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As a woman who understands what drove your girlfriends comments, I feel conflicted about your post.

I see how the comment, which she shouldn't have made, would kill the joy of giving.

Flowers ourchased on a whim as a stop-and-shop afterthought are fine, and a joy to receive out of the clear blue sky, especially from someone you want to love you.

Except...when that's all the thought that ever goes into the gesture.

I don't know how else to explain it to you other that to tell the secret code among women -

How much effort you put into a gift counts. It should be like a "kill" to impress us... your skill at the hunt matters.....because that establishes our worth to you, and among our peers getting flowers from their boyfriends, and proves your relative value as a provider and protector.

She's thinking, am I NEVER worth the effort for you to plan ahead, plot and plunder a bouquet made especially for me? The flowers ARE nice, but why do you always do it the EAASSSY way.

You say it's "always" late and night and the flower shop is closed - but florists are not always closed. You've had opportunity, one can call ahead and request a bouquet. Flowers can be delivered.

You only think of her when it's easy.

That reflects on how much you think of her and are trying to woo her.

Especially when there is a "gold standard" that young women secretly wish for...the exquisite bouquet hunted down by our dearest caveman, for no special occasion, because he wants a grand gesture for the grandest woman on earth.

Of course her words were cut you down and were counterproductive. She should have found another way to get the point across.

But I have to confess I would start to wonder after several stop-and-shop afterthought purchases, if you ever intended to go the full monty, if you even thought I was worth it.

Nothing personal, but I think you are probably off the mark. I think she just wants the fancy flowers from the big store. And the better jewelery from a better "brand" store.

If he brought her a cup of coffee she'd be embarassed that it wasn't from the french bakery down the road. I know and have known a gazillion women (and lately more and more men) like this. It's all about the status.

"How much effort you put into a gift counts. It should be like a "kill" to impress us... your skill at the hunt matters.....because that establishes our worth to you, and among our peers getting flowers from their boyfriends, and proves your relative value as a provider and protector."

You touch upon an excellent point here. The gifts that our mates give us can indeed be construed as outward symbols of our value and worth........and the more insecure one is about one's own worth, the more important those outward symbols become. I suspect that this gal has good reason to feel insecure about her own worth, and I doubt that she will ever attract a man who can give her what she demands. Why not? Because she behaves like a greedy, classless shrew.......and men who can afford big diamonds and fancy flowers tend to set their sights a bit higher. I'm glad that Chris has seen the light where this girl is concerned......I have a feeling that he can and will do much better.

I enjoyed reading your post #517 as it offered some insight into what some women tend to think and want. But please can you tell me why it is often said, "It's the thought that counts" when it appears that what this really means is "You need to do a grand gesture for me to make me feel like a treasure?"

I completely understand your logic and it makes PERFECT sense. In fact, this has helped me understand the feminine mind. lol. But what I don't understand are the games that are often played between people, and the complete shock, disappointment, and disgust when we silly men fail to read minds and anticipate every need some women seem to require.

If you could do a follow-up and answer my question, I would greatly appreciate it. I anxiously await your reply :-)