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Nigergate: the dangerous relations between Democrat Senators and ex spies
november 15, 2005

Posted on 11/15/2005 10:52:47 AM PST by parnasokan

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To: parnasokan
Basing himself on this disinformation Waxman wrote a letter to Bush demanding an explanation, none ever arrived due to the simple fact that the EIR scoop was totally baseless. No trace of the Carabinieri, no trace of British or Americans. Nothing at all. All that remains is a network of spies, anti-Bush giornalists and Democrat Senators who all seem to forget two or three things: Rocco Martino was a spy employed by the French; Niger is an ex Frech colony; the French control the extraction of uranium in Niger; the French had the dossier containing the false documents in the autumn of 2000; in regards to the forgeries France remained silent, never telling the Americns a word about the forgeries, until after the IAEA disclosed all. Question: why don’t all of the highly allert Democrat Senators, beginning with Rockefeller, ask the FBI to investigate Paris?

Why do you think they didn't want Paris investigated?

41 posted on 11/15/2005 8:37:56 PM PST by GOPJ (Frenchmen should ask immigrants "Do you want to be Frenchmen?" not, "Will you work cheap?")
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To: popdonnelly
I think you are confusing Jeff Castelli with Vincent Cannistraro. Jeff Castelli was the Station Chief in Rome who originally recieved the info in the fall of 2001 from SISME (the Italians). After more research, I have found out I was partially wrong...Castelli did see the documents, but did not recieve a copy. He wrote a synopsis in memo form and passed it to Greg Thielmann in the NSA. Incidentally, Thielmann has toured on the anti-war circuit with none other than Joseph Wilson after he lost a "pissing contest" with John Bolton over way information was passed up the chain of command.

Thielmann ignored the info because, in his opinion, the info in the memo is "somewhat limited" and is "lacking in necessary detail" and is "highly suspect." The actual forgeries turned up much later. Still, that begs the question about how the CIA had the actual text of the forged documents during the 2000-2001 time frame as they testified to the Intelligence Committee when Castelli only provided a syopsis based on his recollections of what the documents contained and then that was not sent to the CIA in the US, but to Thielmann, who apparently sat on the info. It is also interesting that Jeff Castelli was recalled by Tenet to Washington right when this story broke, reportedly for "misconduct". Then, all of a sudden Tenet and James Pavitt resign for "personal reasons" (like I believe that nonsense).

Actually this whole thing started between 1999 and 2000 when the French realized that someone is working abandoned mines to generate a clandestine trade in uranium. They hired Rocco Martino to "investigate". So...although Wilson claims he spoke with "officials" in Niger, it is highly unlikely that those officials would know about a smuggling operation.

42 posted on 11/16/2005 6:45:40 AM PST by ravingnutter
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To: GOPJ

"Why do you think they didn't want Paris investigated?"

Partisanship. Democrats don't want Paris investigated, they want Bush investigated - for political advantage. Don't assume that members of Congress are on a search for the truth.


43 posted on 11/16/2005 7:25:26 AM PST by popdonnelly
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To: ravingnutter

I understood that you were talking about someone other than Cannistraro, but I didn't know who Castelli was. Seems to me the forgeries could have been originally made just for the purpose of making some quick money. But the uses that have been made of the documents by the different actors in the story is interesting.


44 posted on 11/16/2005 7:46:35 AM PST by popdonnelly
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To: ravingnutter
JULY 9, 2003 : (CBS AIRS COMPLAINTS BY GREG THIELMAN, FORMER STATE DEPT DIRECTOR OF STRATEGIC, PROLIFERATION AND MILITARY ISSUES OFFICE IN THE BUREAU OF INTELLIGENCE AND RESEARCH, AGAINST COLIN POWELL ) ... CBS itself featured the same basic charge from Thielmann back on July 9 and he leveled his allegations, against Powell and other Bush officials, during PBS’s June 13 Now with Bill Moyers. - October 16, 2003 CyberAlert, via "60 Minutes II Re-Runs Ex-Official’s Attack on Powell’s UN Case," by Brent Baker, Media Research Center , 2-5-04

* Note that this is the same day Japan Today is fed the Cap Hill Blue Story on fake CIA source "T J Wilkinson" :

