Posted on 11/30/2021 1:52:55 PM PST by rebuildus
Our world needs good churches more than ever!
Yet, unfortunately, from my experience, they seem to be in short supply.
I have a fair amount of experience with churches. I’ve experienced the good, the bad, the ugly, and the in-between.
I’ve finally arrived at the conclusion that–as in many areas of life–it’s time that we learned from each other.
The model for churches we typically see–no matter the kind of church–is off. Typically, in one form or another, the pastor/minister seems to think it is his (or her–these days) duty to teach us, even though Jesus pointedly warned to “let no man teach us.”
So that’s number one.
This world has far too many “leaders,” “teachers,” and “gurus.” Many of them swear they are not teaching us, as they go about teaching us!
Much damage has been done through external “teaching,” even if that teaching is technically correct. If that teaching is not correct in any serious way–the result can be disastrous as I have pointed out in past posts.
It’s time for a new paradigm.
Testimony I have been fortunate to have attended two unconventional churches that emphasized communication between the minister and the congregation. I participated in useful discussion of spiritual, cultural, and even political matters. Yet, even in this environment, it became easy for the minister to turn it into a “teaching” session, instead of a place where personal testimony and understanding is shared by all.
Testimony can come through anyone, and when this is well-understood, powerful things can happen.
I’d really like to see the presiding minister act as more of a guide and facilitator of discussion and testimony rather than the principle source of wisdom.
All things considered, I am grateful to have seen the two-way communication model used effectively. I believe it should be a cornerstone.
However, the unconventional churches I attended tended to be light on Bible scripture–one was quite selective and used primarily the scripture that bolstered the pastor’s corrupted point of view.
Scripture is something of a two-edged sword–it can be grossly overused and just thrown out there as instructions that we already know in our own conscience. It can be dead. It can be quoted by congregants constantly, to the point of incredible annoyance!
Yet, scripture can also be quite useful as a corrective tool, if the minister’s pronouncements get too far away from actual truth. Looking back, actually reading or hearing certain scripture passages could have saved me–and my family–years of grief!
“All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness”
2 Timothy 3:16 King James Bible We need good churches NOW! In this current day, with so much deceit and treachery abounding; with so many of us being “cancelled” out of society through “vaccine” mandates and the like, we need good churches more than ever.
In an age of forced social isolation, we need fellowship with like-minded people more than we ever have.
We need to gather together, fellowship together, help each other stay healthy and find fulfilling work–and if necessary, hire each other and assist each other in starting businesses (especially now that the work environment can be so hostile to us).
We need to teach each other the skills of living independently of “the system” that seeks to subjugate us.
What form can this take? Governments have increasingly made it difficult for churches to operate in freedom. This happens even in America, the place that ironically has a government that was formed to limit its ability to attack our freedoms!
Sure, it would be great to see powerful churches form in the city and in the country. But, for many reasons, a standard church is just one limited option. We can gather in private residences, in parks, online through web conference, and even in casual ways such as calling each other on a traditional or video phone.
The point is to COME TOGETHER! This is what the elite who seek to control us fear. But in one form or another–come together we must!
Since I have come clean about the double life of sin I was leading which was destroying myself and my family, my family has become much closer. We essentially conduct our own “church service” on a regular basis. Just by seeking God and communicating honestly with others, we are “having church.”
Now, I understand that our first “church” is inside our own body–the temple of the spirit–that a corrupt minister helped me defile. So I always encourage people to meditate or pray to get in touch with the Spirit that guides us.
This is always the first priority.
Yet, it is important that we “not neglect our assemblies,” as Hebrews 10:25 exhorts us, for all the reasons I stated above. Our very lives may depend on us insisting that we meet regularly with like-minded people.
And I hope that our assemblies are as useful as possible, given that I have seen many examples of what works, and what doesn’t work well in church services. Some may prefer the comfort of staying in a church that they are not totally happy with, instead of being willing to find or create something that does benefit them as it should.
That’s their decision, but it’s not what I seek and what I believe many others seek too.
I’m basically an optimist, and believe that if there is a need, then there is a solution–perhaps right in front of us… we just have to be open to seeing that solution, and to taking one step at a time toward fulfilling it.
Patrick Rooney is the Founder of OldSchoolUs.com. He communicates clearly and fearlessly during perilous times about natural health, success, and freedom. To reach Patrick, email him at info@oldschoolus.com.
I direct you to Revelation Chapters 2 and 3 where Jesus writes letters to the seven types of churches that will be present in the period of time covered by Revelation up to His Return at the start of The Day of the LORD. Since the Revelation 12:1-2 Great Sign was over four years ago, we can consider ourselves well and truly in the Book of Revelation. Let him who has ears hear what the Spirit is saying to the churches.
