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Fueling America: the Oceans Aren’t Just For Fish Anymore
MOTUS A.D. ^ | 3-22-19 | MOTUS

Posted on 03/22/2019 6:57:28 AM PDT by NOBO2012

Do you remember the stories about cars running on water? The general storyline ran something like this: somebody invented a car that ran on water and GM squelched it to maintain their market share of the combustion engine – and our dependence on expensive fossil fuel instead of cheap, clean, renewable water. The urban legend began before the age of the internet, but has been greatly enhanced since then to include tales of assassinations and nefarious suppression of technologies that would save the planet. It also provided some actual scientific explanations of how water can be converted to energy, like this from Popular Mechanics:

There is energy in water. Chemically, it's locked up in the atomic bonds between the hydrogen and oxygen atoms. When the hydrogen and oxygen combine, whether it's in a fuel cell, internal combustion engine running on hydrogen, or a jury-rigged pickup truck with an electrolysis cell in the bed, there's energy left over in the form of heat or electrons. That's converted to mechanical energy by the pistons and crankshaft or electrical motors to move the vehicle.

Unfortunately PM editors also pointed out the constraints of harnessing that energy:

Problem: It takes exactly the same amount of energy to pry those hydrogen and oxygen atoms apart inside the electrolysis cell as you get back when they recombine inside the fuel cell. The laws of thermodynamics haven't changed, in spite of any hype you read on some blog or news aggregator. Subtract the losses to heat in the engine and alternator and electrolysis cell, and you're losing energy, not gaining it--period. 

There are those pesky “laws of thermodynamics” again, screwing with the energy do-gooders of the world.

And then the Thermodynamic Fairies screw everything up

But finally, good news for the Green New World Order people: Rejoice! Your prayers to Gaia have been answered, sort of:

Scientists at Stanford report that they have overcome one of the biggest hurdles to converting the oceans to a renewable energy farm:

A team of scientists at Stanford have figured out a way to make hydrogen fuel out of saltwater. The discovery could open up the world's oceans as a potential source of energy. Researchers view electrolysis, or the act of splitting water into hydrogen and gas, as a promising new source of renewable energy. But it comes with many roadblocks; a major one being that only purified water can be used in electrolysis. Seawater tends to corrode water-splitting systems.

The Stanford team is on the verge of licking that corrosive problem as well:

The Stanford team layered nickel-iron hydroxide and nickel sulfide on top of a nickel foam core, essentially creating a barrier that would slow down the decay of the underlying metal. By acting as a conductor, the nickel foam transports energy from the power source and the nickel-iron hydroxide sparks the electrolysis.

What happens without the nickel coating? The water-splitting device lasts roughly 12 hours, unable to withstand seawater corrosion. But with the nickel layer, the device can keep going for more than a thousand hours.

While researchers concede we’re a long way from harnessing the oceans as a “sustainable” energy source, and the results have not been replicated outside Stanford’s research labs, scientists are hopeful that their discovery will finally pave the way for hydrogen fueland cars that really do run on water.

So there you have it: Clean, renewable, CO2 free hydrogen to fuel all our energy needs! Zero carbon air flight, just like AOC wants. What could possibly go wrong?

Posted from: MOTUS A.D.




TOPICS: Humor; Politics
KEYWORDS: climatechange; co2; energy; greennewdeal

1 posted on 03/22/2019 6:57:28 AM PDT by NOBO2012
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To: NOBO2012

perhaps a philanthropic motor company will buy out this start up and squelch this plan to burn all humanity...


2 posted on 03/22/2019 7:04:13 AM PDT by teeman8r (Armageddon won't be pretty, but it's not like it's the end of the world.)
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To: NOBO2012

Hey, the Stanley Steamer ran on water. Sort of. A high school friend of mine used to noodle around with the idea of a microwave Stanley Steamer, but...physics.


3 posted on 03/22/2019 7:05:54 AM PDT by gundog ( Hail to the Chief, bitches!)
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To: NOBO2012
Electrolysis requires energy.
Where does the energy come from and how long does it last?

4 posted on 03/22/2019 7:14:51 AM PDT by BitWielder1 (I'd rather have Unequal Wealth than Equal Poverty.)
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To: NOBO2012

What energy source is used to power the electrolysis cell?

Nice picture of burning aluminum, BTW.


