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‘Flip-flop’ faces new attacks as former wife beats cancer (KERRY UPDATE)
The Sunday Times ^
| September 19, 2004
| Sarah Baxter
Posted on 09/19/2004 1:21:23 AM PDT by MadIvan
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To: Capricam
http://www.americancatholic.org/Newsletters/CU/ac1002.asp
Ten Questions About Annulment
by Joseph M. Champlin
5 Does an annulment make the children illegitimate?
No. The parents, now divorced, presumably once obtained a civil license and entered upon a legal marriage. Children from that union are, therefore, their legitimate offspring. Legitimate means legal. The civil divorce and the Church annulment do not alter this situation. Nor do they change the parents responsibility toward the children. In fact, during annulment procedures the Church reminds petitioners of their moral obligation to provide for the proper upbringing of their children.
Nevertheless, persons pondering the Catholic annulment process do often express this concern about the legitimacy of the children after that procedure. Its a persistent rumor.
41
posted on
09/19/2004 5:56:52 AM PDT
by
maggief
To: MadIvan
So the girls are off buying jock straps with their father while their mother battles for her life.
What class.
42
posted on
09/19/2004 6:07:47 AM PDT
by
OldFriend
(It's the soldier, not the reporter who has given US freedom of the press)
To: maryz
You think maybe the church altered their annulment policies after Henry VIII?
43
posted on
09/19/2004 6:17:22 AM PDT
by
AFreeBird
(your mileage may vary)
To: Prime Choice; patriciamary
Money and political influence work wonders. Nonsense. Annulments are handed out like candy these days. Even the modest fee (usually a few hundred dollars, for time and paperwork) can be waived in the case of the poor.
The real problem is one of overall excessive granting of annulments, not one of corruption.
44
posted on
09/19/2004 6:22:32 AM PDT
by
B Knotts
("John Kerry, who says he doesn't like outsourcing, wants to outsource our national security.")
To: Prime Choice
Which means that his marriage to his first wife never happened and, for all intents and purposes, his children from that union are illegitimate.
Wonder how that makes the Kerry kids feel? Hell, wonder how it makes his first wife feel?
Someone, who was less compassionate, might claim they were a bunch of b*st*rds.
45
posted on
09/19/2004 6:31:13 AM PDT
by
punster
To: MadIvan
"Long after his divorce, Kerry went on to annul his marriage to Thorne in deference to his second wife, a Catholic. While Thorne did not contest the annulment, believing her husband had the right to remarry, she made no secret of her bitterness about the procedure. "
That always amazed me. EIGHTEEN years and TWO kids later the marriage is "annulled" as though it never happened. In the eyes of God it DID happen.
I suspect she may have some choice things to say about ole John, the gigolo. Teresa is the kind you ONLY Marry for money. I hear he was broke. I wonder, did ole John leave his first wife when he learned of her cancer or did he just drive her crazy?
46
posted on
09/19/2004 6:32:21 AM PDT
by
nmh
(Intelligent people recognize Intelligent Design (God).)
To: nopardons
Yeah, he is another extremist easily threatened - "ultra conservative talk show", "Republican dirty tricks" etc.. This author is a disgrace.
Is he aware of the fraudulent memos? They are the ultimate in Demoncrat dirty tricks with C- BS leading the way. That's a criminal; situation.
47
posted on
09/19/2004 6:35:08 AM PDT
by
nmh
(Intelligent people recognize Intelligent Design (God).)
To: maryz
"A church annulment says that the marriage did not meet the standard for the sacrament of matrimony."
If the parties could work out their differences then it would have continued to meet the "Sacrament of matrimony". Because the ole John and his wife couldn't stand each other anymore, a divorce, er "annulment" took place of the marriage of EIGHTEEN years with TWO kids! It's just a way for Catholics to get a divorce after paying off the priest.
In the eyes of God is has always been a legitimate marriage.
48
posted on
09/19/2004 6:38:49 AM PDT
by
nmh
(Intelligent people recognize Intelligent Design (God).)
To: MadIvan
Thorne is considering writing a book about her experience of illness, That's what we need, another book about surviving cancer.
49
posted on
09/19/2004 6:39:41 AM PDT
by
Casloy
To: Ichneumon
>Hell, wonder how it makes his first wife feel?
>It was disrespectful to me, it was aloof to any emotional issues and devoid of any sense of the humanity of what this means to me and the children, said Thorne.
(But I'm still voting for this man...what a man, indeed!)