“This world has far too many “leaders,” “teachers,” and “gurus.” Many of them swear they are not teaching us, as they go about teaching us!”
I’d really like to see the presiding minister act as more of a guide and facilitator of discussion and testimony rather than the principle source of wisdom.
However, the unconventional churches I attended tended to be light on Bible scripture–one was quite selective and used primarily the scripture that bolstered the pastor’s corrupted point of view.”
LOL
There has never been a need for a new kind of church. There is the Church Jesus founded. That‘s sufficient.
You were calling the rapture a couple of years ago in late fall, what became of that?
There is great benefit and I think need for Bible scholar to lead.
Taken literally, the Bible contains passages that can appear contradictory. The subject matter is both simple and difficult. And yes, people can and should study the Bible on their own, asking for guidance from the Holy Spirit.
I would not trust a random group of well-intentioned but not Bibles scholars to reliably get the right messages. By nature we are self-centered, and Satan is powerful that way.
I’m spoiled, I know, by having grown up in and accustomed to LCMS doctrine and teaching, so take my remarks with that bias. Even that institution went through a schism not so many years ago.
So the historical sermons of Jonathan Edwards, Charles Spurgeon, Donald Gray Barnhouse et. al. (not to mention the writings of that Paul fellow) don’t mesh with wannabe Pastor Laodicea?
Where is this found in scripture?
Obviously, we had misunderstood the symbology of the Book of The Revelation. The doctrines of a “seven year tribulation”, and “one rapture of the Bride of Christ” turned out to have been false teachings not based on the Bible. However, they were taught with sincerity, and were useful in filling the time (2 days or 2000 years) between the Christ’s first and second comings.
Brenda Weltner, who thought the same way I did back then, seems to have figured most of it out, now, and is presenting what appears to be getting closer and closer to the final answer. Her explaination seems to fit really well with every part of the Bible that talks about these days. She is currently going through a lesson showing haw Matthew 24 maps to the Seven Seals of Revelation.
Here is her YouTube channel.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCnatAaTTPCHsmSfiR8aBwGQ
God gave teachers to the church as a gift.
“ 11 And he gave the apostles, the prophets, the evangelists, the shepherds and teachers, 12 to equip the saints for the work of ministry, for building up the body of Christ…
Thank you, SubMareener
Otherwise, much of the New Testament would be thrown out as they are teachings from men (inspired by God, yes, but still penned by men).
Thank you, Cboldt. We ALL have our own biases!
Jesus pointedly warned to “let no man teach us.”
Where is this found in scripture?
“Nor are you to be called instructors, for you have one Instructor, the Messiah.”—John 23:10
God gave teachers to the church as a gift.
“ 11 And he gave the apostles, the prophets, the evangelists, the shepherds and teachers, 12 to equip the saints for the work of ministry, for building up the body of Christ…
May be a “word” issue, because, as I just pointed out to another poster...
“Nor are you to be called instructors, for you have one Instructor, the Messiah.”—Mathew 23:10
And I’m sure I could find other instances. One obvious one is Jesus’ statement that, “The kingdom of Heaven is within.” If that’s the case (and I believe it is), then why would we need an external teacher?
That took a “backseat” when he got wrapped up in homosexual love affair with his pastor.
This sort of question is a great one to put before a person who has studied the Greek and Hebrew, and who has studied and pondered (with others) the context of the statements.
A good pastor is a gift from God. And a good pastor will cite the original, as well as his understanding of it — and from there the impression it makes in any one person’s mind is up to the Holy Spirit.
Since God clearly state He gave teachers to the church, they are necessary.
Here is a literal Greek translation…
“ Ephesians 4:7–16 (WUESTNT): And He himself gave some, on the one hand, as apostles, and, on the other hand, as prophets, and still again some as bringers of good news, and finally, some as pastors who are also teachers, for the equipping of the saints for ministering work with a view to the building up of the Body of Christ, until we all attain to the unity of the Faith and of the experiential, full, and precise knowledge of the Son of God, to a spiritually mature man, to the measure of the stature of the fulness of the Christ,”
In Greek, it says God gave us “pastors who are also teachers” to equipping the Body of Christ.”
The Apostle Paul, under inspiration wrote in Romans AND Corinthians …
“ Having gifts that differ according to the grace given to us, let us use them: if prophecy, in proportion to our faith; 7 if service, in our serving; the one who teaches, in his teaching; 8 the one who exhorts, in his exhortation; the one who contributes, in generosity…”
“ And God has appointed in the church first apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then miracles, then gifts of healing, helping, administrating, and various kinds of tongues.”
Teaching is a gift God gives to the church.
It is His doing.
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