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The Times indicates the Russian mole was fed disinfo - and the Russians did not know it was disinfo.

The problem with that theory is that my background in logistics tells me that the American invasion plan was no secret to Russian intel based on their ability to spy from satellites in space on our positions. The American invasion plan was clear to anyone who could see it from space because you could not hide such a deployment.

So I think (since even a stooge mole is still a mole and this mole has not been charged with spying now that the war is over and his usefulness gone) that the Russians were helping out the Americans spread disinfo to Saddam.

Remember, Russia wanted Saddam to voluntarily step down.

Why?

In hopes that if Saddam stepped down there would be no need for America to invade and the guy who would take over would be friendly to America but most importantly preserve the Russian oil contracts.

But you ask - would not the Russians want to keep Saddam in power to preserve said contracts? The answer is that everyone - including the Russians who warned America Saddam was planning an attack on the USA (Putin told Bush of this plot personally post 9/11-that is a fact) - knew Saddam was out and the only question was what way he would go out - and what kind of regime would replace him.

Welcome to the real world - its very grey and complicated.

More plausible is it sounds like the Russians were helping us out - no investigation is being planned either - a funny thing when you consider there may be a mole involved. No investigation means that there was no real mole but it covers for the American effort to sow disinfo (with Russian help) to Saddam in the hopes he decided to leave before the invasion started. The significance of telling Saddam America would not fight in the cities was to show the Baathists was because Iraq's strategy was to lure Americans into cities for urban fighting - the only equalizer the Iraqis could do to even out the odds against them somewhat. When the Russians told Iraq America was not going to drive into the cities the Baathists had no alternative strategy. The problem was that nutjob Saddam did not even believe America would invade so the hoped for impact this disinfo was supposed to have did not materialize.

Maybe a sly tip o' the hat to Russia is called for?

Before people start scratching their heads at that since Russia voted against the invasion - Germany was also against the Iraqi invasion in public but German intel was inside Iraq feeding America information at the same time.

1 posted on 03/26/2006 11:27:03 AM PST by Proctor
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach

fyi


2 posted on 03/26/2006 11:27:25 AM PST by Proctor (I risk my life to bring you http://www.historyofjihad.org & http://www.islamcomicbook.com/)
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To: RusIvan; Egberto

fyi


3 posted on 03/26/2006 11:35:40 AM PST by Proctor (I risk my life to bring you http://www.historyofjihad.org & http://www.islamcomicbook.com/)
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To: Proctor

This is my theory.


4 posted on 03/26/2006 11:38:06 AM PST by marron
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To: Proctor

I hope someone in Gitmo is still playing whack-a-mole with that traitor.


5 posted on 03/26/2006 11:38:09 AM PST by NonValueAdded ("If I were a Cuban, I'd certainly be on a raft," Isane Aparicio Busto)
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To: Proctor
Welcome to the real world - its very grey and complicated.

That is also why the nightly news is generally a complete and total waste of time. If the news were to try and paint a complete and accurate picture of what is going on in the world the result would be complicated...and dull...and the market for such news would be small indeed.
6 posted on 03/26/2006 11:39:11 AM PST by P-40 (http://www.590klbj.com/forum/index.php?referrerid=1854)
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To: Proctor
Image Hosted by The Image Hosting

I knew it would come to this....

8 posted on 03/26/2006 11:52:15 AM PST by ARealMothersSonForever (Political troglodyte with a partisan axe to grind)
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To: Proctor

Now they need to out the mole and try him/her for treason.


9 posted on 03/26/2006 11:53:00 AM PST by SandRat (Duty, Honor, Country. What else needs to be said?)
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To: Proctor

"The times indicaates the Russian mole was fed disinfo"

Hahahaha--let's see the big bear whine about how it is an "ally" of the US over that one.


10 posted on 03/26/2006 11:54:03 AM PST by freeangel ( (free speech is only good until someone else doesn't like what you say))
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To: Proctor

If your Russian spy buddy was fed disinformation by the US, how does this call for "a tip o' the hat" to the Russians for spying on us? We just used their own spy against them.


