French society at a crossroads

BBC Online ^ | 11/7/2005 | Hugh Schofield

[1066AD]

French society at a crossroads By Hugh Schofield Paris

The next couple of days are going to be crucial. It was to be predicted that the violence in the French suburbs would continue throughout the weekend.

Friday and Saturday nights are always the most incendiary, and unfortunately for the government, the weather has remained fine and clear - no disincentive there for the rioters.

If there is a downturn in the number of acts of violence on Sunday night, which continues into Monday, then it could be cautiously hoped that the worst is over. But if there isn't, if the number of car-burnings remains in the high hundreds over the next two or three nights, then France will have entered a new and dangerous phase.

No longer will it be possible to argue that the violence is the extended fallout from the 27 October incident - the accidental electrocution of two youths in Clichy-sous-Bois.

'Intifada'

Once the two-week mark approaches, the events will start resembling the large-scale suburban uprising that doom-mongers have predicted for years.

Words like "intifada" will start being bandied around, and the stakes will suddenly be much higher.

There are two solid reasons for pessimism. The first is the way the rioters have seized on Interior Minister Nicolas Sarkozy as their elemental hate-figure.

To hear the words of the protesters, and indeed much of the reporting of the violence, one can sometimes get the impression that Mr Sarkozy actually created the unrest.

In fact his rhetoric, while undoubtedly uncompromising and hardline, has been wilfully misinterpreted, and not just by the rioters.

To describe the bands of youths rampaging through the suburbs as "yobs" or "rabble" - which he did - is not quite the same as describing all inhabitants of the suburbs as "scum", which is how it has sometimes come across in the media.

Nonetheless, legitimately or otherwise, the minister is now seen by many inhabitants of the suburbs - as well as the left-wing opposition - as part of the problem.

But if they believe there is the remotest chance of his standing down, then they are mistaken.

After initial doubts, Mr Sarkozy now has the backing of the rest of the government, and the longer the riots go on, the more he appears justified in his firm line. He will remain as the rioters' hate figure for some time yet.

Universal response

The other reason for pessimism is that the rioters can read in much of the reaction to their rampages a legitimisation of what they have done.

The universal press response - both national and international, left and right - has been to point out how the French model of integration has failed, and how the suburbs have become exploding cauldrons.

From every direction come calls for a new assessment, but some calls are stronger than others.

An editorialist in Le Monde, for example compared the riots to May 1968, and expressed the hope that just as the student uprising forced a major - and in the writer's view - positive change to French society, so will these. That is not exactly an encouragement for the violence to cease.

As for reasons for optimism, are there any?

The only answer is that the violence is going to have to stop some time, and maybe it will be sooner rather than later.

Perhaps the most the government can pray for is a cold snap accompanied by freezing sleet. Maybe that will put out the fires.

Story from BBC NEWS: http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/2/hi/europe/4412968.stm

[1066AD]

Rather downbeat piece from the Beeb.
Interesting to see them point out that the "Scum" remark attributed to Sarkozy is in fact a misquote.

This other comment really gives one pause:
"The other reason for pessimism is that the rioters can read in much of the reaction to their rampages a legitimisation of what they have done. "

[Flavius]

France does not have civil wars. They crumble internally.
Which they will do. They are already writing up the grants for the looters and saboteurs.

They will fold as they have folded for years after being conquered. This one they let in the front door. Don't think other locations in Europe will fair any better...
In addition, this is most likely organized via iran and other terrorist organizations. They certainly get their point across with minimal economic expenditure... 20 kids for free vs thousands of euroes for cops overtime, torched buildings, property, not to mention the fear the "citizens" of france will have ... ...

[Mark Felton]

"They are not rioters. They are insurgents and freedom fighters." -- Rush Limbaugh

[Mark Felton]

The Brits will not fold.

[Crazieman]

If there is a downturn in the number of acts of violence on Sunday night, which continues into Monday, then it could be cautiously hoped that the worst is over. But if there isn't, if the number of car-burnings remains in the high hundreds over the next two or three nights, then France will have entered a new and dangerous phase.

I would wager 29 officers being shot and rioting near the Paris city-center is not a downturn of the violence.

[ConorMacNessa]

French society would have to have some moral fibre to arrive at a crossroads. They've been on a downward slide for so long no one now alive can recall a time when they stood for anything.

[Flavius]

sort of as france...

The Trojan Horse

Still seeking to gain entrance into Troy, clever Odysseus (some say with the aid of Athena) ordered a large wooden horse to be built. Its insides were to be hollow so that soldiers could hide within it.

Once the statue had been built by the artist Epeius, a number of the Greek warriors, along with Odysseus, climbed inside. The rest of the Greek fleet sailed away, so as to deceive the Trojans.

One man, Sinon, was left behind. When the Trojans came to marvel at the huge creation, Sinon pretended to be angry with the Greeks, stating that they had deserted him. He assured the Trojans that the wooden horse was safe and would bring luck to the Trojans.

Only two people, Laocoon and Cassandra, spoke out against the horse, but they were ignored. The Trojans celebrated what they thought was their victory, and dragged the wooden horse into Troy.

[Thumper1960]

Perhaps, we should emulate the "freedom fighters" who went to Spain in the '30's to fight against the forces of Franco and Hitler. We could be the "George W. Bush Brigades".

/ sarcasm

[Mister Da]

According to the BBC, only an act of god will save france.

BWAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!

[Peace will be here soon]

Funny we haven`t heard from all those Hollywood stars and starlets, who are always so quick to call the U.S.A. a spoiled brat of a nation, about this little riot over there in their adopted home of France.

Has anyone heard from them lately?

Maybe their hiding under their beds.

[metmom]

You mean the One they turned their backs on hundreds of years ago? They kicked Him out (as we're now doing) and now they are getting what they deserve. Not that God is punishing them, but that He's leaving them to their own devices, just as they wanted. Oh well.

[NickatNite2003]

"...It's crazy there! I don't feel safe in
the US any more. I feel that Europe is
a much more civilized and tolerant place.
They are much more enlightened to my way
of thinking. I am embaressed to be an
American now..."

>B-}

[lightman]

France has been anything but a faithful ally this past half century, but we cannot forget the debt we owe to the Marquis de Lafayette.

Yeah, I'd volunteer.

[fella]

Perhaps the most the government can pray for is a cold snap accompanied by freezing sleet. Maybe that will put out the fires.

In other words they are hoping that the Lord in intervene on their agnostic behalf.

[NickatNite2003]

Perhaps some reporter, (not a piece of
leftist traitor MSM scum) Could check
on the HollyPuker Eloi "celebrities"
who live over in "enlightened" France,
to see where they are *now*, and where
they've been over the last few weeks...
it would be interesting to see iif any
of them have changed their travel plans
recently, and have conveiniently arrived
back in the US, in the last week or so...

>Bo)

[uncbob]

but we cannot forget the debt we owe to the Marquis de Lafayette.

Repaid in WWI

[wouldntbprudent]

Yes, where *is* Johnny Depp?

[goldstategop]

The weak and ineffectual response of the French state has convinced its opponents they have little to fear. So they will ratchet up the violence to see what Chiraq's breaking point is. No one is sure when he will finally have enough.

(Denny Crane: "I Don't Want To Socialize With A Pinko Liberal Democrat Commie.Say What You Like About Republicans. We Stick To Our Convictions. Even When We Know We're Dead Wrong.")