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NYers to NYPD: 'I Do Not Consent to Being Searched'
The Village Voice ^ | July 21st, 200 | by Chisun Lee

Posted on 07/22/2005 11:06:07 AM PDT by BigFinn

Spend $16.99 so you can wear this to your grave

Reacting to the NYPD's announcement Thursday afternoon that police would randomly—but routinely—search the bags of commuters, one concerned New Yorker quickly created a way for civil libertarians to make their views black-and-white. In a few outraged moments, local immigrant rights activist Tony Lu designed t-shirts bearing the text, "i do not consent to being searched." The minimalist protest-wear can be purchased here, in various styles and sizes. (Lu will not get a cut. The shirts' manufacture, sale, and shipment, will be handled by the online retailer. Lu encourages budget-conscious New Yorkers to make their own and wear them everywhere.)

Police Commissioner Raymond Kelly had announced the legally obvious—that New Yorkers are free to decline a search and "turn around and leave." But Lu, who is a lawyer at Urban Justice Center, warned that even well-intentioned cops could interpret people's natural nervousness or anger as "reasonable suspicion." The possibility of unjustified interrogation and even arrest is real, Lu said.

Although police promised they would not engage in racial profiling, Lu said that, as with all street-level policing, people of color and poor immigrants would be particularly vulnerable, especially if encounters lead to arrests.

TOPICS: Culture/Society; Government; Miscellaneous; US: New York; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: baaaaa; libertarianfools; nonprofiling; nothintohidehere; nyc; nypd; sheeple; stupidliberals; tshirt; villagevoiceisarag; wot
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To: plain talk

I think I prefer the cameras over manhandling.

581 posted on 07/22/2005 6:17:07 PM PDT by johnb838 (Dominus Vobiscum; Saeculum saeculorum; Amen.)
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To: plain talk

I think I prefer the cameras over manhandling.

582 posted on 07/22/2005 6:18:51 PM PDT by johnb838 (Dominus Vobiscum; Saeculum saeculorum; Amen.)
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To: oceanview

The border argument is not an apt comparison at all. We have authorized checkpoints and established procedures for entering the country legally. Thus we can conclude that ALL other entries are illegal. And while we can't seal the borders, we do indeed have the technology and other resources to put one hell of a dent in the influx.

Moving beyond the borders (pun not intended), the obvious common-sense solution is profiling. There's not one solitary thing about it that's evil. It's just one more example of sacrificing national security for the sake of nothing more than idiotic political correctness shoved down our throats by a small minority of the population. Reality is that if you focus on the problem group, the odds of preventing something rise dramatically. Since our current authorities are absolutely unwilling to do that, however, I don't know that I have any solutions. We're trying to run a race with an eighty-pound bag of concrete strapped on our back.

The random searches will in practice be even worse, of course, since they will probably be handled like the random searches on airline boarding. Not only can likely targets not be afforded greater scrutiny, they're actually afforded LESS by rules that say no more than two Middle-Eastern males can be subjected to secondary screening. It's insanity on display.


583 posted on 07/22/2005 7:18:44 PM PDT by MississippiMan (Americans should not be sacrificed on the altar of political correctness.)
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To: iconoclast
They are truely varelse.

Boy, that one sent me Googling.

Sorry about that. Well, actually I'm not. I think it's a great term, though I think you get the best feel for it after reading "Ender's Game" and "Speaker for the Dead". Both are excellent novels BTW, if you're into science fiction at all.

I believe the Islamists in general can be quarantined, and we (could have?) can annihilate the core group of Jihadists in such a manner as to discourage future problems from these varelse.

For those who haven't done the Googling, I'd like to expand a bit on the term "varelse", and the other terms that are related to it. I think this will more fully enable a more fruitful discussion on why I think they are varelse.

In the book, Ender's Game, Orson Scott Card put forward a series of classifications for what is in the book, alien races, but is adaptable to our single planet as well.

There are four different classifications of people. Remember that with each of these terms, they are mutual. if group A and B are Framling to each other, the A considers B to be Framling, and B considers A to be Framling.

Perhaps they are Ramen, and the lunatic fringe among them can be weeded out so that they may find some way to exist with. I am not entirely sure. Muslims seem to have been on this violent course for centuries now. The modern world appears to be an anathema to them, and their ideology seems, to me anyway, to be too easily twisted into a murderous one. The folks who blew up the London subway stations were British. From what I understand, they grew up there, yet their rage at those different from themselves was such that death and carnage was the only way they felt they could adequately express themselves.

I hope to G-d I'm wrong about that, because if I'm not, this next century may be even bloodier than the last, and that's saying a lot.

584 posted on 07/22/2005 8:12:14 PM PDT by zeugma (Democrats and muslims are varelse...)
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To: TAquinas
I hope it's a pejorative. What does it mean?

See post 584. I elaborate at some length. :-)

585 posted on 07/22/2005 8:14:25 PM PDT by zeugma (Democrats and muslims are varelse...)
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To: Gabz

You are trying to say that the city of New York owns nightclubs?????

586 posted on 07/22/2005 9:14:11 PM PDT by SALChamps03
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To: gdani

They are not overseeing the security. The feds are.

587 posted on 07/22/2005 9:14:50 PM PDT by SALChamps03
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To: RedRover

"As a New Yorker, I consent to anything that will make me safer"

I don't think these measures are enough.

I think the police should go to every neighborhood in New York and randomly search every fifth house.

After all, if you have nothing to hide, you've got nothing to fear, right?


588 posted on 07/22/2005 9:31:10 PM PDT by Sir_Ed
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To: Sabramerican

"On what is supposed to be a Conservative Constitutional website, the denizens are laughing at the assertion of the most basic of Constitutional rights."