12 posted on 03/26/2006 11:57:37 AM PST by ozzymandus
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To: Proctor

Plus, as I have said in a different thread on this topic, just because someone tells you he has "inside sources" doesn't make it true.

I vote for a rogue Russian (though how "rogue" remains to be seen) trying to puff himself up to Saddam for a cut of the oil-for-food money by exagerating the "value" of his information.

Anyone with satellite imagery of the impending battleground could have suggested the tactics that would be used.

The fact that Saddam did NOT act on the information suggested that he did not take it very seriously.


13 posted on 03/26/2006 12:00:10 PM PST by Philistone (Turning lead into gold...)
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To: Proctor

Interesting....


17 posted on 03/26/2006 12:21:52 PM PST by shield (A wise man's heart is at his RIGHT hand; but a fool's heart at his LEFT. Ecc 10:2)
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To: Cindy

Ping


22 posted on 03/26/2006 1:02:38 PM PST by fanfan ( "We can evade reality, but we cannot evade the consequences of evading reality" - Ayn Rand)
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To: Proctor
then what would be the reason for going with the "mole" story now ? what does it buy anybody ?
why not just come out and say the Russians helped us ?
25 posted on 03/26/2006 1:15:53 PM PST by stylin19a (Do you still have sex or are you already playing golf?)
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To: Proctor

My prediction is that there is no mole, the mole story is what the Russians told the Iraqis.

The detailed information, I am expecting, is detailed information that anyone could have gathered from close reading of the press, and is information that we assumed Saddam would already know. The point is that Russia was acting as our intermediary to convince Saddam that we weren't bluffing, and to get out immediately. On the eve of war, we gave him the chance to go, with his sons, into exile.

Saddan didn't believe we would really invade. This may have merely been a part of the effort to wake him up, and to make the war unnecessary by his departure (we would have occupied anyway).

If, obviously, there really was a mole, he needs to hang. If there is no prosecution, no big investigation, then I will believe this was not espionage, just some good cop bad cop.


26 posted on 03/26/2006 1:18:35 PM PST by marron
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To: Proctor
that the Russians were helping out the Americans spread disinfo to Saddam.

Interesting, I had the same thought, I also wonder if the alleged moving of the WMDs to Syria by Russia was the same kind of operation, that Russia did that with our blessing. Russia would have known Saddam was done if we attacked, so moving the WMDs was a way to look good to the Iraqis (although that wasn't the real objective) plus do the coalition a huge service by removing potential WMD attack. That might explain why not much has come out about moving WMDs, Russia is in a unique position to help in the WOT this way being friendly to many ME countries and all. You wouldn't want to blow that kind of an arrangement into the open before you maximized the potential in the WOT.

27 posted on 03/26/2006 1:22:59 PM PST by dynoman (Objectivity is the essence of intelligence. - Marylin vos Savant)
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To: Proctor

38 posted on 03/26/2006 2:07:34 PM PST by cmsgop ( I love Scotch. Scotchy, scotch, scotch)
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To: Proctor
"It is conceivable that the material was either deliberately skewed to confuse the Baghdad regime or was out of date by the time that Saddam and his war planners were given the details.

There is even a possibility that the mole had been discovered by the Americans early on."

It also is conceivable that I'm going to hit the Mega Millions jackpot, and there's even a possibility that I'll hit it two weeks in a row.

Of course, we all knew without some reporter tossing out his armchair speculation without a shred of evidence to back it up....

40 posted on 03/26/2006 2:10:18 PM PST by XJarhead
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To: Proctor

Uhhhm, yeah right. Russia (and China) may have fed Saddam correct info, but Saddam was the one who spread disinformation to his troops. Saddam did not put up a fight because Saddam knew the only way to beat us was to fight an insurgency war.


41 posted on 03/26/2006 2:20:35 PM PST by Thunder90
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To: Stellar Dendrite; Tailgunner Joe; MARKUSPRIME; M. Espinola; lizol

Pingaroo!!


42 posted on 03/26/2006 2:21:31 PM PST by Thunder90
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To: Proctor

43 posted on 03/26/2006 2:22:42 PM PST by freedumb2003 (Diplomacy is what you do after you kick the enemy's ass and define their lives afterward)
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