Raising the volume on what men think about feminism

The Age ^ | Sushi Das

[JasonC]

Yes I am screeching. A million a year are murdered, a quarter never see the light, a third of those that do have no father, half of those that do see their families wrecked before their eighteenth birthday. That is something to screech about. And none of it was true fifty years ago. And I blame feminism, and all the Stalinists supporting it thoughtlessly. And I'll go on screeching about it whether anyone on earth listens, until my wishes become horses (see previous), or mortality shuts me up. See, we can scream with the best of 'em. It's so easy.

[HairOfTheDog]

I'd like to hear conservative women who now know better, decry the ravages of feminism themselves.

Are you white, Jason? Do you think it's fair to make you decry racism and beg for mercy each and every time you meet a minority? Or do you just want to treat people fairly and stop being blamed for the actions of others?

I don't apologize for the existance of liberals. I'm not one.

[JasonC]

Do you think there have been ravages from feminism, or not? Do you think they don't affect you? Do you live on Mars?

[JasonC]

I'm not a communist, but I run around denouncing the ravages of communism every chance I get. Why would it be any different from a conservative woman who disagrees with feminism? You've got this evil ideology out smashing entire societies to atoms, and you are offended that another conservatives would like to hear you occasionally raise your voice against it? Who wants you to apologize for the existence of liberals? I just want you to denounce them.

[HairOfTheDog]

I think there have been some shrill liberal attitudes, some radical ideas I don't condone have come to pass. That's why I'm on a conservative forum. Life's politics. Politics is about convincing other people that you're right.

All I know about you is that you're really angry at women. You're convincing no one that conservatism is a better way.

[JasonC]

Who needs to convince anybody, a child could see it. If allowed to live that long. You don't have to debate the merits of feminism, it doesn't have any. It has wrecked everything it has touched.

What paralyzes us is not convincing a few marginal people who've never given it any serious thought, and just go by what sounds enlightened when some pollster asks them a question. It is instead our own (as conservatives) lack of comprehension of the full impact, the full scale of the thing, and its monstrosity. Faced with a gulag, one's responsibility is not to debate the finer points of social democratic theory as applied in Sweden with a marginally open-minded liberal. It is to grasp the moral enormity of it, face its human reality, and start to actually think about what can be done.

I see zero sign this has yet happened with modern feminism. People are at the stage where they were barely willing to admit that maybe higher government spending didn't instantly end the great depression, when the pit of the Ukraine is right in front of them.

Can no one stand to face what we've done to our children in the past 45 years?

[HairOfTheDog]

Jason, with all due respect (and I don't have cuase to give you a lot) you're rambling and I'm no longer interested.

[JasonC]

Good, then please leave.

Feminism helped destroy the family. The destruction of the family has resulted in untold human misery over the last 45 years. It attacked the family for allegedly interfering with women's self fufillment, and taught women to selfishly put themselves before their duties to others - any kind of duties to others. It taught a monstrous ingraditude to the most pampered people in human history. It deliberately inserted Stalinist brainwashing between individuals who otherwised loved each other, prefering political polarization to human happiness. It wrecked homes, it impoverished women, it deliberately sought to deprive innocent children of fathers it ideologically hated, without any say in the matter themselves. It was wildly successful at all of the above, as deferential men got out of the way of strident political activists overflowing with hatred. It wrecked half of the academy, perverting real standards and replacing them with identity politics agitprop.

If you don't know what feminism has done to modern civilization, some of us do. And do not consider it a light and breezy subject. I'm rambling because you are simply in denial about what it was, where it came from, and what it did.

[luckystarmom]

I think most of us agree that feminism has wrecked families and done a lot of damage to our society.

However, you have lumped all women into that group. Some of us do not belong, and we still deserve respect. You have not given us any.

[John O]

Not to me it isn't

(on rspect being positional)

Read the bible. God's pretty clear on respecting your father.

The rest of your post came across pretty meaningless. What are you trying to say. (But then it's late for me. I'll try it again in the morning)

[fullchroma]

A million a year are murdered, a quarter never see the light, a third of those that do have no father, half of those that do see their families wrecked before their eighteenth birthday. That is something to screech about. And none of it was true fifty years ago.