I don't think Freep is like that, much, anymore.

Or maybe I'm reading the wrong threads!

Seems like most of the posts I see are apologists for the loss of our freedoms...


589 posted on 07/22/2005 9:34:58 PM PDT by Sir_Ed
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To: beltfed308; kellynla

It seems to me what we are fighting for is not freedom, but a police state.

Since we have nothing to hide, I guess we can all just walk through the streets butt naked.

590 posted on 07/22/2005 9:37:37 PM PDT by DLfromthedesert (Texas da man!!)
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To: Hemingway's Ghost

" you are, in a conservative forum, no less, advocating pitching them all away, entirely"

The Freepers that don't mind losing their 4th Amendment rights might see it differently if the cops were developers taking the passenger's backpacks for Economic Development under Kelo vs. New London!


591 posted on 07/22/2005 9:39:30 PM PDT by Sir_Ed
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To: CyberAnt

I'm not a liberal, and I would never consent to being randomly searched on the subway!

It's scary how disrespectful of the Constitution so many people have become.

The idea that innocenet people should lose their rights to protect the many is simply an extension of New York's belief that guns are evil, and should be banned...that the 2nd Amendment has less validity than stopping the 1% of gun owners that use their gun's in a criminal matter.

I think it's but a matter of time before most Freepers will applaud the seizure of guns across America, because it's better to lose some rights than be hurt by terrorists.


592 posted on 07/22/2005 9:46:12 PM PDT by Sir_Ed
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To: Alberta's Child
I'll tell you what's unreasonable about it. It's unreasonable to have these security measures put in place by a "police force" that operates according to its own rules and regulations, and operates outside many of the laws that ordinary citizens are required to obey.

I don't know a thing about NYPD or most other east coast PD's, I am a retired west coast cop, and I must admit we did things a bit different out here.

Thanks for the history lesson on law enforcement, since I have written a few papers on the subject myself, you were lecturing the choir.

I prefer doing something to stop terrorism rather than just throwing open the doors and telling them to go for it. These guys cannot be appeased, they want our heads (literally). But one day everyone will wake up to that fact, but maybe it will be too late and then what constitution will anyone be referring to?

Rather than nitpick each other, we all need to get together and stop this stuff pretty darn quick. Good writing dude, I'm sure it enlightened folks.

593 posted on 07/22/2005 9:48:16 PM PDT by Tactical
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To: Oberon
If I have a reasonable suspicious that a crime (terrorism) may be committed and I see someone acting suspicious in the vacinity, I can shake them down for my own safety as well as the general publics safety. I'd rather see them use the term searching people that are acting suspicious.

But hey remove the cops if you like, it's not my subway. I don't ride on it. Still I hate to see people get hurt because someone decided to argue over terminology.

594 posted on 07/22/2005 9:52:07 PM PDT by Tactical
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To: savedbygrace
You apparently didn't read what I wrote. It is the RANDOM searches that are the problem.

Either search EVERYBODY or search all those who fit the profile/description. See my post #49.

I think what has everyone panties in a bunch is plain old fashion poor choice of wording, by using the word "RANDOM".

I for one, am for searching with probable cause any suspicious persons. Call it instinct, profiling or whatever you like, it's obvious a certain few in a well recognized group of people have been established as terrorists. I haven't seen many old ladies with shopping bags blow things up, but there have been a few guys from middle eastern backgrounds. So we should shake them down.

Heck I don't mind getting my stuff searched. Just hope the guy next to me isn't carrying an explosive and sets it off in the search line.

Look everyone, this is a no win situation for the cops. They want to help stop this stuff, but if we are just going to argue back and forth, then guess who wins? Yup the terrorists.

595 posted on 07/22/2005 10:00:29 PM PDT by Tactical
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To: SandyInSeattle

What does the stadium security do when you're legally carrying?

Do you inform them, first, or do they just discover it and ask to see your CCW?


596 posted on 07/22/2005 10:01:04 PM PDT by Sir_Ed
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To: RedRover

"You think it's unreasonable for the police to search backpacks of subway riders?"

Would you think it unreasonable to search every backpack of people walking down the sidewalk?

I'm not asking just rhetorically, I'm really curious, at what point do you think it is unreasonable?

And if you think it's okay to search everyone walking down the sidewalk, what about searching everyone's car, whenever they enter a metropolitan area?

After all, a car bomb will do more danger than a backpack bomb...


597 posted on 07/22/2005 10:06:20 PM PDT by Sir_Ed
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To: BurbankKarl

"There is no photography allowed on the MTA line"

What about people who can draw life-like pictures of the subway?

Seems like the only real solution is to paint all the windows black and blindfold all the riders, so they can't see their surroundings...


598 posted on 07/22/2005 10:11:07 PM PDT by Sir_Ed
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To: LifeOrGoods?

I have no idea what these officers are being told .. but if anybody in NYC is paying attention and is taking a clue from the UK and profiling - we'll end up safer in the end.

Somebody needs to tell the ACLU to pound sand. These people, for the most part, are not American citizens - and therefore have no "rights" afforded to them.

599 posted on 07/22/2005 10:24:38 PM PDT by CyberAnt (President Bush: "America is the greatest nation on the face of the earth")
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To: Sir_Ed

People are not being searched - only backpacks.

So .. I hope you enjoy being blown to bits.

But .. this whole thing is an offensive play .. in other words, if these bombers believe they will not be able to get into the tunnels, perhaps they will decide it's not worth the try.

600 posted on 07/22/2005 10:27:22 PM PDT by CyberAnt (President Bush: "America is the greatest nation on the face of the earth")
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