Posted on 09/28/2005 10:35:01 AM PDT by SunkenCiv
Mahogany Ship searcher Mark Rawson and his team confidently asserted Ms Crowe's coin was Phoenician but Ms Murphy said she doubted it, although she was unsure of the coin's exact origins... "I believe it came from Holland maybe. It was with a lot of Dutch coins I have." ...Ms Murphy said she was under the impression it was some kind of token perhaps from the First or Second World War.
(Excerpt) Read more at the.standard.net.au ...
To all -- please ping me to other topics which are appropriate for the GGG list. Thanks.Myth multipliesTHE team of Mahogany Ship hunters that found 3600-year-old non-native wood last year told the weekend's symposium they were aware of the locations of a number of "Mahogany Ships".
by Matt Neal
September 26, 2005
Group spokesman Mark Rawson said that as well as the site near Levys Point where they found about 60 ancient olive samples, they had discovered a number of new sites where they believed shipwrecks were buried.
He said he believed one of the sites was related to claims made recently by Canberra mathematician Dr Frank Coningham that the British government ordered the burial of a Portuguese wreck in Kelly's Swamp near Levys Point.
"We think Coningham was right (and) we've located the position of where the boat was dumped," Mr Rawson said.
"There's at least more than one ship (but) they're not all ancient. They're from different times."
Mr Rawson and his team used divining rods on Saturday to search an area and said they believed they had found at least one buried ship that was about 20 metres long.
He said he did not know what origin the ships were but suggested Phoenician, Egyptian, Chinese and Portuguese.
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A Chinese ship made of Indonesian mahogany? Believeable.
The group from the second message indicates 3600 year old olive wood, which points to the Mediterranean basin.
I'm not a coin collector, and the image could be better, but I'm a bit baffled. The horse suggested India, but I've found no online match (not even the style). Here's an example of an Indian coin with a horse:
http://www.med.unc.edu/~nupam/kun.GIF
I've got an image (on the drive) of a coin of Apulia (pre- Roman Empire Italy), and another of Orthosia (Caria, in Anatolia), each of which is slightly suggestive of the style. But no match.
"The complex was first discovered by Val Osborn in 1990. Almost a decade of research has indicated it to be a typical Phoenician Colony settlement of the ancient sea kings of around 1000BC. Such sites exist the World over and presently generate enormous controversy among historians and other academics."
more about Val Osborne:
Phoenicians in Australia?
http://phoenicia.org/australia.html
This Phoenician copy of a half-dollar-size coin from ancient Syracuse may provide definitive evidence supporting Professor Mark McMenamin's theory that the ancient Phoenicians were the first Old World explorers in the New World. The coin's Punic (Phoenician) horse is flanked by an uprooted palm tree representing Phoenicia. McMenamin wonders if the dangling roots may indicate the travelers' intent to "transplant" Phoenician culture to the New World.
Phoenicians in north america would explain what happened to all the missing copper in north america.
Huge amounts of copper ore where excavated in unknown times, but the natives didn't do it. It's against their religion and they didn't had the tools and expertise for it. Ofcourse the riddle remains: where they brought the copper to! Maybe it was aliens afterall.
I thought there was a theory concerning egyptians in Australia? They had some F A S C I N A T I N G evidence,.
like the image of a deity of the aboriginals (Wandjina, the gods that came from the sky) with weird markings on it's head.
So it looked like a language and nooone could translate it, till someone noticed it's uncanny resemblance to old egyptian (not standard hieroglyphs). Literally translated and pronounced it would read 'Wondjina'. Indeed the very name of the deity painted. Where it to be coincidence, what are the odds!
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Oak Timber, not the Mahogany ShipIn July 1999, shipwreck enthusiast, Mr Des Williams, discovered a sample of wood buried 3.1 metres under the sand dunes between Warrnambool and Port Fairy. It was identified by the CSIRO as Quercus species - White Oak. According to the CSIRO, "This wood is from a group of oaks and could have originated from the USA or Europe. It is a common shipbuilding timber." |
I've read about the PreColumbian copper ore extraction (having grown up in Michigan), and I'd not be too surprised if those operations served the needs of some kind of trade; however, while there is no accounting for the estimated quantity extracted, it may just not have been found. There's not much reason to think that trade wasn't as extensive in the Americas as it was elsewhere, particularly since I'm always willing to consider transoceanic traffic.
That said, I'd say the windows of time to be considered would be periods when the climate was warmest, when the Arctic melted for navigation (which happened during the Medieval Warming, and the previous warming period was even warmer), permitting access to Hudson's Bay and the rivers flowing into it, and thus down into Lake Superior (the mines are in the Upper Peninsula of Michigan).
Extracting secrets from ancient woodThey sent samples of the wood to CSIRO for species identification. The wood was found to be from the olive family, which is not local to the area, though the species is found elsewhere in Australia as well as overseas. Encouraged, they decided to have it dated and samples were sent to Australian Nuclear Science and Technology Organisation (ANSTO) for radiocarbon dating. "We treated the samples to extract cellulose, then converted the carbon to graphite, for measurement in our accelerator," says ANSTO's Geraldine Jacobsen. "In isolating the cellulose, the assumption is that the carbon being tested comes solely from the tree and not from other sources... "The carbon in the cellulose turned out to be very old - more than 3000 years old, in fact," said Geraldine. "This was surprising. Usually an older date can be a result of contamination from carbonates (a source of old carbon), so we decided to treat the cellulose again, to remove possible carbonate contamination. We ended up with the same result."
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