5 posted on 03/22/2019 7:20:28 AM PDT by NorthMountain (... the right of the peopIe to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed)
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To: NOBO2012

The Martians were far ahead of us Earthlings. Unfortunately, they used-up all their water and thus we find only evidence that there ever was water on Mars. The same fate awaits us here on the blue marble. Just wait and sea.


6 posted on 03/22/2019 7:26:51 AM PDT by CARTOUCHE (Mrs. Pelosi, have you no sense of decency? Have you any sense?)
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To: gundog

These run on FREE WATER and FREE AIR. Can't beat that.

; ]

7 posted on 03/22/2019 7:29:18 AM PDT by UCANSEE2 (Lost my tagline on Flight MH370. Sorry for the inconvenience.)
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To: All
I hope they all get security guards :)

I have read about the scientists that come up dead after great inventions and their work mysteriously disappears.
8 posted on 03/22/2019 7:38:06 AM PDT by ssfromla
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To: NOBO2012

You obviously have not learned that Democrats don’t have to worry about silly things like “rules”. Phooey on your thermodynamics.


9 posted on 03/22/2019 7:38:18 AM PDT by wastoute (Government cannot redistribute wealth. Government can only redistribute poverty.)
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To: UCANSEE2

Your gonna wear your damn arm out putting one of those in space.


10 posted on 03/22/2019 7:39:30 AM PDT by wastoute (Government cannot redistribute wealth. Government can only redistribute poverty.)
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To: UCANSEE2

Loved those as a lil boy even when i got a black eye from one


11 posted on 03/22/2019 7:55:38 AM PDT by al baby (Hi Mom Hi Dad)
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To: NOBO2012
Just over a year ago several media outlets reported that John Kanzius, an amateur inventor from Erie, Pa., had discovered a seemingly impossible phenomenon: a way to burn salt water by exposing it to radio waves. Videos of the experiment became YouTube sensations, though they garnered as many critical comments as favorable ones. Now that the initial fervor has waned, we checked in with Kanzius, a collaborator and some critics to see how the technique has progressed, or if it's just another example of Web-propelled junk science.

Kanzius' concept is simple: expose salt water to 13.56 MHz radio waves and light a match. Hydrogen separates from the water mixture and burns for as long as it's exposed to the frequency. The inventor actually made this discovery by accident: He was looking for a cure for cancer. Kanzius demonstrated it to local TV news stations as well as to Rustum Roy, a Penn State University geochemistry professor emeritus.

Roy collaborated with Kanzius on a paper confirming that radio frequency waves do indeed dissociate salt water into hydrogen and oxygen, and that the resulting mixture can be burned. News of the discovery was published in Materials Research Innovations (download PDF), a journal founded by Roy himself.

Burning hydrogen and oxygen to create energy is nothing new: It's been done in machines and automobiles for years. But the difference with Kanzius' would-be breakthrough is that the effect can be achieved with a much lower energy catalyst: radio waves are present in everything from microwaves to televisions. Roy cautions, however, that efficiency is still a major hurdle: "Nobody is claiming that you get more energy out than you put in," he says.

International interest in the technique has been huge, according to Kanzius and Roy. They say that researchers in countries such as France have begun using radio frequency in experiments that call for separating hydrogen from water. However, domestic investors have not been forthcoming, and the scientific community has been dubious. Richard Saykally, a chemistry professor at the University of California at Berkeley, called the recent paper's claims "pseudo-science" in an interview with Chemical and Engineering News.

Gary Friedman, a professor in the Electrical and Computer Engineering departments at Drexel University in Philadelphia, says Kanzius' discovery is far from groundbreaking. "People have reported for some time that electromagnetic radiation can enhance or affect water hydrolysis," he says. Still, he's not completely uninterested in their claims. "It seems promising, if it's true, that the electrolysis of water can be carried out without electrodes." Because electrodes wear out or change their behavior over time, Kanzius' method may require less maintenance than traditional electrolysis, which uses an electric current to separate hydrogen from water.

Kanzius and Roy hope that the increasing focus on the environment will enable them to get funding to continue their research. They even envision a future in which a vehicle can run off its radio's frequency waves.

But don't start filling your gas tank with salt water just yet.

https://www.popularmechanics.com/science/a2840/4271398
12 posted on 03/22/2019 8:28:17 AM PDT by ckilmer
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To: UCANSEE2

I’ll bet the effort to pump them up is about equal to the energy expended in getting them to fly, though. Maybe fill them with gas and fire them through an ignition source.

It’s probably just as well I didn’t have access to much gas when I had those rockets.


