[pogo101]

Oh. From the headline, I thought this was a story about Helen Thomas.

[Argus]

"The Hyksos have gotten lousy press."

They must have been conservative Republicans.

[To Hell With Poverty]

GGG ping

[auzerais]

I traveled to Crete and Sanotini back in '71 and had been aware of the impact that the Theran explosion had on the entire eastern Mediterranean. If this was in 1500BC, then the theory that it was partly responsible for some of the miracles [parting of the Red Sea] during Moses' age now need to be revised.

[Styria]

Bump for later.

[SunkenCiv]

Thanks THWP and Blam.

To all -- please ping me to other topics which are appropriate for the GGG list. Thanks.

Please FREEPMAIL me if you want on or off the
"Gods, Graves, Glyphs" PING list or GGG weekly digest
-- Archaeology/Anthropology/Ancient Cultures/Artifacts/Antiquities, etc.
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[SunkenCiv]

Bronze Age Myths?
Volcanic Activity and Human Response in the Mediterranean and North Atlantic Region
Paul C. Buckland
Andrew J. Dugmore
Kevin J. Edwards
Antiquity Vol. 71 (1997), pp. 581-593.

A first rule of statistics is that the existence of a correlation does not itself prove a causal connection... This paper examines some of the available evidence for these two Bronze Age 'catastrophes', the one real and in need of a calendar date, the other hypothesized on archaeological grounds and dated by a tenuous link through tree rings to an Icelandic volcano... Despite several cautionary comments from both archaeologists (Manning 1988; Warren 1988) and geologists (Pyle 1989; 1990), the 1628 BC date, or one close to it, continues to be accepted (e.g. Michael and Betancourt 1988), without questioning why the effects of the Santorini eruption should be especially recognizable in the ice-core and tree-ring sequences. Large-scale explosive volcanic activity is common on a global scale (Zielinski et al. 1996), and so before accepting the possibility that the Santorini eruption can be recognized by unusual perturbations in the regional records of ice-cores or tree-rings, the case for its distinctive character must be proved.

On Saturday, August 10, 2002 at 4:49 PM, it occurred to me that the inflated Thera date (for a super eruption that didn't occur) may have been engineered in order to push back the beginning of the Hyksos period, solving a chronological problem for the 2nd Intermediate Period. The New Kingdom has been artificially extended backwards into the period that was actually the Hyksos rule, necessitating a reduction in the length of time of that rule, as well as unattested contemporariness (?) for various sequential dynasties. Pulling the beginning backwards helps Egyptologists, but it makes the problem of dating Greek strata worse, further extending the dark age. OTOH, it's nice to see the Exodus making egress from the New Kingdom, in which it doesn't belong.

[Graymatter]

You would think a few ice core samples would have settled the matter by now. But no! :(

[SunkenCiv]

New Ice-Core Evidence
Challenges the 1620s
age for the Santorini
(Minoan) Eruption
by Gregory A. Zielinski
and Mark S. Germani
13 July 1997

Determining a reliable calendrical age of the Santorini (Minoan) eruption is necessary to place the impact of the eruption into its proper context within Bronze Age society in the Aegean region. The high-resolution record of the deposition of volcanically produced acids on polar ice sheets, as available in the SO42-time series from ice cores (a direct signal), and the high-resolution record of the climatic impact of past volcanism inferred in tree rings (a secondary signal) have been widely used to assign a 1628/1627 age to the eruption. The layer of ice in the GISP2 (Greenland) ice core corresponding to 1623±36 , which is probably correlative to the 1628/1627 event, not only contains a large volcanic-SO42-spike, but it contains volcanic glass. Composition of this glass does not match the composition of glass from the Santorini eruption, thus severely challenging the 1620s age for the eruption. Similarly, the GISP2 glass does not match the composition of glass from other eruptions (Aniakchak, Mt. St. Helens, Vesuvius) thought to have occurred in the 17th century nor does it match potential Icelandic sources. These findings suggest that an eruption not documented in the geological record is responsible for the many climate-proxy signals in the late 1620s . Although these findings do not unequivocally discount the 1620s age, we recommend that 1628/1627 no longer be held as the "definitive" age for the Santorini eruption.

Santorini, Greece

Santorini is complex of overlapping shield volcanoes. Basalt and andesite lava flows that make the shield are exposed in the cliff below the town of Phira. Some of the cliff is thought to be a caldera wall associated with an eruption 21,000 year ago. Druitt and Francaviglia (1992) found evidence of at least 12 large explosive eruptions in the last 200,000 years at Santorin i...

Akroteri, a Minoan city on the south part of Thera, is being excavated. About 3-6 feet (1-2 m) of ash fell on the city which had a population of about 30,000. The residents appear to have been successfully evacuated prior to the eruption. No bodies have been found in the ash like those at Vesuvius. Archeologists also reported that movable objects had been taken from the city...

The Kameni Islands formed after the caldera. Eleven eruptions since 197 B.C. have made the two islands. The most recent eruption at Santorini was in 1950 on Nea Kameni, the northern island. The eruption was phreatic and lasted less than a month. It constructed a dome and produced lava flows.

Dendrochronological Dating, Results And Open Problems
by Mark Baillie

In 1984 Val LaMarche and Kathy Hirschboeck pointed out a severe frost ring in their Californian bristlecone pine tree-ring record relating to the calendar year 1627 BC. Their suggestion that this frost event might have been due to the eruption of the Santorini volcano in the Aegean is still a source of active debate. Their work stimulated the observation of a series of narrowest-ring events in an Irish oak chronology at dates 3195 BC, 2345 BC, 1159 BC, 207 BC and AD 540. These dates, it turns out, fall in the vicinity of several possibly traumatic environmental events marked in human records by such phenomena as dynastic changes, Dark Ages and plagues (Baillie 1995).

