Why Some Churches Choose to Die

Christian Post ^ | 11/22/2015 | Thom S. Rainer

[af_vet_1981]

This reminds me of MSM artices when they never mention the political party of the subject ...

[RobbyS]

Of Course.

[Faith Presses On]

Our modern society with the lifestyles brought by its technological advances doesn’t go well with Christianity.

Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.
For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it. (Matthew 16:24-25)

He that loveth his life shall lose it; and he that hateth his life in this world shall keep it unto life eternal. (John 12:25)

Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.
For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.
And the world passeth away, and the lust thereof: but he that doeth the will of God abideth for ever. (1 John 2:15-17)

[dangerdoc]

I went to a wonderful church with wonderful people. The preacher was great and gave a wonderful 20 minute message. I assume the music was good, my wife liked it but I’m no judge of music. The church wasn’t dying by attendance was stagnant and they only saw a handful of people come to Christ in a year.

We moved to a new city. We started attending a local church and things were the same, lots of music, a short but good message but no growth.

This summer we started going to a new church. Less singing but the preacher gets a good hour to preach and you can hear the bible pages humming in the congregation during his message. I don’t think he is a better speaker that the previous two preachers but there is meat in every message. The congregation give him time to deeply dive into the Word and it’s amazing. I’ve seen more people come to Christ in the last 4 months than I’ve seen over the course of my life! They’ve expanded to 4 services, with standing room only.

The Church is not dead, many congregations are starving for lack of the meat of the Word, but God is still moving.

[onedoug]

Legal struggles. One group of parishioners against the other. Very sad.

[Vision Thing]

John 6 and ‘slick song services’ don’t cancel each other out.

I attend a church that emphasizes both.

And the church is growing and helping to bring many lost people to Jesus.

[imardmd1]

I went to a wonderful church with wonderful people. The preacher was great . . .

You can stop right there. When one preacher occupies 80% of the people's attention, no matter what the assembly is for, the never-improving lack of individual spiritual discernment causes the death of the church. It ages and dies when (or before) the central leader ages and dies. A local assembly never dies when there is a superabundance of spiritually trained disciplers relying on coequal fellowship in the Gospel and not on the oratory of a man.

This summer we started going to a new church. Less singing but the preacher gets a good hour to preach and you can hear the bible pages humming in the congregation during his message.

Same problem, just a different stage of it, like an early phase in the course of a fatal infection. This group is simply in its early stages of death as an assembly, and they--like you--are not discerning enough to see it.

The marked principle of life in the true culture of Christness and reproduction of the living assembly is that each one walking in The Spirit teaches one or few (11 or less) other(s), a spiritually mature Christian recruiting new disciples, and teaching the immature ones through direct, frequent, and intimate regular personal fellowship. The contact of discipler and trainee does not consist mainly, and especially not only, in the Sunday meeting.

The death culture is that of one seminary-indoctrinated specialist teaching the many constituents, of whom very few ever grow into responsible spiritual maturity, discernment, and church government by a plurality of elders. The trouble is that the corpus of practice infused at the seminary level is almost always a derivative of the past to perpetuate the past, not directed creatively toward addressing existing or future needs.

Probably the greatest factor stifling spiritual growth is denominationalism, a supposed catholicity extending across and above local churches, towering over them, and dictating their operation, of which the model is the Roman/Byzantine paradigm, with its knock-offs of reformed, lutheran, anglican, "orthodox," etc. With this form, so-called "evangelism" has come to rest on the "social gospel" and allegiance to it by family tradition (=infant baptism) and cultural allegiance to the particular sect of religious practice.

The best example for the vital local autonomous conclave of Christians is the New Testament model typified these days by the "Plymouth" brethren, but whose power of making disciples is being encroached by elevating Bible-schoolism or seminarianism that elevates itself over and above the personalized Paul/Timothy mentorship model of spiritual growth.

The independent baptist model is in between, fluorishing but hampered when the focus of decision-making and "feeding of the flock" falls on the local pastor as the principal elder-teacher upon whom too much of the shepherding is expected. The definition of, and distinctive of "One pastor" is so limiting that usually the one appointed/ordained to it can stand no development of equally authoritative maturity in other individuals among the congregants. Here the focus tends to shift from "the Plan" (evangelism by personal contact and example) to "the Man" (attracting constituents by preaching style alone).

Of course, correct Biblical doctrine (true orthodoxy) is the key necessity for spiritual union and fellowship among local, autonomous assemblies of Christians; and today there is a wild tumlt of neo-non-orthodoxy claiming the inventiveness of people influenced by the world and its age of "information." But information is not wisdom, and the influence of orthodoxy is becoming less and less, as prophesied by The Savior Himself:

"And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.
And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold.
But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved" (Mt. 24:11-13 AV).

[wbarmy]

"Will we have to sing from screens instead of hymnals?" she asked with a tinge of anger.

The problem with singing from the screen is that the song leaders start putting more modern variations of the songs, the congregation doesn't really know the new tune, they begin to sing quieter and eventually stop singing at all, and the "Praise" leaders begin singing themselves for their own edification.

Corporate singing is the way to build Christian Fellowship and brotherly love, not the screen.

[wbarmy]

Accessory to an older church was a meeting hall-dining room, a kitchen, a lounge-restroom for women and girls, small classrooms for Sunday school instruction, and importantly, things to do the rest of the week at the church.

Praise God, if you haven't et', then you have not met.

[BDParrish]

Jesus said, “I will build My Church.” Please notice how this post and its comments presume human means of success, and visible criteria for success. How does anyone know that God is pleased or displeased by the count of those who appear to be in attendance?

Somehow, a real God might be able to make the utility payments!

Thank You Lord, for providing for us all that we need and thank You especially for making the church utility payments. It is a joy and a privilege to depend on You. Forgive us for thinking we need more people, when what we really need is You. In Jesus Name, Amen.

[redgolum]

Sermons on fornication will lead to people leaving and not giving.

Same with pro life sermons.

Pastors/priest know this. Much more fun to talk about global warming and helping people a world away than about upfront problems.

[heye2monn]

Was there anything inaccurate in my rant?