Catholics and Lutherans Celebrate Reformation with New Bible Translations

The Tablet (UK) ^ | 2/10/17 | CNS

[marshmallow]

The two Christian churches came together in a demonstration of unity ahead of the 500th anniversary of the Reformation

Catholics and Lutherans celebrate Reformation with new Bible translations

Five centuries after the start of the Protestant Reformation, leaders of the Catholic and Lutheran churches came together in a demonstration of unity to release new Bible translations.

At an ecumenical service at St Eberhard's Catholic Cathedral, in Stuttgart, Germany, clergy from both churches gathered to release revised German translations of the Catholic and Lutheran Bibles.

The release came as the 500th anniversary of the Reformation neared. It began in 1517 when theologian Martin Luther developed his 95 Theses challenging long-held Catholic practices.

Cardinal Reinhard Marx of Munich and Freising, president of the German bishops' conference, emphasized the sacred Scriptures as a strong bond shared by Catholics and Protestants.

"It is an effervescent fountain," Cardinal Marx said of the Bible. "The water drawn from it does not decrease, but increases. The more we debate the holy Scriptures, the more we experience the mystery of Christ."

During the last year, the Catholic and Lutheran translations of the Bible were subjected to thorough review and revision. A group of 200 people from both churches participated in the revision process.

"With the new translations, we remember our shared foundation - the sacred Scriptures - and together express our appreciation for each other's translation," said Lutheran Bishop Heinrich Bedford-Strohm, chairman of the Council of the Evangelical Church in Germany.

The Reformation, which sparked a religious war, left deep divides between Protestant and Catholics for centuries. In recent years both churches have come closer together. The release of the Bible translation is one of several ecumenical services being promoted by both churches throughout the year.

"I am very pleased that we are placing God's word in our......

[Bishop_Malachi]

I read the article. It reminds me of a conversation with a Left-wing lawyer who defended the Supreme Court’s usurping the power to define marriage from the states.

This article has lots of words, but doesn’t say very much. What does this “New Translation” offer than older translations don’t?

[imardmd1]

Change the words or change their definitions, first in the MSS, then in the translations. There’s quite a difference between the prophet that simply immediately disobeys or delays his compliance, as over against the prophet who out and out lies.

[richardtavor]

I am not a Catholic, but I have wondered what the effect would be for most if the Pope somehow sanctioned homosexuality male and female), women Priests, Transexual Priests etc? In other words, I have heard he is the most liberal, progressive Pope that the Church has had. What would the conservative Catholics do in that case, in your opinion?

[daniel1212]

I am not a Catholic, but I have wondered what the effect would be for most if the Pope somehow sanctioned homosexuality male and female), women Priests, Transexual Priests etc? In other words, I have heard he is the most liberal, progressive Pope that the Church has had. What would the conservative Catholics do in that case, in your opinion?

That depends whether he formally taught this or not, and if not, conservative Catholics would do the same thing they do already: either pick and choose what they see as valid teaching based upon their judgment, and effectively or formally be part of a sect of "faithful RCs," or be part of an outright schism, all the while criticizing Prots who alaso ascertain what valid teaching is (in the light of Scripture), and separate from Catholicism to be part of conservative evangelicalism.

If the pope formally taught error, then it seems they would need his approval to depose him, but as with many things, this is an issue of Catholic debate.

[ealgeone]

I am not a Catholic, but I have wondered what the effect would be for most if the Pope somehow sanctioned homosexuality male and female), women Priests, Transexual Priests etc? In other words, I have heard he is the most liberal, progressive Pope that the Church has had. What would the conservative Catholics do in that case, in your opinion?

The catholic really has no say in the matter based on this.

"Now, therefore, we declare, say, determine and pronounce that for every human creature it is necessary for salvation to be subject to the authority of the Roman pontiff" (Porro subesse Romano Pontifici omni humanae creaturae declaramus, dicimus, definimus, et pronuntiamus omnino esse de necessitate salutis).http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/15126a.htm

To disagree with the pope, as we see many catholics are doing on these threads, is to do exactly what Luther did which catholics routinely condemn him.

Luther evaluated what the roman catholic church was teaching based on the Word and found the rcc wanting.

Seems many catholics are doing the same thing today.

[HapaxLegamenon]

Again Ealgeone, nice try, but you are not an expert in Catholic doctrine and simply posting the same quotation out of context does not make you one.

Again, for the record, sed contra:

“The opinion according to which the pope, in virtue of his
infallibility, is an unlimited and absolute Sovereign, supposes a totally
erroneous conception of the dogma of papal infallibility. Thus, as the
[First Vatican Council] declared in clear and explicit terms, and as the
nature of things itself shows, this infallibility is confined to that which
is proper to the supreme pontifical Magisterium, which in truth coincides
with the limits of the infallible Magisterium of the Church generally, which
is limited by the doctrine contained in Sacred Scripture and Tradition, as
by
the definitions already pronounced by the Magisterium of the Church. (”A
Collective Declaration of the German Bishops,” confirmed by Pope Pius IX)

[ealgeone]

That’s a pretty big change in the claims between the two popes. One claimed total power in both the spiritual and temporal...the other backed off the temporal and modified the spiritual.

[HapaxLegamenon]

I am sorry you don’t understand. You pastors have not educated you in Scripture or the Doctrine of Christ and have left you to figure out everything with your own limited judgement. I suggest you read this:

https://www.amazon.com/Catechism-Council-Trent/dp/089555884X

[ealgeone]

Vatican II might disagree with you.

