[MJY1288]

"Jeepers, the idea that the solution to the border is exclusively at the border is laughable,"

I never said it was, I usually avoid these threads because of the irrational posters who resort to name calling and bashing Mexicans, so I haven't followed your posts on this matter. But if my conversations with you on other matters are an example of your contributions to this issue, I'm quite sure you and I think much alike on the problem of illegal immigration.

My problem with these threads is that they are based on speculation from primarily liberal journalists at first, then afterwords by some concerned conservative journalists reacting to what the Liberals speculate will be in a proposal that quotes no one in the Bush Administration. Sure we can send faxes to the White House and Send emails to our elected Representatives, voicing our concerns, but to condemn this administration or anyone else based on the vague claims made by liberals at the NYT's or some other liberal rag, is playing right into their hands

[JustPiper]

MJ we wouldn't do that because of one newspaper, one politician, it is the opposite, very few journalists cover the 'truth' but it is there. A handful of politicans genuinely care about this issue and that is evident seeing thei websites. But the nultitude of them don't care and lie. Believe me this is months, even years of a myriad of source's that we base this.

[Sabertooth]

I never said it was, I usually avoid these threads because of the irrational posters who resort to name calling and bashing Mexicans, so I haven't followed your posts on this matter.

Why do you equate bashing Illegals with bashing Mexicans?

But if my conversations with you on other matters are an example of your contributions to this issue, I'm quite sure you and I think much alike on the problem of illegal immigration.

Then I suggest you pay more attention to these threads, as I think you've mischaracterized them. I also think you've misunderstood the Bush Administration's intentions regarding Illegals.

My problem with these threads is that they are based on speculation from primarily liberal journalists at first, then afterwords by some concerned conservative journalists reacting to what the Liberals speculate will be in a proposal that quotes no one in the Bush Administration.

How many more Tom Ridge links do you need?

How many freight-train loopholes in the President's own comments do you need to see?

Sure we can send faxes to the White House and Send emails to our elected Representatives, voicing our concerns, but to condemn this administration or anyone else based on the vague claims made by liberals at the NYT's or some other liberal rag, is playing right into their hands

No, complacency and blind faith are the dangers.

Let me ask you a few questions: how do you define Bush-bashing?

Is a criticism of this President "Bush-bashing," if it's true?

After the President signed the McCain-Feingold CFR, there were a number of contentious threads. Many of FR's Bush-loyslists put forth the proposition that this was brilliant stategery, that he'd taken the Democrats issue away, that the SCOTUS would throw it out anyway.

I was one who said it was a blunder, that there was no guarantee that the SCOTUS would throw it out, that a veto would have been far preferrable, and that the issue had no resonance with the voters anyway.

Now, those of us who criticized the President's signing of CFR have been completely vindicated, because the SCOTUS upheld all sorts of restrictions on Free Speech. Those who defended it, on any grounds, have been shown to have been badly mistaken on CFR.

I should think that would serve as a lesson to those who reflexively defend this President in anything and everything, despite evidence that contradicts their conclusions.

We need to do better than to lean on the hope that some troubling development in the Bush Administration is just a trumped-up effort by liberal media to sow division in the GOP.

President Bush is capable of mistakes. He is about to make an enormous mistake with regard to Illegals, and it's likely to hurt the GOP when he does.

The resultant division within the Republican Party will be the President's own doing.