The estimated 207 BC synch might match the only historical record (Strabo) which survives from ancient literature, but another estimate (of the dozen or so eruptions in the past 200,000 years) is 197 BC, which IMHO is more accurate.

Geoarchaeology:
The Earth-Science Approach to Archaeological Interpretation
by George (Rip) Rapp, Jr. and Christopher L. Hill

"Artifacts from Akrotiri, linked to the Egyptian calendar [sic] put the Thera eruption at more than a hundred years later [than 1644 +/- 20 BC]. While the controversy remains open, it is our view that the volcanic activity recorded in the Greenland ice core more likely came from nearby Iceland than from the eastern Mediterranean (this may be testable by any chemical signature). [p 158-159]

"Living samples from a freshwater lake on limestone terrain have been known to give a radiocarbon date of up to 1600 BP." [p 166]

Ancient Modern Life And Carbon Dating
by William R. Corliss

Primordial carbon may come from limestone or natural gas welling up from the earth's interior. Modern life forms that metabolize primordial rather than atmospheric carbon dioxide, with its cosmic-ray produced carbon-14, will appear extremely old when carbon-dated. Mice eating such apparently ancient life forms at Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory, California, were carbon-dated as being 13,000 years old, and were expected to attain a ripe old age of 35,000 in a few months.

[SunkenCiv]

[freedumb2003]

Its Bush's fault!

[gleeaikin]

I have been researching the regional impact of several historic volcanic/earthquake cycles. One phenomenon that I have observed is that volcanoes can be active in several places at roughly the same time. The pillar of fire by night and smoke by day could have been in volcanic areas to the east of the Red Sea area. The land could have been uplifted by magma inflation under the surface of the land. In recent years this has happened in Japan with a volcano, I think named Usu. This could have caused the parting of the sea.

I think it is pretty likely the Thera/Santorini was around 1625 BC. There apparently was a start to the vulcanism there about 20 years earlier which caused the people to move before the final cataclysm. I think this period corresponds with the disturbances of the Hyksos period, and the general climate disturbance of the volcano could have driven conquering people into Egypt, perhaps from the middle east.

There was another major Mediterranean eruption at Etna, which is listed as 1500 BC +- 50 years. I think that this may have been part of a cycle of vulcanism which was part of the Exodus story. Check the dates in the Bible from the time of Abraham, who lived around 1900 BC, to the construction of the Temple at Jerusalem by David in the 900 BC period. Each of these dates is in the 400 range, I don't have a Bible here, so cannot be more precise. I highly doubt that it was during the Ramases period, as this was in the 1200 BC period and is too close to the construction of the Temple. Incidently, I think we are in a current major earthquake/vulanism cycle, with the great tsunami in Indonesia, the Pakistan earthquake, and other related phenomena.

[Exton1]

What I hate about this article is the politically correct date. B. C. E. We have lost B. C. (Before Christ) and replaced it with B.C.E. (Before Common Era) Even though Western Culture has become dominate the lefts don’t want to offend anyone. Even those who still live in the 7th century and have contributed nothing to mankind except suicide bombers.

[Exton1]

After some research it turns out that “he 'Common Era' - a Secular Term for Year Definition’ is being pushed by ONE crazy guy in Canada. And the lefties have fallen again for stupidity. They are just stuck on stupid.

[SunkenCiv]

similar, newer topic, from April 27, 2006 C.E.:

Olive branch solves a Bronze Age mystery
Yahoo/MSNBC (Science) | 3:04 p.m. ET April 27, 2006 | Kathleen Wren
Posted on 04/28/2006 8:59:40 AM EDT by The_Victor
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1623102/posts

[ZULU]

I wonder how accurate radiocarbon dating is in a situation involving a volcanic eruption. Perhaps the percentage of radioactive material spewed out impacts the readings in some way, although one would think more radioactive material would result in a younger date.

[Mamzelle]

I just love revised history. It's the best kind.

[tet68]

Ah Thera, I remember it like it was yesterday.
A memory seared, SEARED in my consciousness!

[SunkenCiv]

search for "santorini":

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[SunkenCiv]

Identification of Aniakchak (Alaska) tephra in Greenland ice core challenges the 1645 BC date for Minoan eruption of Santorini
Nicholas J. G. Pearce
John A. Westgate
Shari J. Preece
Warren J. Eastwood
William T. Perkins

Abstract: Minute shards of volcanic glass recovered from the 1645 ± 4 BC layer in the Greenland GRIP ice core have recently been claimed to originate from the Minoan eruption of Santorini [ Hammer et al., 2003 ]. This is a significant claim because a precise age for the Minoan eruption provides an important time constraint on the evolution of civilizations in the Eastern Mediterranean. There are however significant differences between the concentrations of SiO2, TiO2, MgO, Ba, Sr, Nb and LREE between the ice core glass and the Minoan eruption, such that they cannot be correlatives. New chemical analyses of tephra from the Late Holocene eruption of the Aniakchak Volcano in Alaska, however, show a remarkable similarity to the ice core glass for all elements, and this eruption is proposed as the most likely source of the glass in the GRIP ice core. This provides a precise date of 1645 BC for the eruption of Aniakchak and is the first firm identification of Alaskan tephra in the Greenland ice cores. The age of the Minoan eruption of Santorini, however, remains unresolved.