[Elsie]

What does this “New Translation” offer than older translations don’t?

I see you've noticed the shiny object.

[Elsie]

Catholics and Lutherans Celebrate Reformation with New Bible Translations

REALLY??

Some of our dear Catholic FRiends will have to find all of the pieces of their heads after they explode!

[Elsie]

If the pope formally taught error, then it seems they would need his approval to depose him, but as with many things, this is an issue of Catholic debate.

What about them 7 Catholic churches mentioned by the angel to John in the first 3 chapters of Revelation?

They are DOCUMENTED as 'teaching error'.

Does the record show that they EVER straightened up and taught what the ECFs considered to be CORRECT?

https://www.toursforchristians.com/tours/turkey/in-the-footsteps-of-paul-visit-the-7-churches-of-revelation/

[Elsie]

Again Ealgeone, nice try, but you are not an expert in Catholic doctrine and simply posting the same quotation out of context does not make you one.

I admit that I am not an 'expert' either; but I CAN post things that the church has written; and then our FR 'experts' can say whether they STILL are in effect or not.

"One indeed is the universal Church of the faithful, outside which no one at all is saved, in which the priest himself is the sacrifice, Jesus Christ, whose body and blood are truly contained in the sacrament of the altar under the species of bread and wine; the bread (changed) into His body by the divine power of transubstantiation, and the wine into the blood, so that to accomplish the mystery of unity we ourselves receive from His (nature) what He Himself received from ours."

--Pope Innocent III and Lateran Council IV (A.D. 1215)

 

 

Sorry Lutherans.....

But you can still Celebrate!

[Elsie]

I suggest you read this:

Why?

With his 'limited judgment' he'd probably not figger it out properly.

[Elsie]

You pastors have not educated you in Scripture or the Doctrine of Christ and have left you to figure out everything with your own limited judgement.

---

NIV Luke 24:44-47
44. He said to them, "This is what I told you while I was still with you: Everything must be fulfilled that is written about me in the Law of Moses, the Prophets and the Psalms."
45. Then he opened their minds so they could understand the Scriptures.
46. He told them, "This is what is written: The Christ will suffer and rise from the dead on the third day,
47. and repentance and forgiveness of sins will be preached in his name to all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.

 

NIV John 12:14-16
14. Jesus found a young donkey and sat upon it, as it is written,
15. "Do not be afraid, O Daughter of Zion; see, your king is coming, seated on a donkey's colt."
16. At first his disciples did not understand all this. Only after Jesus was glorified did they realize that these things had been written about him and that they had done these things to him.

 

NIV 2 Corinthians 1:13-14
13. For we do not write you anything you cannot read or understand. And I hope that,
14. as you have understood us in part, you will come to understand fully that you can boast of us just as we will boast of you in the day of the Lord Jesus.

 

 

NIV 2 Peter 3:16
He writes the same way in all his letters, speaking in them of these matters. His letters contain some things that are hard to understand , which ignorant and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction.

[Bishop_Malachi]

Well, this “Conservative Catholic” decided it was de facto proof that the RCC does not constitute the whole Body of Christ. In fact, MOST of the professed RCC Magisterium and laity (along with this Pope) do not constitute it. This is tough to swallow as I always believed that the leadership of the Church (while morally fallible could never change orthodox dogma). Well, obviously that is happening before our eyes (and has been happening slowly since Vatican II). The end result is a crisis that no Catholic -with their eyes open- can ignore. This whole idea of “picking and choosing” what to believe despite the new teachings of the Magistarium and Pope is simply Lutherism in practice. You cannot claim to adhere to both Church authority and then ignore the teachings of the leadership. It’s a schizophrenic attempt to recognize the authority of the church while simultaneously denying its authority on choice matters.

[Russ]

As a 72 year old life long Lutheran I was not aware of a “Lutheran Bible”. I like either the King James or Revised King James Bibles.

[metmom]

You pastors have not educated you in Scripture or the Doctrine of Christ and have left you to figure out everything with your own limited judgement.

Now that's just right out funny,.

What evangelical pastor would educate any of his flock in CATHOLIC doctrine, in the first place?

And not to mention, what with the ignorance Catholics regularly display of Scripture, plus the fact that rather than teaching and encouraging Bible study, the Catholic church for so many years told Catholics they were not to read Scripture cause they couldn't understand it, that hardly puts any Catholic in a position of being able to criticize any other person for not knowing Scripture cause their pastor did not educate them.

Nor is the believer depending on *his ow limited judgment*. The believer has the indwelling of the Holy spirit to guide them into all truth. The natural man CANNOT understand spiritual truths. They are spiritually discerned and the person without the Spirit can no more recognize or understand spiritual truth than a blind man can understand light.

Besides. That's quite a claim you are making. Care to back it up with facts and proof?

Show us that non-Catholic pastors are not teaching their flock and leaving them to figure it out on their own.

[richardtavor]

Thanks. That is why I asked. I am an historian and really want to avoid my own biases, where possible. Since I am an uninformed observer it appears that Catholicism is faced with the dilemma of most faiths - whatever orthodoxy you chose can be the diffence between Heresy or faithfulness. It was blasphemous for centuries to disagree with a Papal Decree, which was amended to say when he speaks ex cathedra, but it appears that many Catholics still believe that any word that he speaks is infallible. Is that your take from a conservative point of view? Do you think that some strict adnerents would consider you heretical if you do not agree with them?