13 posted on 03/22/2019 9:08:49 AM PDT by gundog ( Hail to the Chief, bitches!)
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To: AdmSmith; AnonymousConservative; Arthur Wildfire! March; Berosus; Bockscar; cardinal4; ColdOne; ...
Where's Steven Hyde when ya need him?
Ancient omnibus, most of the links are probably goners:
Hydrogen Economy
by Shirin Wheeler
Wednesday, 21 August, 2002, 14:21 GMT 15:21 UK
To make hydrogen you need water and electricity. Iceland has plenty of water. It can also produce electricity cheaply and cleanly, hydropower from its glacial rivers and waterfalls. From its craters and crevices, huge stores of underground heat. Only 5% of geothermal power has been tapped so far. One day, Iceland thinks it could use it to provide enough green electricity to make hydrogen for itself and to export to other parts of the world... "When water is zapped with electricity and electrolysed, it splits into oxygen and hydrogen. In Iceland they'll use geothermal and hydropower to make that clean electricity. Other countries could use power from wind or the sun. The hydrogen fuel can then be used to power an electric motor via fuel cells in a vehicle acting like a generator. The only emission is pure water."
Hydrogen's Dirty Secret
by Barry C. Lynn
By launching an ambitious program to develop what he calls the "Freedom Car," Bush seemed determined to realize the kind of future that hydrogen-car supporters have envisioned for years. Using existing technology, hydrogen can be easily and cleanly extracted from water. Electricity generated by solar panels and wind turbines is used to split the water's hydrogen atoms from its oxygen atoms. The hydrogen is then recombined with oxygen in fuel cells, where it releases electrons that drive an electric motor in a car.
The Week
January 18-24 2002
The car of the future (p 9) has a picture of the fuel cell powered vehicle from GM, the Autonomy, but is far better than some articles on this technology. Apparently not written by a cheerleader, the article notes (for the first time I've noticed in years in a popular magazine) that "even in compressed form, hydrogen gas takes up so much space that a car's tank would have to be 3,000 times the size of a standard gasoline tank to store the same amount of energy." This is because liquid fuels are always more dense by definition than gaseous fuels. Toting the hydrogen around in liquid form -- at minus 422 degrees -- would require energy for refrigeration and "robots to work the pumps, so motorists' hands wouldn't be in danger of freezing and breaking off."
Toyota Shines at Tokyo Show With Gasoline-Fuel Cell SUV
"The company, fuel cell r&d development partner with General Motors, unveiled its new FCHV-5 at the 35th Tokyo Motor Show Oct. 27-Nov.9, the fifth-generation experimental vehicle in its fuel cell hybrid series. The new vehicle employs a reformer to extract hydrogen from a still to be developed 'clean hydrocarbon' fuel... 'Clean' hydrocarbon fuel is a euphemism for gasoline from which sulfur has been removed."
Researchers Succeed In Fueling Up
by Jane Brooks
The principle behind fuel cells is not new-it was discovered in 1839... Basically, a fuel cell is a device-think of it as a high-tech battery-that converts the energy of a fuel (hydrogen, natural gas, etc.) and an oxidant (air or oxygen) into useable electricity... There are no moving parts and it produces little noise. Unlike traditional combustion engines that currently dominate the energy market, fuel cells do not produce any particulate matter, nitrogen or sulfur oxides; when fueled by pure hydrogen, they have only heat and water as by-products... To date, hydrogen has been the conventional fuel for a fuel cell. But practical generation and storage of hydrogen has been a problem-it's expensive and inefficient. The model developed by Gorte's team aims to get around this dilemma... Previous attempts to use hydrocarbon fuels to run a solid-oxide fuel cell failed because the electrochemical process that generates electricity caused a buildup of carbon, which ruined the cell. In a solid-oxide fuel cell, oxygen anions are transported through an oxide membrane and react with the fuel at the anode... The Penn researchers were looking for an anode material that did not result in fouling... Eventually, they settled on a composite of copper and ceria. Ceria is an important catalytic component of automotive catalysis, which is why the researchers focused on its properties... Says Gorte, "Running a car is a transient process and you've got to have a pretty big fuel cell to power it, something on the order of 50kw as opposed to a 5kw cell to power a house, for instance." ...At least one major automotive manufacturer is seriously studying this technology... Their work has generated a great deal of excitement and was touted in Nature magazine (3/16/00). Professor Gorte has been interviewed by MSNBC.
Neutralizing Diesel's Idle Threat
by John Gartner
02:00 AM Oct. 10, 2002 PT


