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To: gdebrae; the_doc
Though I saw differences, I'll accept your mutual assertions that you agree with and support each other's statements to the effect that John 5:28,29 is in fact a clear picture that interprets Rev 20:11-15.

Two other questions I previously posed which I'd hoped you'd both address were:

1) the doc wrote in post #815:

The beheading idea in Revelation 20:4 is not necessarily limiting us to physically dead Christians anyway. It definitely includes those who have died physically, certainly including literal martyrs, but the verse may very well be just borrowing a martyrdom scenario for beautiful metaphorical purposes in the vision--including metaphorical purposes involving Christians who are still physically alive!

So, what are those metaphorical purposes and what is Christ who is our spiritual head, teaching us in this metaphor of believers in Christ testifying to Him, rejecting Satan, and yet losing their metaphorical heads to an already bound Satan?

2) gdebrae writes in post 839:

John 5:28,29 describes an actually historical event. Rev. 20 properly understood, helps us to understand something about the significance and real meaning of that very real historical event.

Since John 5:28,29 "describes an actually historical event." and John 5:28-29 is the 'clear picture' that applies to Rev 20:11-15, you both further imply that Rev 20:11-15 is likewise a historical event. So where in history is the white throne judgement?

I would very much appreciate both your replies to both questions, at your convenience.

Thanks

848 posted on 11/29/2002 6:02:05 PM PST by Starwind
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To: Starwind; the_doc
gdebrae writes in post 839: John 5:28,29 describes an actually historical event. Rev. 20 properly understood, helps us to understand something about the significance and real meaning of that very real historical event. Since John 5:28,29 "describes an actually historical event." and John 5:28-29 is the 'clear picture' that applies to Rev 20:11-15, you both further imply that Rev 20:11-15 is likewise a historical event. So where in history is the white throne judgement?

Please reread post 841. I believe that Rev 20:11-15 is a partial explanation of the coming historical event revealed in John 5:28-29. In the same way it would be related to Matt 13:36-43; II Thess 1:6-10. Rev. 20:11-15 speak to the last phrase in John 5:29 "...and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of judgment. It is explaining the essence of the judgment. Unbelievers are forever spiritually dead.

On the other hand, the words in John 5:29 "they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life..." may find their counterpart in Rev. 20:6 which is in the future tense and makes very clear that the priests of God and of Christ who are blest and holy are certainly alive in Christ forever - for the second death has no power over them.

I would encourage you to try reading the entire chapter of Rev. 20 in the light of the very biblical concept of spiritual life and death. I understand Rev 20 as containing God's final verdict about (or if you will, the final outcome of) believers, unbelievers and satan. I hope you find this helpful.

849 posted on 11/29/2002 6:26:26 PM PST by gdebrae
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