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To: boatbums; metmom; getoffmylawn
Okay, spell-checked this time...

Not only that, but they demand proof under their own qualifications for proof

No, boatbums. real things are provable for all. I don't have to device my own special method to prove that you will sink if you try to walk on water. I will sink just the same. That's realty. Either God exists or doesn't. IF you say he doe,s then you should be able to prove it without special "qualifications of proof". reality doens't recognize believers and nonbelievers. It affects all equally.

3,514 posted on 06/17/2011 7:40:36 PM PDT by kosta50
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To: kosta50
Okay, spell-checked this time... Whew! Thanks, I thought you started writing in tongues for a minute. :o)

No, boatbums. real things are provable for all. I don't have to device my own special method to prove that you will sink if you try to walk on water. I will sink just the same. That's realty. Either God exists or doesn't. IF you say he doe,s then you should be able to prove it without special "qualifications of proof". reality doens't recognize believers and nonbelievers. It affects all equally.

I disagree. I am not a scientist, but they sure do know a lot more than I do about a lot. Many of those things are not visibly verifiable. An example is a heater. I could show you how it works but unless you stood before it and felt it for yourself you wouldn't KNOW it was true that it could warm you without fire. For someone with a sensory disability, they would even have to just take your word for it because they couldn't experience it for themselves. Lousy example, you're thinking, right?

No scientist today can explain everything about gravity, yet we don't let it stop us from believing it exists. We experience its effects every day. The same things can be said of music which is simply sound waves produced by a type of instrument. We can explain the beauty of a Beethoven sonata, but a deaf person could not do anything but take our word for it. A person who has been deaf from birth has an even more impossible time of believing since he has no reference to even understand sound at all much less what qualifies as beautiful music.

So this is what I was trying to get at by talking about qualifying proof. You ask if I can prove God exists. I can prove he does in many ways yet many of them are purely experiential. I have seen specific prayers answered on time, exactly as prayed. I have seen prayers for specific amounts of money needed and the money comes in the exact amount needed when it is needed. I have seen lives changed in miraculous ways. Even my own. I have seen the sick brought back to health and some who were not healed go on to better and more wonderful lives to the glory of God than they ever would have if made whole. They admitted it themselves. I could go on and on about these answered prayers and miraculous times in my life where I saw the hand of God (not literally his hand, but his handiwork). But I cannot convince you of them because you didn't experience them yourself.

When I went through that time of doubt, it was the truth of Scriptures and the resurrection as well as all the times God worked in my life that pulled me out of it. He met everyone of my needs and still does to this day. But you have refused their proofs. All I can say is you need to decide what kind of unbeliever you are going to be. Are you a fideist, which is a particular kind of deist who believes that God, though he exists, is unknowable and has not bothered to make himself known to mankind through any means of divine intervention or revelation? Or do you think God is knowable? Or do you think there is no God?

This is a road only you can take. I get the feeling that there is something that you know you are missing else you wouldn't bother coming on these threads. It is up to you what you will do with the knowledge God HAS given you but please don't make the mistake of thinking he must come to you on your terms.

Seek ye the LORD while he may be found, call ye upon him while he is near: Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts: and let him return unto the LORD, and he will have mercy upon him; and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon. (Isaiah 55:6-7)

3,522 posted on 06/17/2011 8:46:59 PM PDT by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to him.)
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