Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Pope Francis to allow priests to bless gay couples but not perform marriages or civil unions
Christian Post ^ | 12/18/23 | Michael Gryboski

Posted on 12/18/2023 3:20:40 PM PST by SeekAndFind

click here to read article


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-2021-4041-6061-62 next last
To: ealgeone
*****

"Now, therefore, we declare, say, determine and pronounce that for every human creature it is necessary for salvation to be subject to the authority of the Roman pontiff"

*****

It's always interesting to watch Roman Catholic apologists try to excuse this.


"Every human creature" would seem to include you as well...

41 posted on 12/18/2023 6:25:22 PM PST by Captain Walker ("It is infinitely better to have a few good Men, than many indifferent ones." - George Washington)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 27 | View Replies]

To: Not A Snowbird
Every human creature? Are they saying they expect Protestants to be subject to the Pope’s authority?

Roman Catholics like to say everyone has to follow the pope...until, well, they really have to follow the pope on matters they don't like.

The claim is the pope is over everything and a person has to submit to this for salvation.

Which is a contradiction of Scripture as no where are believers in Christ called to be subject to anyone other than Christ.

42 posted on 12/18/2023 6:25:57 PM PST by ealgeone
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 29 | View Replies]

To: Captain Walker
"Every human creature" would seem to include you as well...

If this were scripturally based you might have a point. However, as the papacy is not supported in Scripture and there are no calls to be subject to a pope in Scripture Christians are not subject to the pope.

Believers in Christ are subject to only Christ.

43 posted on 12/18/2023 6:27:59 PM PST by ealgeone
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 41 | View Replies]

To: ealgeone
Actually, per Roman Catholic canon law he cannot be removed even for that.

This isn't clear; it's never been tried.

The workaround is that the College of Cardinals submits a dubia for him to answer; if he doesn't provide the correct answer to clear up a matter, his words have no weight and the laity is free to ignore them. (See: "Amoris Laetitia".)

44 posted on 12/18/2023 6:29:36 PM PST by Captain Walker ("It is infinitely better to have a few good Men, than many indifferent ones." - George Washington)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 40 | View Replies]

To: SeekAndFind
Heterodox German bishops laud new Vatican document on gay ‘blessings’ as a ‘real Christmas present’
45 posted on 12/18/2023 6:31:27 PM PST by ebb tide
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: ealgeone
If this were scripturally based you might have a point. However, as the papacy is not supported in Scripture and there are no calls to be subject to a pope in Scripture Christians are not subject to the pope.

What if you were a Christian before Scripture was compiled or if you can't read?

46 posted on 12/18/2023 6:36:06 PM PST by Captain Walker ("It is infinitely better to have a few good Men, than many indifferent ones." - George Washington)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 43 | View Replies]

To: Captain Walker

Doesn’t change the argument at all.


47 posted on 12/18/2023 6:48:27 PM PST by ealgeone
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 46 | View Replies]

To: Captain Walker
https://canonlawmadeeasy.com/2013/01/31/pope-removed-from-office/

The short answer is there is no mechanism to remove a pope from office.

48 posted on 12/18/2023 6:52:48 PM PST by ealgeone
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 44 | View Replies]

To: Not A Snowbird
Every human creature? Are they saying they expect Protestants to be subject to the Pope’s authority?

That's what it says.

Their official Catechism of the Catholic church doctrine says that there is no salvation outside the Catholic church.

When I first got saved, it took me a while to get used to the idea that the pope only speaks for Catholics, that he had no authority over me any more nor did he speak for Christianity as a whole.

It was very freeing.

Here is a link and a post addressing that very issue.

https://freerepublic.com/focus/religion/4202799/posts?page=465#465

Here's the link to the actual document

Unum Sanctum

https://www.papalencyclicals.net/bon08/b8unam.htm

49 posted on 12/18/2023 7:13:10 PM PST by metmom (He who testifies to these things says, “Surely I am coming soon.” Amen. Come, Lord Jesus.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 29 | View Replies]

To: Prince of Space; ealgeone

Has Unum Sanctum been officially rescinded?


50 posted on 12/18/2023 7:14:42 PM PST by metmom (He who testifies to these things says, “Surely I am coming soon.” Amen. Come, Lord Jesus.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 33 | View Replies]

To: vpintheak

That’s longer than I would expect.


51 posted on 12/18/2023 7:15:54 PM PST by metmom (He who testifies to these things says, “Surely I am coming soon.” Amen. Come, Lord Jesus.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 36 | View Replies]

To: ealgeone
The short answer is there is no mechanism to remove a pope from office.

It's not needed.

Were he to say anything heretical, he would be called out on it by the College of Cardinals and then ignored.

