CARBON DATING UNDERCUTS EVOLUTION'S LONG AGES

ICR ^ | October, 2003 | John Baumgardner

[goodseedhomeschool (returned)]

Flood oops. I meant fall*

[RadioAstronomer]

Greed. let's talk about the greed of evos getting government funding year after year for nothing. Making money off our tax dollars and never ever producing anything but garbage.

Do you agree with astronomers getting funding? I sure see evidence for a very old universe when I study it.

[narby]

You keep saying that evolution and the Bible match up but how do you reconsile the fact the the bible has day and night and the earth created BEFORE the sun and stars?

First off, the creation of the sun and stars has nothing whatever to do with evolution. But since you asked.

1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

1:2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

1:3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.

The sun, earth, and other planets acreted from interstellar dust. Thus the earth was without form, and had no life. Then the sun condensed to the point for fusion to begin, and there was light.

The Bible gets it in exactly the right sequence. How the the ancients who wrote those verses down know this? They didn't witness it, and they didn't study science.

The fact is, Genesis can be completly reconciled with science.

Yes, there are some confusing parts, but read the first two chapters of Genesis straight through. There are basically TWO different creation stories with quite a bit of difference.

Those two stories require some imagination to reconcile. And if you apply the same analysis to reconcile science, it's no sweat.

In fact, its easier to reconcile parts of science that have the same sequence in Genesis, than it is to reconcile the two stories in Genesis.

[goodseedhomeschool (returned)]

Radio, I think that God made the earth and the universe fully mature. That would explain a lot. I don't agree with some of the theories of cosmology, but on the other hand, seeing what's out there, is awesome. I think the government should be limited to defense mostly but that's just me, no disrespect for what you do. I think it is an awsome profession. I love seeing the hubble pics.

[trapped_in_LA]

Just so! And the transitional forms are easily obsevable in the fossil record that absolutely prove evolution and over thrusts where thousands of square miles of "older" rock layers have slid over "younger" rock layers is easily explained. Face it evolution is hardly a proven fact nor has the creationist view been disproven (simply repeating over and over again that it has does not make it so).

[f.Christian]

Evolution is ... only a whacky theory about science --- you shouldn' t use them interchangeably !

[Prodigal Son]

Last call.

I have asked my questions. I have made my assertions. I have made my decree. If you cannot come up with any reasonable way to answer the questions I have posed, I have no other recourse but to consider my questions unresolved and that the claim made in the second paragraph in this article is false and that you cannot defend it.

I have no great desire to hang out on this thread or harangue you into answering. If you cannot answer because you do not know the answer to this question this is fair enough and this is exactly what I will assume in lieu of a response. But I will also assume the same lack of knowledge and skepticism for all of your future claims and I will also demonstrate the same skepticism (backed up by this thread) to all those who have been active on this thread and who have not responded to my queries.

I consider my original decree to be unchallenged and unresponded to. I will refer to it in the future for reference.

Any logical response to my questions posted henceforth will be taken into consideration. All responses that do not address the questions I have asked will be viewed by me as obfuscation.

[PatrickHenry]

P L A C E M A R K E R

[trapped_in_LA]

Nice try but read the text! Water, land and vegetaion where created before the stars, moon and sun. Also birds and fish where created before land animals (you may be able to argue fish before land animals but evolution of birds before land animals?) Sorry but any way you slice it these do not match evolution without a serious game of twister!

[RadioAstronomer]

I think the government should be limited to defense mostly but that's just me, no disrespect for what you do. I think it is an awsome profession. I love seeing the hubble pics.

Thank you. :-) However, IMHO, funding science is apart of our defense.

[goodseedhomeschool (returned)]

Well maybe some science, like making bombs and ammo and such but I don't think we have to worry about alien invasions.

[f.Christian]

Evolution is just a cold war army - general ...

president - false - science (( liberal overlords )) that crossed the rubicon - constitution ---

to make a federalacracy of technowhacks - slaves - tyranny !

[f.Christian]

Main Entry: Ru·bi·con
Pronunciation: 'rü-bi-"kän
Function: noun
Etymology: Latin Rubicon-, Rubico, river of northern Italy forming part of the boundary between Cisalpine Gaul and Italy whose crossing by Julius Caesar in 49 B.C. was regarded by the Senate as an act of war
Date: 1626
: a bounding or limiting line; especially : one that when crossed commits a person irrevocably

[RadioAstronomer]

I am not woried about alien invasions either. However, where would we be without Bell Labs, Fermi, Brookhaven, Hanford, SLAC, JPL, KSC, JSC, Mitre, MIT Rad Labs, Los Alamos, Livermore, Godddard, etc?

[cookcounty]

"This earnest effort to understand this "contamination problem" therefore generated scores of peer-reviewed papers in the standard radiocarbon literature during the last 20 years.2 Most of these papers acknowledge that most of the 14C in the samples studied appear to be intrinsic to the samples themselves, and they usually offer no explanation for its origin."

But we've been told on these threads that this kind of thing can't be found in "peer-reviewed" literature.

[Boiler Plate]

I guess he can't prove God exists. He's avoiding the question.

Prove that you exist. Good Luck

Regards,
Boiler Plate

[WackyKat]

Evolution is just a cold war army - general ... president - false - science (( liberal overlords )) that crossed the rubicon - constitution --- to make a federalacracy of technowhacks - slaves - tyranny !

It's getting late.... Do the orderlies know you're still in the day room?

[Stultis]

Books like the Wizard of Oz and Willy Wondka and the Chocolate Factory? My kids read them

Your children read to you? How nice!

While those are certainly wonderful books, I had in mind ones like the following: (The list, of course, is far from complete. I limit myself to volumes in my personal library that are not packed away, on loan, miss-shelved, or in shelved in other rooms.)

Mather, Kirtley F. & Mason, Shirley L. A Source Book In Geology: 1400-1900. Harvard Univ Press. 1939, 1967.

Gillispie, Charles Coulston. Genesis And Geology: The Impact of Scientific Discoveries Upon Religious Belief In The Decades Before Darwin. Harvard Univ Press, Harpers. 1951, 1959.

Young, Davis A. Creation and the Flood: An Alternative to Flood Geology and Theistic Evolution. Baker Book House. 1977.

Albritton, Claude C. Jr. The Abyss of Time: Unraveling the Mystery of the Earth's Age. Freeman, Cooper. 1986.

Toulmin, Stephen & Goodfield, June. The Discovery of Time. Univ of Chicago Press. 1965, 1982.

Berggren, W.A. & Van Couvering, John A. (eds.) Catastrophes and Earth History: The New Uniformitarianism. Princenton Univ Press. 1984.

Lurie, Edward. Louis Agassiz: A Life in Science. Univ of Chicago, Johns Hopkins. 1960, 1988.

Rudwick, Martin J.S. The Great Devonian Controversy: The Shaping of Scientific Knowledge Among Gentlemanly Specialists. Chicago Univ Press. 1985.

Oh, yeah, and even former ICR President Henry Morris' History of Creationism (1984, I think, I can't find my copy just now) who only covers the 19th Century "Mosaic geologists" briefly, but makes my point by defending them against the contemporary mainstream geologists who sharply refuted them.

[f.Christian]

Non conformatists training operation officer ... doctor --- you ?

[RadioAstronomer]

Thanks for the list :-)