50
posted on
09/19/2004 6:41:12 AM PDT
by
harbinger of doom
(Putting the "Fun" back in "Fundamental")
To: maggiefluffs
Does it matter that God sees this marriage as legitimate? Or is it all about making excuses for the Catholic Church to allow divorces? Don't answer. It's obviously a compromise from the Catholic church for divorce. NO where in the Bible is "annulment" allowed. It's a joke.
51
posted on
09/19/2004 6:41:47 AM PDT
by
nmh
(Intelligent people recognize Intelligent Design (God).)
To: MadIvan; All
Here's one thing (among many) the writer gets wrong:
There is absolutely NO evidence that Kerry ever in fact obtained the annulment. He APPLIED for it - not the same thing. He even joked at one point to some interviewer or reporter about applying for it. But in yet another "flip flop", he and his campaign have refused to confirm that he ever GOT it, and IIRC one campaign spokesman actually backtracked on it - which means of course that he never did get it. He and TeRAYza were married in a civil ceremony outside the church, so the church certainly didn't sanction his second marriage.
He's probably not only in mortal sin because he supports abortion on demand, he's also living in sin without his first marriage being annulled. How he can approach the Sacrament is a mystery to me.
BTW, annulments don't cost a lot of money, and they don't make children of the marriage illegitimate. I do think they have been handed out way too freely.
52
posted on
09/19/2004 6:49:11 AM PDT
by
AnAmericanMother
(. . . Ministrix of ye Chace (recess appointment), TTGC Ladies' Auxiliary . . .)
To: tkathy
Of all the bones I have to pick with the Catholic Church, that one is right up there near the top. I can hardly think about without wanting to spit.
My heart goes right out to Julia Thorne.
53
posted on
09/19/2004 7:02:32 AM PDT
by
Ladysmith
(Wanted: Pajamas designed with purple-hearted bandaids.)
To: MadIvan
On Rush Limbaughs hugely popular and ultra-conservative radio show, an advertisement about the candidates flip-flops a persistent Republican theme dominates most commercial breaks. The ad purports to sell anti-Kerry playing cards but is really an excuse to knock the candidate before an audience of millions. Oh! How completely terrible! Imagine, an ad that is really an excuse to knock the candidate! What an outrage. I'm shocked, I tell you. Positively shocked. Will these conservatives never cease being unjust to our dear Sir John? And that Rush Limbaugh person--he is apparently "ultra-conservative," of all things. This is dreadful, simply dreadful.
54
posted on
09/19/2004 7:43:37 AM PDT
by
Capriole
(DO NOT WRITE IN THIS SPACE. FOR OFFICIAL USE ONLY.)
To: MadIvan
Okay. . .can understand the 'lonliness' and the 'anger' - at being left alone, no doubt; but the 'FEAR'? Of not being able to get a good lawyer, should she need one or worse, perhaps.. .
Would bet it was Ted Kennedy that advised Kerry to get an annulment so as to keep a legitimate door open for his church-going-sacrament-receiving, phot-ops that Ted knew he would need.
55
posted on
09/19/2004 7:46:40 AM PDT
by
cricket
(Don't lose your head. . vote Republican. . .)
To: Lori675
Also, Teresa Heinz has a prenup with Kerry. If she passes away, all the Heinz money goes to her kids not Kerry.So you've read the prenup, the will and the trust...
56
posted on
09/19/2004 7:56:53 AM PDT
by
lewislynn
(Why do the same people who think "free trade" is the answer also want less foreign oil dependence?)
To: leadpenny
Yeah at some point if you go far enough right you meet the left coming round the other side.
57
posted on
09/19/2004 8:09:45 AM PDT
by
joesnuffy
( "Two Heads Are Better Than One"...."Unless They're On The Same Person" -Andy Sipowicz)
To: joesnuffy
The election of a divorced Catholic with Jewish ancestors would be a first in a lot of ways.
To: Prime Choice
Which means that his marriage to his first wife never happened and, for all intents and purposes, his children from that union are illegitimate. WRONG. An annullment does not make the children bastards. It's what anti-Catholics like to throw around but it's patently untrue.
Myth No. 2: "Annulments make children bastards"
To: Prime Choice
Which means that his marriage to his first wife never happened and, for all intents and purposes, his children from that union are illegitimate.Wonder how that makes the Kerry kids feel? Hell, wonder how it makes his first wife feel?
Can't be bothering her very much. - Friends have been reluctant to revisit this episode out of loyalty to Thorne and political support for Kerry. In one of her few public comments, Thorne herself has said she is backing Kerry 100% for the presidency.
60
posted on
09/19/2004 8:22:53 AM PDT
by
Capt. Tom
(Don't confuse the Bushies with the dumb republicans. - Capt. Tom)
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