I'm in complete agreement with you and I am female.

Modern (I'm not talking Susan B. Anthony, Alice Paul, et al., here) Feminism has done enormous, persistent harm to this country. No question.

Sadly, when men on this forum suggest that modern Feminist dogma has harmed this country in any way they are pounced upon by a particularly garrulous narcissist with way too much free time and her little claque of like-minded cronies. You will never win an argument with these women. They will never concede a significant point by virtue of your sex. You are male, ergo you are wrong, evil, hate women and must be silenced. But first, of course, you must be ridiculed.

I suggest you abandon the threads on which they and their neurotic diatribes appear on the (yes, iffy) theory that if you ignore them, they'll scurry elsewhere.

[John O]

I made the comment, to make a point other than the one I made

One of the difficulties that my wife and I had was in this exact area. As I told her, I am a man and an engineer (and yes the engineering training does change you) I don't do subtlety well at all. If you need to tell me something be blatantly obvious or I'll usually miss the real point.

This can be most infuriating for both sides. She'd say something like "I don't want to go out tonight" meaning "I don't want to go to the place you were talking about going to tonight" So we'd stay in. And she'd get upset. "But you told me you didn't want to go out!" We had a few fights over this before we learned each other well enough for her to be blatant and for me to keep digging for the truth

[John O]

see 513. You're behind the discussion.

[John O]

One thing that concerns me in all of your posts is that you are considering remarriage when this may not be in the best interest of your daughter. I understand that you want more kids, but why would you do that to your daughter. She would then live in a household with a woman who would treat her own children better than your daughter. Also, your daughter would lose part of you to another woman and these new children.

She brought it up. She has already decided that she will be the flower girl and is so excited about being a big sister. One of the characteristics that I have on my request to God is that she loves Autumn as her own child. I couldn't marry her if she didn't

I personally think you should devote your non-work time to your daughter and not worry about getting remarried until she is grown. Your daughter has already lost her mom, she doesn't need to lose part of you.

I will address this part in a later post. Please read to the end in case I miss pinging you

[John O]

Well, a President can and has lost my respect, Clinton

Yes but the office of the presidency was still worthy of respect even if the occupant was not.

[luckystarmom]

Please read HairoftheDogs post. She has had personal experience with this, and so she has a lot more knowledge than I do.

It seems she had a very great experience with her step-dad, and if you do get remarried I wish the same with your daughter.

I'll take personal experience in the matter over anyones opinion, so disregard what I said.

[John O]

You know what I saw once on a remarriage that I really thought was a powerfully good idea? Vows, as part of the ceremony, from both bride and groom to the existing children. To love, respect and raise them as their own, indivisible. It was perhaps the most inclusive, committed way I've ever seen of including and acknowledging the children such marriages will affect. It made them feel a part of it. And it brought tears to my eyes it was so touching. So much better than the child sitting in the pews like a mere spectator.

Consider it stolen and filed. Awesome idea. (Andie help me remember please)

A very good friend of Michele and I lost his wife about two (maybe three) years ago. He ended up remarrying a widow. The first part of the service was a rememberance of the first marriages. The candles normally lit by the parents were lit by the children in place of the deceased spouses. It was phenomenally beautiful.

[HairOfTheDog]

The unity candle would be a nice subtle way to include them also.

[HairOfTheDog]

Oh - and good night... my husband and I are trying to pull ourselves away from these screens and have some good couch time.

Enjoyed talking to you :~D

[John O]

and then I also thought conservatives might discuss ways to roll back the ravages of feminism.

OK JasonC. How do we roll back feminism. Throughthis whol ethread you've been bitching and moaning about the "pieties of feminism" (which BTW you should define once in a while as I haven't a clue what you are addressing) but have said scant about fixing things. So here's your chance. Fix it. (and stop beating up on people. At least in my discussion I was discussion and not just calling names. For crying out loud man you read like a monty python sketch)