those actual words today, Sunday), and no one in FR has a problem with that. But when the Pope called for Israeli restraint yesterday they jumped all over him and the Catholic Church. It's surprising just how many anti-Catholic biggots there are in here.

[Windsong]

I dont think its just Catholics that share that sentiment. Plenty of Protestant believers get the gist as well. Remember that 90% of the Jews in Isreal REJECT Christ as Savior. Is it any wonder why they would reject what the Pope says?

[Windsong]

ea=ae

[Hardshell]

No alcohol, just scripture.... pal.

[zook]

I read through that essay looking for any clue as to what freedom loving people ought to do in response to a totalitarian threat. I could find nothing. I read looking for any clue as to what a nation should do when its enemies attack and seek to destroy it. I found nothing.

What I did find was a lot of talking around the problem. Apparently, the Vatican can offer no moral guidance when it comes to protecting people from tyranny.

[zook]

"Catholic bashing is a spectator sport here at Free Republic"

When the Catholic Church acts like a religious Social Democrat Party, they deserve to be bashed.

[zook]

"Do not try to talk sense to the membership of zion-republic."

Well, at least now we know where *you're* coming from. And now please go back there.

[mockingbyrd]

Apology accepted and appreciated.

[sinkspur]

Where was the Scripture?

[sinkspur]

you shouldn't attempt to deflect valid criticism of Vatican politics by trying to insinuate that such is Catholic bashing.

There was no criticism of Vatican politics. There were cheap shots about clerical abuse and the erroneous impression that the Church did nothing to help the Jews in WWII.

[sinkspur]

you shouldn't attempt to deflect valid criticism of Vatican politics by trying to insinuate that such is Catholic bashing.

There was no criticism of Vatican politics. There were cheap shots about clerical abuse and the erroneous impression that the Church did nothing to help the Jews in WWII.

[mjolnir]

We fall short of the glory of God. It's pretty silly to indict Catholicism itself for bigotry against Jews when pretty much every denomination or church has had similar problems.

For instance, here's Calvin:

A Response To Questions and Objections of a Certain Jew

Their [the Jews] rotten and unbending stiffneckedness deserves that they be oppressed unendingly and without measure or end and that they die in their misery without the pity of anyone.

Excerpt from "Ad Quaelstiones et Objecta Juaei Cuiusdam Responsio," by John Calvin; The Jew in Christian Theology, Gerhard Falk, McFarland and Company, Inc., Jefferson, NC and London, 1931.

Luther, of course, had worse things to say about the Jews.

That doesn't mean that Lutherans or Calvinists need be anti-semites--- just the opposite. The past should never be an excuse. Pope John Paul and Pope Benedict have learned from history rather than simply repeating it, but the Vatican is still an institution dominated by European elites. "The Vatican" puts out all sorts of leftist nonsense because European "elites" are, even more than the American intellectual establishment, dominated by leftists. But "the Vatican" doesn't speak for the Pope, the Pope speaks for the Vatican. This Pope has stood strong enough against Islamist/Arabist terrorism to impress Oriana Fallaci, who certainly isn't part of the left wing intellectual elite or a Catholic these days.

Think of all the leftist nonsense that comes from our CIA and State Department. We don't blame Americans as a whole or President Bush in particular for that, do we? Not without a whole lot of qualification, we don't--- unless "we" means DU or DailyKos.

[nopardons]

Thank you, dirtboy and sinky knows you're right ( as I was in my posts ) and he was dead wrong, in what he said. That's his REAL problem.

[Bella_Bru]

So sorry, your buddy was booted.

[sinkspur]

Thank you, dirtboy and sinky knows you're right ( as I was in my posts ) and he was dead wrong, in what he said. That's his real problem.

I fully expected you to jump in on the side of those who mischaracterize the Church's role in WWII. You don't know the history, and will buy anything any anti-Catholic says.

Read the thread. It is full of falsehoods and insults toward the Catholic Church.

I, for one, am not going to stand by and allow these things to stand. Lies are lies, and they are not going to pass unnoticed.

[ArrogantBustard]

Thanks, FRiend ... Al-Reuters prints a half-assed article, in which they half quote the Pope, thus telling a half-truth which is worse than a whole lie.

And (some of) the membership of this forum, dedicated (supposedly) to ferreting out dishonesty, dissimulation, and dissembling in the press (predictably) sucks it down whole, without a moment's critical thought.

They're pathetic.

[The_Reader_David]

You are welcomed. You may trust me to stand up for the Pope of Rome when he is in the right as we Orthodox see things. Hopefully my often combative stance on behalf of Orthodoxy vis-a-vis the Latin church gives some extra credibility to my defenses of Rome when offered.

(Incidentally, Benedict XVI is clearly the favorite post-schism Pope of Rome among a lot of us Orthodox--I hope you have three or four more like him, a good run of Popes of Rome in his mold and reunion might actually be feasible.)

[betsyross1776]

I am a Catholic but this time the Pope who I really like is wrong on this. This is the survival of a nation, sometimes the men in the Catholic church have been wrong and this is one of them.

[nopardons]

sinky, I probably know the entire history of the Catholic church better than you do!

I was responding to one, ONE reply, made to me and you, on WHAT I HAD POSTED. If you would, for one minute, stop blinded by emotion and stop playing the victim card, you would see that. Not a one of my posts can bed even remotely considered to be "anti-Catholic" nor "Catholic bashing". Yet, you keep trying to lump me into some group to which I don't belong to. You even CCPed what I wrote, so you know, or should, that what you are writing to me, is patently ridiculous.

If you REALLY mean what you said to me, then YOU had better stop lying to and about me, right now!

[sinkspur]

sinky, I probably know the entire history of the Catholic church better than you do!

Uh-huh.

You and I are not doing very well, are we? First was all the Masonic stuff, and now this.

You made a post to dirtboy who is taking me to task for challenging misrepresentations about the Church. One of the posters who made the most blatant falsehoods was banned.

You and I are usually on the same wavelength, so I'll drop this whole thing.

But, as I told you before, I am not going to sit by while lies are being told about the Catholic Church. And stating that the Church did nothing for the Jews during WWII is the most bald-faced of lies that could be told.