Kissinger and Chile The Myth That Will Not Die

American Enterprise Institute ^ | October 31, 2003 | By Mark Falcoff

[GoGophers]

Your links proved that many disappeared. There really is little to prove that Pinochet had them executed without a trial though. Thousands and thousands were detained. Most were released. Approx. 1200 were executed.

You have to avoid all rational thought to conclude that thousands of Chileans were tortured and executed without the knowledge of Pinochet. I suggest you spend a little (lot) more time on the following website.

http://www.lakota.clara.net/index.html

[TaxRelief]

Referring to a dictator who could at most have been responsible for 1200 deaths as "brutal", makes me wonder what you consider Sadam Hussein who gassed 100,000 of his own people including women and children.

Stop reading that liberal trash, and put things into perspective.

[Skywalk]

But that's not to what I'm referring. Sorry, if I gave that impression.

I'm stating what I've seen from your other posts. The meanings of terms like "generalization" or "underlying truths" or facts "in balance" do not seem easily comprehended by you.

Besides, people have challenged your assertions(and I've seen plenty of other sources that challenge it as well.) Do you have any other sources that support your view? Any by non-leftist sources? Heck, even center-left sources might be OK.

And who has the strongest amount of detail and historical facts on their side? All I ever hear from the Left are claims of "Coup," "brutality" and "disappearances." Thing is, who was disappeared? When did it happen? Who was actually expelled vs. who was killed? How were they killed, during the many skirmishes that could be defined as military in nature, or during outright executions?

BTW, How would a Soviet Pinochet have been able to turn his country around? No doubt by killing and jailing people merely on ideology. It's called de-Nazification or de-Communization. It means you're going to abrogate the basic rights of some individuals because they cannot even be allowed to stir up a conflict that will enslave your people and your country.

[Skywalk]

Dude you keep citing this Lakota source, but did you know that it attempts to "poke holes" in myths like the economic change in Chile?

It's purely leftist garbage. Anyone with half a brain would recognize and acknowledge that Chile's economic environment was vastly improved from the time Allende was in charge.

A site that tries to say that Pinochet's rule was ALL bad, even economically or that tries to lie about numbers or circumstances has ZERO CREDIBILITY.

Can I ask---are you a leftist?

[GoGophers]

http://www.derechoschile.com/derechos/dictadura_victimas_eng.html

[TaxRelief]

Are you aware that this is a conservative web forum? We generally are not interested in hanging around web sites sponsored by Amnesty International. (Being conservatives and American and all that...)

[Rodney King]

Stop reading that liberal trash, and put things into perspective

I second that motion. Gophers links named one guy who was murdered. The head of the communist party. The same group of people who abrogated the Chilean constitution, stole property from its rightful owners, and were planning Soviet Style food dislocation programs and firing squads. I'm glad Pinochet had the SOB killed.

[TaxRelief]

BTW, How would a Soviet Pinochet have been able to turn his country around? No doubt by killing and jailing people merely on ideology. It's called de-Nazification or de-Communization. It means you're going to abrogate the basic rights of some individuals because they cannot even be allowed to stir up a conflict that will enslave your people and your country.

You could almost call it a civil war with casualties. Most of those who "disappeared" did so in the early Pinochet days.

[Rodney King]

"In Chile, there exists a high degree of consensus, that during the military regime, human rights were repeatedly violated with the aim of annihilating the political opposition to the regime as a necessary condition for laying the foundations of a new state whilst making the economic model of this new state a reality."

That is the quote from one of they guys on the page you just cited. You know what, he's exactly right. Pinochet wanted to wipe out the marxists, the same bunch that had murdered 100 million people already in the century and were planning the same for Chile. Good for him.

[TaxRelief]

At the end of November 1976, the men and women concentration camp prisoners were transferred to the Tres Alamos camp in Santiago. Then the iron gates opened and they were free to go. Nobody ever provided any explanation as to why they had spent one, two or three years of their lives behind those wire fences."

Gee, if they didn't know by then they couldn't have been too bright. I've heard that prison camp gossip spreads like wild fire.

...then the iron gates opened and they were free to go.

Why didn't these folks get exterminated? That's not consistent with a "brutal dictator".

[Huber]

A Soviet Pinochet would have been refered to by the New York Times as "Uncle Augusto", someone "with a few embarassing foibles, and perhaps a little rough around the edges, but someone we can work with."

[TaxRelief]

Can you imagine what the situation in the US would be like today, if Pinochet had lost out to the Marxists. I dread the thought. I just don't understand why these young people so easily succumb to this Communist nonsense. I can understand kids getting suckered in 40 years ago, but today, after all the history that shows the abuses and the failures of communistic rule? Is it possible that they crave the violence?

[Rodney King]

I can understand kids getting suckered in 40 years ago, but today, after all the history that shows the abuses and the failures of communistic rule? Is it possible that they crave the violence?

It's not that, its that they are conditioned to beleive that always assuming that your nation is the wrong is somehow a sign of intelligence and indpendence.

[GoGophers]

Are you aware that this is a conservative web forum?

Try dealing with the facts on the websites.

[GoGophers]

Gophers links named one guy who was murdered.

Try again.

[GoGophers]

Gee, if they didn't know by then they couldn't have been too bright. I've heard that prison camp gossip spreads like wild fire.

Gee, maybe they did not have any specific charges brought against them.

[GoGophers]

Why didn't these folks get exterminated? That's not consistent with a "brutal dictator".

Some Iraqis survived years in the prisons of Saddam Hussein.

[GoGophers]

Pinochet wanted to wipe out the marxists, the same bunch that had murdered 100 million people already in the century and were planning the same for Chile. Good for him.

And the Socialists, union leaders, religious leaders, leaders of the Popular Unity government, university professors,...

[Huber]

What "history"? Exactly who do you think is actually teaching these kids anything to do with any history other than the "history of oppression" by white Europeans?

[Huber]

Religious leaders? Do you mean the Marxist Jesuit Liberation Theologians?