Fuel-cell future for gasoline?
by Miguel Llanos
March 15, 2000
"We've demonstrated that we can run a fuel cell directly on hydrocarbons like gasoline and diesel," researcher Ray Gorte told MSNBC. "In the past, everyone assumed you had to use hydrogen." ...The new process not only gets around the problem of delivering and storing hydrogen, Gorte says, it means a fuel cell that produces "less carbon dioxide for a given amount of energy" than other fuel cells because higher efficiency can be achieved... [I]t could provide a valuable interim technology that's easier to deploy and still provide much cleaner and higher mileage than internal combustion engines... Gorte, head of chemical engineering at the University of Pennsylvania, sees the research as a "breakthrough," saying an earlier attempt to use gasoline essentially required putting "a refinery in your trunk" to get the hydrogen... Gorte's team used a "solid oxide fuel cell," while others have tended to focus on "proton-exchange membranes." ...One hitch is that the cell is sensitive to sulfur, so that gasoline would have to be cleaned further to make it a viable fuel... Gorte is optimistic about its potential, saying his team hopes to work with a major car company that has created a solid oxide fuel cell division. He would not identify the company, saying he wasn't sure if it was willing to go public yet... Kevin Kendall, a chemical engineer at Britain's University of Birmingham, writes in a Nature article accompanying the study that while hydrogen is "the ultimate clean power source of the future" it is still expensive to extract it, difficult to store and prone to explosion.
Fuel-cell future for gasoline?
by Miguel Llanos
March 15, 2000
"We've demonstrated that we can run a fuel cell directly on hydrocarbons like gasoline and diesel," researcher Ray Gorte told MSNBC. "In the past, everyone assumed you had to use hydrogen." ...The new process not only gets around the problem of delivering and storing hydrogen, Gorte says, it means a fuel cell that produces "less carbon dioxide for a given amount of energy" than other fuel cells because higher efficiency can be achieved... [I]t could provide a valuable interim technology that's easier to deploy and still provide much cleaner and higher mileage than internal combustion engines... Gorte, head of chemical engineering at the University of Pennsylvania, sees the research as a "breakthrough," saying an earlier attempt to use gasoline essentially required putting "a refinery in your trunk" to get the hydrogen... Gorte's team used a "solid oxide fuel cell," while others have tended to focus on "proton-exchange membranes." ...One hitch is that the cell is sensitive to sulfur, so that gasoline would have to be cleaned further to make it a viable fuel... Gorte is optimistic about its potential, saying his team hopes to work with a major car company that has created a solid oxide fuel cell division. He would not identify the company, saying he wasn't sure if it was willing to go public yet... Kevin Kendall, a chemical engineer at Britain's University of Birmingham, writes in a Nature article accompanying the study that while hydrogen is "the ultimate clean power source of the future" it is still expensive to extract it, difficult to store and prone to explosion.
Sugar: Future Fuel?
by Paul Beck
This new procedure, which produces hydrogen from glucose and related carbohydrates, was developed by chemical engineers James Dumesic, Randy Cortright and Rupali Davda at the University of Wisconsin-Madison. A platinum-based catalyst breaks down the carbohydrates into carbon monoxide and hydrogen gas. The carbon monoxide reacts with water to produce carbon dioxide and more hydrogen. Everything happens in one container, with the liquid solution under pressure at a relatively low 400?F. That, according to Cortright, makes it well-suited for onboard reforming in a fuel cell car; other reforming methods, he says, have required temperatures four times hotter. Glucose is a renewable sugar. It is already mass-produced from corn and can also be derived from many kinds of biomass waste... DaimlerChrysler... points out that "vast amounts of space" would be required to grow enough plants to fuel America's auto fleet. Still, the auto giant is interested enough in the Wisconsin project to provide some funding for further research.
Going Nuts For A Hydrogen-fuelled Future
February 2000
Looking for the fuel of the future? There's one in every bite. Turkey, the world's biggest producer of hazelnuts, burns 250,000 tonnes of the shells every year as waste. If, instead, it burnt them in a controlled environment with restricted oxygen, it could extract 6000 tonnes of hydrogen - enough to allow a thousand prototype hydrogen-fuelled BMWs to travel 32,500 kilometres each.
Plankton Power
New Scientist
