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To: HarleyD

" My belief is that you're saved the moment God wishes to give you a new heart."

That may be your belief, but it is not what the Bible clearly states. Yes, the blood of Christ removes sins, but the key is this: At what point do we come in contact with the Blood?

According to the Word of God, baptism is for the remission of sins (Acts 2:38) and washes away sins (Acts 22:16). In Matthew 26:28, Christ uses the exact same language that is used in Acts 2:38 to say that He shed His blood for the remission of sins. There is an obvious connection here. By submitting ourselves to His will and being baptized, the precious blood of Christ is applied.

I believe the hardest part for you in regards to baptism is that you think it negates God's grace somehow to believe that baptism is necessary to accept God's gift of salvation. Nothing could be farther from the truth.

God was under no obligation to offer us a way to be saved, but He has done so because of His unconditional love for us. That is what makes the gift free. We did not warrant the gift, but it was given anyway. The fact that we must obey Him to accept this wonderful gift in no way changes that.

God has always commanded obedience from His followers, including the Nation of Israel under the Mosaic Law. Please consider the following verses:

Hebrews 5:8-9 -
8 though He was a Son, [yet] He learned obedience by the things which He suffered.
9 And having been perfected, He became the author of eternal salvation to all who obey Him

As you can see, Christ is the author of our salvation, but only to those who obey Him. The only way to obey Him is to keep his commandments (Luke 6:46).

God bless.


771 posted on 01/27/2005 6:12:12 AM PST by jkl1122
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To: jkl1122
"The fact that we must obey Him to accept this wonderful gift in no way changes that."

This is actually where we disagree. If we have to do something to accept "the gift" it's earned. We did something (obey, be baptized) for "the gift". It ceases to be a gift.

The verses you cited can be easily explain that baptism is one step in the regeneration process. Hence the writers were only discussing just step "X" of the regeneration process. We obey our Lord Jesus in baptism because He has changed us to want to do so. And, yes, this is what the Bible clearly states as I pointed out with the case of Cornelius which you have not yet explain. While its important to review the doctrinal text, God also gives us Biblical examples to ensure our accurate interpretation. Most people fail to examine these stories closely and match them to other text to understand the workings of God.

I don't wish to sound mean spirited; I'm really a swell guy. But given my past experiences with people who hold this view, I doubt if we're going to change each other's minds on this.

774 posted on 01/27/2005 7:30:59 AM PST by HarleyD (aka Codename: Heretic Harley-Ignorant Savage)
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