thank you... Baptism is NOT a get out of Hell free card.
Posted on 07/23/2016 8:18:41 AM PDT by pinochet
Calvinists teach that a tiny percentage of baptized Christians known as the "elect" will go to heaven. But most Christians are not Calvinists. If human meritocracy is not needed to get to heaven, shouldn't the majority of baptized Christians go to heaven?
Tablets these days! What are they teaching them in school??
Why isn’t this in the Religion Forum?
In answer to your question three saints have seen many souls falling into hell, St. Therese of Lisseux, St. Faustina, and another saint who testified to someone living that only two people went to heaven the day he died and three went to Purgatory. The rest went to hell.
Jesus Christ not baptism is the way the truth and the life.
You are going where we were told not to go. “Do not judge!” Only Jesus can make those decisions. Run the race to win, not just to qualify.
Agreed. Good point. I also think that few Calvinists believe that a person can know, in this world, whether they are one of the “elect.”
But the Apostle John told us that Heaven is populated by "a multitude which no one can number." I think I'll believe him rather some mystic visions.
he end of Thérèse's time as a postulant arrived on the January 10, 1889, with her taking of the habit. From that time she wore the 'rough homespun and brown scapular, white wimple and veil, leather belt with rosary, woollen 'stockings', rope sandals"
If catholics truly believe apparition that presented itself as Mary and the false promise made by the apparition then no catholic would ever be caught without one.
From EWTN.com....
The best known and most highly esteemed scapular, and the one most favored by the Church, and by the Blessed Virgin in many of her apparitions, is the Brown Scapular of Our Lady of Mt. Carmel. It is adapted from the scapular of the Carmelite Order and represents a special Consecration to Our Lady under the title of Our Lady of Mt. Carmel. Those who wear it practice it a special devotion to Mary. In the past this was the Little Office of Our Lady, but today this can be commuted by any priest to the rosary. In addition, the person has a special entrustment of themselves to Mary for their salvation.
This, in fact, has been promised to those who faithfully wear the scapular: "Those who die wearing this scapular shall not suffer eternal fire."
This must not be understood superstitiously or magically, but in light of Catholic teaching that perseverance in faith, hope and love are required for salvation.
>> However, there is no other way to understand this than as something superstitious or magical. It removes faith in Christ for faith in a man-made object.<<
The scapular is a powerful reminder of this Christian obligation and of Mary's promise to help those consecrated to her obtain the grace of final perseverance.
>>Again...more false teaching from roman catholicism. Mary plays no part in salvation. It is only through faith in Christ that one is saved.<<
https://www.ewtn.com/expert/answers/brown_scapular.htm
After a failed attempt to persuade Pope Pius XII to sign a condemnation, Cardinal Alfredo Ottaviani at the Holy Office included her works on a list he submitted to the newly elected Pope John XXIII in 1959.[43][44][45][46] On 6 March 1959, the Holy Office issued a notification, signed by Monsignor Hugh O'Flaherty as notary, that forbade circulation of "images and writings that promote devotion to Divine Mercy in the forms proposed by Sister Faustina" (emphasis in the original).[47] The negative judgment of the Holy Office was based both on a faulty French[48] or Italian[37][49][50][51] [52] translation of the diary, and on theological difficulties such as the claim that Jesus had promised complete remission of sin for certain devotional acts without specifying whether the forgiveness would be obtained directly or through undertaking reception of the sacraments, and what may have been thought to be excessive concentration on Faustina herself.[49]
The ban remained in place for almost two decades. Meanwhile, Archbishop Karol Wojtyła of Kraków began in 1965, with the approval of the head of the Holy Office, the informative process on Faustina's life and virtues,[48][49][49][53][54] Then, on 15 April 1978, the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith issued a new notification, signed by the Prefect and the Secretary of the Congregation, that rescinded the previous one, reversing the ban on circulation of Faustina's work. It decreed: "This Sacred Congregation, in view of the many original documents that were unknown in 1959, giving consideration to the profoundly changed circumstances, and taking into account the view of many Polish ordinaries, declares no longer binding the prohibitions contained in the cited 'notification'.".[55][56] "Also, the Prefect of the Sacred Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith declared that, "with the new 'notification' ... there no longer exists, on the part of this Sacred Congregation, any impediment to the spreading of the devotion to The Divine Mercy."[56]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faustina_Kowalska#P.C5.82ock_and_the_image_of_Divine_Mercy
A good question.
I sometimes think folks have it in their heads that salvation is easy peasy. They hear that all thing work together for the good of those who love the Lord and maybe they imagine that what’s difficult is to be lost.
Yes, with the Gospel, despite the odd hard things, the Lord has put the proverbial cookies on the bottom shelf so that anyone might be saved. As we are told: He has chosen the foolish things of the world to humble the wise ... yet God’s foolishness is wiser than man’s wisdom.
If you’ll excuse me digressing a bit...
The problem is teaching things that aren’t essential as if they are. Calvinism, like Arianianism, is an attempt to explain some of the hard things in the Scriptures: but they are not Scripture. People sometimes forget that.
As both of these pretty much can claim the opposite positions on the issue of human will and election, and as they are mutually incompatible yet still supportable from the Scriptures, it should follow that neither is actually Truth. But as explanations, provided one holds lightly to them (moderation), they seemserviceable.
The simplest way I can say this is the thing about Calvinism, again like Arainianism, is that it propounds one vote to elect. These just disagree on who votes. As a result of this simplicity they are elegant ideas. People tend to like philosophically elegant things.
Now, there is a third possibility: that election takes TWO votes, God’s foreknowledge etc isn’t passive, far from it, and yet men of their own wills agree with Him without compulsion.
We need to remember that while it says that all things work together for good for those who love Him the reverse statement is not propounded, that all things work for the bad of those who don’t love Him. Instead we are told how He gives good things to all men, that the sun rises on the good and the evil.
I reason that this is so because it actually can take a lot of work for God to bring a person whom He foreknew to the place they will turn to Him and that for most of us it is nothing less that a miracle of His providence that we do turn to Him. Sometimes He makes it look easy but that doesn’t mean it ever is easy, not requiring many thousands, if not many millions, of carefully managed events, sometimes spread out over generations. In a sense we may all be camels he’s accommodated to pass through the eye of the needle. He brings us all to the eye, but then we must agree with Him.
By contrast nothing special need be done for the lost to remain lost: God doesn’t have to chase them away. He may still, for His own purposes, walk some folks right up to salvation (rather than ignore them), providing a strong test among to them, but they choose to remain as they are.
This is false teaching.
According to...?
*Calvinists teach that a tiny percentage of baptized Christians*
If you are a Christian, as described in Scripture, you are among the elect.
Any other strawdummies hiding in your assumptions?
Pong
thank you... Baptism is NOT a get out of Hell free card.
Jesus is the Way, the Truth, and the Life, yes.
But He also commanded his disciples to go forth and baptize in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. Furthermore, he instructed them that they were to teach His words and His Word. “If you love me, you will keep my commandments.”
All Christians will go to Heaven.
I think it’s important to keep in mind that although God has prescribed the use of Sacraments as channels for His Grace, God is not bound by them.
The first sentence of the article sets up a straw man.
Calvinists teach that a tiny percentage of baptized Christians known as the "elect" will go to heaven. But most Christians are not Calvinists.
Uhhh, no. I'm not sure of the reasoning here.
Where did you get learn what you think you know about Calvinism?
Is there any church that explicitly teaches that the majority of its members will go to heaven?
I suggest you try to find B. B. Warfield's article, "Are They Few Who Will Be Saved".
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