JULY 9, 2003 : (JAPAN TODAY RECEIVES CHB "T J WILKINSON" STORY, BUT CREDITS THE STORY TO TRUTHOUT.ORG WHICH HAD SENT IT TO THEM) The genie was out of the bottle at this point. On July 9th, Japan Today published the same exact story as Capitol Hill Blue, verbatim, crediting the story to TruthOut. Within hours, the Google News compilation service had it as the head story in its grouping of the news reports about the White House admission that the Niger intelligence was unreliable. I contacted Japan Today, and in a series of emails with Mr. Betros, I informed him that Capitol Hill Blue had backed off of some of the assertions in the article, and further that there was reason to doubt the existence of the Mr. Wilkinson quoted in the story. This information was news to Mr. Betros, as he was completely unaware of Thompson and of Capitol Hill Blue. He informed me that Japan Today had obtained the story from TruthOut, to which his organization subscribes, and which had presented the story as their own. Betros acted quickly to verify what I was telling him, apparently realizing that the credibility of his news organization could be impacted.- "Games People Play," by William McKinley of FreeRepublic

45 posted on 11/17/2005 11:01:53 PM PST by piasa (Attitude Adjustments Offered Here Free of Charge)
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To: piasa
Yeah, I've had my eye on Thielmann too, just can't figure out how he is involved. He was the first one to get a "report" (synopsis) of the forgeries from Jeff Castelli, the CIA Station Chief in Rome. What is throwing me off is that he ignored it, as he said it was not credible. If he was deeply involved, he would have passed it on, but then again, maybe it was a timing issue. He was apparently in a pissing contest with Bolton over how reports were passed up the chain of command. Bolton makes a statement that:

“I found that there was lots of stuff that I wasn’t getting and that the INR analysts weren’t including,” he told me. “I didn’t want it filtered.

Could that have been this report? If Thielmann would have passed it on, it could have prevented this whole fiasco.

46 posted on 11/18/2005 6:13:37 AM PST by ravingnutter
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bump


47 posted on 11/18/2005 11:58:13 AM PST by Rocket1968 (Durbin must resign - NOW!)
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To: parnasokan
Three articles from Italy published today.  The first is complete here but a poor translation.  There are links for the other two.  The conclusion seems to be that the "Three B's" (Bush, Blair, and Berlusconi) were targets of a takedown attempt by former intelligence agents (including CIA) joined by French, Democrats, and some of the MSM.

 

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n. 274 of 18-11-05 page 5

Niger-gate, the faida in the Cia in order to hit Bush
of GIAN MARK CHIOCCI

Italy was pulled in dance from former men of the agency and civil employees in activity engage to you in a fight of being able against the new ones concern to us intentional from the USA president
The "guastatori", rigorously anonymous, find side on the average liberal Americans
Mario Sechi
from Rome