The idea that Unam Sanctum compels us to accept every statement uttered by a pope is absurd. (If you believe this, then I almost can't blame you for being Protestant.)

52 posted on 12/18/2023 7:18:59 PM PST by Captain Walker ("It is infinitely better to have a few good Men, than many indifferent ones." - George Washington)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 48 | View Replies]

To: ealgeone

First of all, there were many irregularities in his election. Maybe this will get some of the cardinals to stand up and demand another look.

But even so, the Pope is only to be followed when his “teachings” are in line with the traditional and perpetual magisterium of the Church..that is the accumulated orthodox teachings of 2000 years.

His are not, but the way he’s always gotten around it has been to set things up so that somebody else actually issues the letter or makes the statement…which he has all along been encouraging. He’s an evil man who has made his career by manipulating and using others to achieve his evil goals.

Maybe this will finally make the bishops do something other than grumble quietly. This is going to put them in a terrible position, and if they’re not orthodox and don’t care themselves, it’s going to out their priests in a terrible position.

Weirdly enough I think this has been Francis’ goal all along. I suspect he thinks he’s getting near the end and he wants to burn it all down before he goes.


53 posted on 12/18/2023 7:19:26 PM PST by livius
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 15 | View Replies]

To: Captain Walker; ealgeone
"Every human creature" would seem to include you as well...

It would except that that is such a blatant power grab that it's ridiculous. And we don't recognize Catholic authority over those who are not Catholic.

The Catholic church has no authority over anyone who does not willingly put themselves under it. Nor does the Catholic church speak for God. God speaks for Himself in His word.

54 posted on 12/18/2023 7:20:52 PM PST by metmom (He who testifies to these things says, “Surely I am coming soon.” Amen. Come, Lord Jesus.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 41 | View Replies]

To: Captain Walker
Well, the OT existed long before Christ died and any Christians were around. They had Scripture. It was the Old Testament, and it was that that Jesus validated as such in the Gospels as Scripture.

And if anyone would know, He would.

55 posted on 12/18/2023 7:24:03 PM PST by metmom (He who testifies to these things says, “Surely I am coming soon.” Amen. Come, Lord Jesus.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 46 | View Replies]

To: Prince of Space
Per Wikipedia, “Boniface's reputation for overweening papal claims made it difficult to accept such an extreme declaration. His assertion over the temporal was seen as hollow and misguided, and it is said that the document was not seen as authoritative because the body of the faithful did not accept it.”

So the opinion of the laity determines whether something is authoritative or not?

Your own personal interpretation of Catholicism. 1.2 billion strong, each one his own pope deciding for himself which version of Catholicism they accept and reject.

And you all complain about Protestantism and the numbers of alleged different interpretation of Scripture?

Unreal......

56 posted on 12/18/2023 7:28:52 PM PST by metmom (He who testifies to these things says, “Surely I am coming soon.” Amen. Come, Lord Jesus.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 33 | View Replies]

To: livius
But even so, the Pope is only to be followed when his “teachings” are in line with the traditional and perpetual magisterium of the Church..that is the accumulated orthodox teachings of 2000 years.

The papacy had been accumulating more and more power over the years. Unam Sanctam is the culmination of that attempted power grab.

And for the ordinary Roman Catholic to attempt to sort out what is the "traditional and perpetual magisterium of the Church" is a stretch as the majority of Roman Catholics I've encountered on these forums don't know what their denomination teaches in many aspects.

Urban II promised forgiveness of sins for those who died in battle during the Crusades. Roman Catholic jihad in sense.

There is nothing Scriptural about what he did.

As far as removing him, neither the bishops nor the college of cardinals, nor anyone else can remove him legally per Roman Catholic canon law. Though I have seen some comments that have been removed on other ways to remove him. I can only imagine the outcry if a non-RC has posted that. I'm glad the comments were removed.

The papacy has insulated itself from these kinds of actions.

57 posted on 12/18/2023 7:34:43 PM PST by ealgeone
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 53 | View Replies]

To: metmom
Your own personal interpretation of Catholicism. 1.2 billion strong, each one his own pope deciding for himself which version of Catholicism they accept and reject.

Nope. That when they apostatize and become Protestants.

Look in your mirror.

58 posted on 12/18/2023 7:39:38 PM PST by ebb tide
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 56 | View Replies]

To: FlingWingFlyer

He is blessing sin!

He has no concept of sanctification in Christian life.

Clearly, he’s not a Christian.


59 posted on 12/18/2023 8:19:10 PM PST by grumpygresh (Civil disobedience by non-compliance; jury and state nullification. )
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: ealgeone

Martin Luther comes to mind.


60 posted on 12/19/2023 3:34:55 AM PST by GrannyAnn ( )
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 42 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-2021-4041-6061-62 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson