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To: fortheDeclaration
In fact, Calhoun became an ardent nationalist advocating strong national growth.

During the War of 1812 it was understandable, to protect the states. Afterward, seeing the abuses of the federal government, Calhoun grew out of his predilection for nationalism, and became a strong supporter of sectionalism and state sovereignty.

I gave you documentation by Lee on what Virgina (and Lee) thought of the attempts to secede by New England.

You provided a secondhand account of the opinion of one, possibly two people out of millions. I simply asked for a firsthand account, or perhaps more accounts.

The demise of the Federalist Party due to it's attempt at secession is very clearly laid out in any history book.

The demise of the Federalist Party was due to loss of effective leaders, it's support of the Alien & Sedition Acts, it's opposition to Madison and the War of 1812, opposition to the Louisiana Purchase. One minor convention by a few Northeastern states did not destroy the party.

4,215 posted on 04/04/2005 2:29:28 PM PDT by 4CJ (Good-bye Henry LeeII. Rest well my FRiend. Good-bye Terri. We'll miss you both.)
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To: 4ConservativeJustices
Gee, I am suppose to do your research for you?

Lee's letter pointed out what Virgina thought of Secession in 1812

To be sure, the meeting at Hartford put an end to the already waning national fortunes of the Federalist Party while giving a legitimacy to the notion of nullification which would haunt the nation later.... That faith, however, could have many consequences and take many forms. It was the dark legacy of the Hartford Convention not only to taint ineradicably the Federalist Party with disloyalty and irrelevance, from which it died in 1820, http://earlyamerica.com/review/winter2000/federalist.html

4,236 posted on 04/05/2005 4:43:33 AM PDT by fortheDeclaration
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To: 4ConservativeJustices
Fascinating Fact: The Federalist party, which had been discredited during the War of 1812 for such secessionist sympathies as those illustrated by the Hartford Convention, fared so poorly in the 1816 election that it did not run a national candidate against the Democratic Republicans in 1820. http://civilwar.bluegrass.net/secessioncrisis/hartfordconvention.html
4,241 posted on 04/05/2005 4:54:38 AM PDT by fortheDeclaration
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To: 4ConservativeJustices

Below is from the Haynes-Webster debate

As soon as the public mind was sufficiently prepared for the measure, the celebrated Hartford Convention was got up; not as the act of a few unauthorized individuals, but by authority of the legislature of Massachusetts; and, as has been shown by the able historian of that convention, in accordancewith the views and wishes of the party of which it was the organ. Now sir, I do not desire to call in question the motives of the gentlemen who composed that assembly. I knew many of them to be in private life accomplished and honorable men, and I doubt not there were some among them who did not perceive the dangerous tendency of their proceedings I will even go further, and say, that if the authors of the Hartford Convention believed that "gross, deliberate, and palpable violations of the constitution" had taken place, utterly destructive of their rights and interests, I should be the last man to deny their right to resort to any constitutional measures for redress. But, sir, in any view of the case, the time when and the circumstances under which that convention assembled as well as the measures recommended, render their conduct, in my opinion, wholly indefensible. Let us contemplate, for a moment, the spectacle then exhibited tothe view of the world. I will not go over the disasters of the war, nor describe the difficulties in which the government was involved. It will be recollected that its credit was nearly gone, Washington had fallen, the whole coast was blockaded, and an immense force, collected in the West Indies, was about to make a descent, which it was supposed we had no means of resisting. In this awful state of our public affairs, when the government seemed almost to be tottering on its base, when Great Britain, relieved from all her other enemies, had proclaimed her purpose of "reducing us to unconditional submission,'' we beheld the peace party of New England (in the language of the work before us) pursuing a course calculated to do more injury to their country, and to render England more effective service than all her armies." Those who could not find it in their hearts to rejoice at our victories sang Te Deum at the King's Chapel in Boston, for the restoration of the Bourbons. Those who could not consent to illuminate their dwellings for the capture of the Guerriere could give no visible tokens of their joy at the fall of Detroit. The "beacon fires" of their hills were lighted up, not for the encouragement of their friends, but as signals to the enemy; and in the gloomy hours of midnight, the very lights burned blue. Such were the dark and portentous signs of the times, which ushered into being the renowned Hartford Convention. That convention met, and, from their proceedings, it appears that their chief object was to keep back the men and money of New England from the service of the Union, and to effect radical changes in the government -- changes that can never be effected without a dissolution of the Union.
It is unnecessary to trace the matter further, or to or what would have been the next chapter in this history, if the measures recommended had been carried into effect; and if, with the men and money of New England withheld from the government of the United States, she had been withdrawn from the war; if New Orleans had fallen into the hands of the enemy; and if, without troops and almost destitute of money, the Southern and the Western States had been thrown upon their own resources for the prosecution of the war and the recovery of New Orleans.

Sir, whatever may have been the issue of the contest, the Union must have been dissolved. But a wise and just Providence, which "shapes our ends, roughhew them as we will," gave us the victory, and crowned our efforts with a glorious peace. The ambassadors of Hartford were seen retracing their steps fromWashington, "the bearers of the glad tiding; of great joy." Courage and patriotism triumphed -- the country was saved -- the Union was preserved. And are we, Mr. President, who stood by our country then, who threw open our coffers, who bared our bosoms, who freely perilled all in that conflict, to be reproached with want of attachment to the Union? If, sir, we are to have lessons of patriotism read to us, they must come from a different quarter. http://www.constitution.org/hwdebate/hayne2c.htm


4,246 posted on 04/05/2005 5:26:29 AM PDT by fortheDeclaration
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