In order to comprise the origin of the Niger-gate it is necessary riavvolgere the tape and to leave from a group of former agents of the Cia that - always in tune with Three political-mediatico party anti "B" (Bush, Blair, Berlusconi) - changes the course of the events with declarations, interviews and forecasts to say little narcotic.
Capofila the off board of the Veteran movement Intelligence Professionals for voted Sanity to demonstrate the pressures of the USA Administration (and the hawks of the Pentagon) in order to manipulate it makes documents of accusation against the Irak, is Vincent Cannistraro, former civil employee of the anti-terrorism of Langley, gettonatissimo from blogger American and, the obviously, host appreciate on Republic. Like told yesterday from the Newspaper, Cannistraro is the man who in the day in which the journalist of Panorama, Elisabetta Burba, delivery to the USA embassy to Rome the false letters on the letter traffics uranio between the Niger and Saddam (received from Rocco Martino, spy of the 007 French) anticipates on the English daily paper The Guardian that some "information manipulated" (in the text the used expression are cooked information) would be in order to catch up concern us of the government American.
As it made to know it - inasmuch as the counterfeit correspondence, to 9 October of 2002, knew it only the French Services - it is a mystery never cleared. Also because only two later months, to Paris, participating to the convention Not Conventional Terrorism and the Use of Weapons of Mass Destruction: 15 months after the 11th of september it will candid say to believe that Saddam possesses crews of mass destruction bacteriological chemistries and.
It is in this period that emerges an axis constituted from former employee of the Central Agency Intelligences, making head for the note to the Vips organization, and various colleagues in activity and still engage to you in a hardest crash of being able inner to the Cia. Many have not appreciate the arrival of the new director Porter Goss and the intentional reform from Bush with the institution of the "Zar of the Intelligence", John Negroponte. In many they play to shooting to sign against the House White woman, with the Italy that is considered ventre the motivatings force of the chain. One of the new evidences arrives from a service of the Washington Bureau of the publishing group Knight Ridder that 4 past November writes: "Four officials of the intelligence American say that the Sismi has passed three report to the Cia station of Rome, between the October 2001 and March 2002, in which it spoke itself about an agreement for the sale of uranio between Niger and the Irak".
According to the officials "one of the report contains a language that it sends back to false letters". The four speak without to say who are, and chiosano: "the Sismi sure is been involved". The plot it comes punctually resumed in Italy from Republic. The active group of "guastatori" finds space on the average liberal Americans always resorting to the anonymity.
This axis has a feeling with network the international antagonist and, in special way, with that European that finds its it finishes them in France and Germany. From here the clamorous rilasciata interview 1º March 2003 to the German television Ard from David Albright, a former inspector of international the atomic Agency that, in anticipating the most secret relation of the Iaea on the falsità of documents on the traffics of uranio Niger-Irak, pulled the cross on the USA administration openly accused is to have forced the own intelligence to invent itself of the tests in order to justify the armed participation, is to have supplied to the UN false tests on the possession of crews of destruction of mass from part of Saddam Hussein. To the lead transmission tv from Volker Steinhoff they will participate, with to the "veggente" Albright, three pensions Cia to you in some way riconducibili to the Vips structure.
The former analyst Ray McGovern, is one of these: "the logical conclusion - it says - is that the information have been manipulated and manifactured on the base of the requirements dictated from politics, and this, from the point of view of the intelligence it is an anathema. That even renders superfluous to have an intelligence agency ".
Former agent Robert Baer R-a.domanda, answers stizzito: "Not there is an imminent threat from part of the Irak, and clearly? Not there are tests of the gas existence rib Vx, anthrax or roba of the sort ". On the same wavelength the former official David MacMicheal syntonizes itself: "Task that the Administration is making pressures on the intelligence system, is that features of Cia, of Fbi or whichever other, in order to put with the stronger tests possible to the aim to demonstrate that there is a concrete and immediate danger of attacks from part of terrorists, in particular those associates to you with To the Qaida or the Irak, through crews chemistries, biological, or other crews of mass destructions". Not content, to the term of the program on the issuing Ard, the former trio Cia nozzle an appeal to the colleagues in service inviting them to discharge themselves or not to support you concern us of the Bush government.
Some day passes. 12 March 2003 begins circular on Internet a document from the title it "Manipulation of the intelligence for the war" to company of Ray McGovern. You specific as two members of the Vips (Baer have not been cited) have participated to a program of the German television "equivalent to 60 minutes", that is the program of the Cbs that will interview two times Rocco Martino (but it will not send in wave the talk) and that just in that period it will head, with to the salary Washington Monthly, to be involved the Sismi and the Italian government in it is made. McGovern defect, on narcissism linens, then running to specify as the interviews "have been recorded before that the innovationes came to the light on the intelligence American". And here, like for Cannistraro, it is worth the same question mark. How it made knowing these innovationes?
A step behind. David Albright in 1996 had been in Irak like inspector of the Iaea and with to the French Jaques Baute, director of the "Iraq Nuclear Verification Office" of the Iaea, examined documents on the Niger consegnatigli to New York, 4 February 2003, from the American government. Albright would have maintained, also in quality of president of the Institute for Science to International Security (Isis) continues contacts with some former members, for the note, in force to the Invo of the Iaea.
She has been for case the Bauté French to blow the information to Albright? And if it is not therefore, it is reasonable that Bauté did not know null of that makes before the official declaration of the 7 dated Iaea March 2003? Possible, therefore, that of it it has not made signal the connazionali that behave in way suspicion somewhat inasmuch as on one side, until the last one (that is to 4 March 2003) they swear the Americans who those same information on the traffics of uranio are true because have "a national origin" and they enter nothing with those Italians not there, eppoi candid backtrack only when the scandal is burst? Who answers?
(2-he continues)


© EUROPEAN EDITION SOCIETY SPA - Via G. Negri 4 - 20123 Milan
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n. 274 of 18-11-05 page 3

Niger-gate, uranio outside the control and the dark direction of the 007 Frenchhttp://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=it_en&trurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.ilgiornale.it%2fa.pic1%3fID%3d42939%26PRINT%3dS

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n. 274 of 18-11-05 page 14

The strange ones interlace between Niger-gate and Oil for food http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=it_en&trurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.ilgiornale.it%2fa.pic1%3fID%3d43214%26PRINT%3dS

48 posted on 11/18/2005 1:00:24 PM PST by MilleniumBug
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To: ravingnutter
I suspect Thielman was a clot in the flow of data...