Tiny marine plants and animals can provide limitless power for small electric devices. Plankton in seawater and sediment use different chemical reactions to obtain their energy. This sets up a natural potential difference between the seawater and the sediment a few centimetres beneath. A device called OSCAR (Ocean Sediment Carbon Aerobic Reactor) taps into this tiny voltage. Leonard Tender of the US Naval Research Laboratory believes his system would be ideal for powering oceanographic sensors, whose batteries currently need to be replaced constantly.
The Department of Energy's Biohydrogen Research Program
by Maria L Ghirardi and Michael Seibert
A recent discovery at ORNL demonstrated that hydrogen production from a green algal Chlamydomonas reinhardtii mutant cannot easily be explained by the Z-scheme, the standard model of photosynthesis. Too much hydrogen was produced to be accounted for by this model. These results may have implications for designing a commercial BioHydrogen organism with improved energetic conversion efficiencies of hydrogen production, especially in the context of the light saturation problem.
Abstract Number:1027
by Maria L Ghirardi and Michael Seibert
The hydrogen metabolism of photosynthetic bacteria and cyanobacteria involves the coordinated action of three enzymes: nitrogenase, reversible hydrogenase, and uptake hydrogenase. Green algae, on the other hand, contain only the reversible hydrogenase, which is responsible for both hydrogen production and uptake in this organism. The quantum yield for hydrogenase-catalyzed hydrogen production is much higher than that for nitrogenase. Algal hydrogenases, however, are extremely sensitive to oxygen. For this reason, green algae cannot be utilized commercially for hydrogen production. We have investigated two types of selective pressure to isolate mutants of Chlamydomonas reinhardtii that produce hydrogen in the presence of oxygen. The first is based on competition between hydrogenase and metronidazole for electrons from light-reduced ferredoxin. Since reduction of metronidazole results in the release of toxic products that eventually kill the organism, cells with an active oxygen-tolerant hydrogenase will survive a short treatment with the drug in the light in the presence of oxygen. Using this technique, we have isolated a variant of C. reinhardtii that evolves hydrogen with an I50 for oxygen three times higher than the wild type strain. The second selective pressure depends on growth of algal cells under photoreductive conditions. Algal cells must fix carbon dioxide in the presence of oxygen with reductants derived from hydrogen uptake by the reversible hydrogenase. We will describe in detail both selective pressures, as well as the characteristics of the mutants isolated by application of these selective pressures to a population of mutagenized wild type cells. This work was supported by the U.S. DOE Hydrogen Program.
Patent filed on energy discovery
by Kathleen Scalise
A metabolic switch that triggers algae to turn sunlight into large quantities of hydrogen gas, a valuable fuel, is the subject of a new discovery reported for the first time by University of California, Berkeley, scientists and their Colorado colleagues. UC Berkeley plant and microbial biology professor Tasios Melis and postdoctoral associate Liping Zhang of UC Berkeley made the discovery -- funded by the U.S. Department of Energy (DOE) Hydrogen Program -- with Dr. Michael Seibert, Dr. Maria Ghirardi and postdoctoral associate Marc Forestier of the National Renewable Energy Laboratory (NREL) in Golden, Colorado. Currently, hydrogen fuel is extracted from natural gas, a non-renewable energy source. The new discovery makes it possible to harness nature's own tool, photosynthesis, to produce the promising alternative fuel from sunlight and water. A joint patent on this new technique for capturing solar energy has been taken out by the two institutions. While current production rates are not high enough to make the process immediately viable commercially, the researchers believe that yields could rise by at least 10 fold with further research, someday making the technique an attractive fuel-producing option. Preliminary rough estimates, for instance, suggest it is conceivable that a single, small commercial pond could produce enough hydrogen gas to meet the weekly fuel needs of a dozen or so automobiles, Melis said.

14 posted on 03/22/2019 10:51:40 AM PDT by SunkenCiv (this tagline space is now available)
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Chlamydomonas reinhardtii search:
Google
Chlamydomonas reinhardtii site:freerepublic.com
Google

15 posted on 03/22/2019 10:54:02 AM PDT by SunkenCiv (this tagline space is now available)
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To: NOBO2012

There is fuel in the oceans, it is dissolved uranium. Japan and the US are working to extract the uranium economically, and we are pretty close. If we can get over that hurdle, we can power the entire world at current levels for at least the next two million years.


16 posted on 03/22/2019 11:06:12 AM PDT by Vince Ferrer
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