Another thing that makes me wonder if he was a mole for someone in the press- or perhaps in the Senate intel committee- is that he was continually annoying Bolton by trying to insert himself into meetings where he wasn't wanted or needed. The Cuban spy Elena Belen Montes also had similar intrusive habits. She was destined to be planted on Tenet's staff until investigators decided to bring her in after 9/11. She was also noted for clotting up the flow of info to her superiors- she supressed any intel on Cuba that might lead to people assuming it was a greater threat, for example in biochem warfare reasearch.

49 posted on 11/19/2005 12:36:29 AM PST by piasa (Attitude Adjustments Offered Here Free of Charge)
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To: Fedora

snip [Robert Mueller bump]

Amongst others voting “yes” was Senator John D. Rockefeller, Vice Chairman of the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence, who today promotes the Italian connection in the false documents obviously forgetting his own words at the time: “there is proof that Saddam is working aggressively to develop nuclear arms which will probably be ready in five years”. Words that Rockefeller seems to have forgotten today at a time when he is asking the FBI to re-open the inquiry into the Italian front.

Alongside him stands Congressman Henry Waxman, another who voted “yes” to the use of force. Yesterday Waxman returned once again to attacking the FBI for not having interrogated Rocco Martino during one of his two trips to America, the first to be interviewed by CBS (in vain because the interview was never aired).

The polemic because the Director of the FBI, Robert S. Mueller III, signed a letter which closed once and for all the Italian front: the letter states that there was no plot to influence American foreign policy. The letter completely overturns the conspiracy theory advanced by the american bloggers and copied by La Repubblica which punctually interviews the Democrat Senators who were all for war yesterday but today are so full of regret that they want to place the very FBI under the spotlight, the same FBI that they applaude for having investigated Lewis Scooter Libby for his involvement in CIA-Gate.

It’s true, the FBI could have interrogated Rocco Martino, had they been able to find him. Reliable information from the States points to Martino’s having been assisted by CBS before leaving Italy and having then been helped to hide. True? False? We will know during the next few days. There are no mysteries surrounding Martino’s “non interrogation”. In Italy SISMI made all of it’s information available to the Americans, adding in a letter to Mueller the hope that “our collaboration will continue along the same lines well into the future”.


50 posted on 09/24/2017 12:55:07 AM PDT by piasa
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To: piasa

Mueller’s got a trail of scandals long enough he needs his own special prosecutor.


51 posted on 09/24/2017 6:31:58 PM PDT by Fedora
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To: parnasokan; Fedora

Old time’s sake Mueller bump... nixing suggestion of foreign manipulation of US foreign policy... also Waxman, who was tied up in the war with an IG way back when.


52 posted on 01/04/2018 4:56:08 AM PST by piasa (Attitude adjustments offered here free of charge)
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To: piasa

Thielman reminds me of Papadopolouos


53 posted on 01/04/2018 5:18:49 AM PST by piasa (Attitude adjustments offered here free of charge)
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Waxman was tussling with the IG over an investigation of Iraq contracts.


54 posted on 01/04/2018 5:25:26 AM PST by piasa (Attitude adjustments offered here free of charge)
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To: parnasokan; Fedora
Yesterday Waxman returned once again to attacking the FBI for not having interrogated Rocco Martino during one of his two trips to America, the first to be interviewed by CBS (in vain because the interview was never aired). The polemic because the Director of the FBI, Robert S. Mueller III, signed a letter which closed once and for all the Italian front: the letter states that there was no plot to influence American foreign policy. The letter completely overturns the conspiracy theory advanced by the american bloggers and copied by La Repubblica which punctually interviews the Democrat Senators who were all for war yesterday but today are so full of regret that they want to place the very FBI under the spotlight, the same FBI that they applaude for having investigated Lewis Scooter Libby for his involvement in CIA-Gate. It’s true, the FBI could have interrogated Rocco Martino, had they been able to find him. Reliable information from the States points to Martino’s having been assisted by CBS before leaving Italy and having then been helped to hide. True? False? We will know during the next few days. There are no mysteries surrounding Martino’s “non interrogation”. In Italy SISMI made all of it’s information available to the Americans, adding in a letter to Mueller the hope that “our collaboration will continue along the same lines well into the future”.
55 posted on 08/03/2018 2:42:27 AM PDT by piasa (Attitude adjustments offered here free of charge)
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