Posted on 07/20/2015 1:27:10 PM PDT by xzins
Before I reply further, how much do you know of the Bible, would you say?
What difference does that make to you if you are not looking to deceive?
So pretty much all of them.
And no, I’m not saying that is foolish not to agree with me, but that if what I have said is correct it is foolish not to look for clues and traces about God in his handiwork.
Perhaps in the interest of clarity I should have put:
IF God had put enough of himself...
THEN we are foolish not to look...
Funny how it’s “courageous” to go against cultural norms when those norms are based on Christian values,
but it’s horrific to to against cultural norms that are in opposition to Christian values.
That’s quite a charge to make, since my question was in reply to your post asking me if I acknowledge that there were people before Jesus’ incarnation who are saved. And that response of yours was in reply to mine, which said you had taken a couple snippets out of context in Acts, and also said:
“Yet again, the only wise way to interpret Scripture is with total surrender to the Lord, relinquishing any rebellion or claim to self-interpretation, asking that His will be done if it conflicts with ours, and that He might correct us when we are at odds with Him. We have no right to depart from His will for us. No, we are never in this world perfectly in His will, but we have to completely yield ourselves and all we are, do, and have, to Him. And yes Christians may be at different points, but again we must yield to wherever the Lord wants to take us next.”
You said not one word on what I wrote about the need to surrender ourselves to the Lord, which is for us to mean the part of the prayer, “THY will be done,” and to allow Him to change us if that’s His will. That’s what I’m saying. What’s the fault or error in that? I will also add that in Genesis, Eve was deceived by Satan, in the form of a serpent, to the eat the fruit forbidden by God, and when she looked at it, she saw it was “good for food, pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise.” Yet God had expressly forbidden she and Adam from eating it. And that idea comes up over and over in Scripture. In Judges, it’s said a number of times that concerning the people of Israel, each man did “what was right in his own eyes” - what seemed right to him. But what we should be doing is yielding to the Lord’s authority over our lives, by seeking His will and His help through prayer. Paul wrote that as Christians we are not our own, but were bought with a price - Jesus’ sacrificial death.
I will also say that when I’ve talked about the Bible with other Christians, and when the faith lives of other Christians are talked about, how well they know the Lord, including His Word, is very often mentioned. For Christians who know the Bible well, and meditate on it, Bible verses come to mind all the time. Many have during our discussion. Like with anything, the more you know and understand about it, the more you know and understand about it versus someone who knows little or nothing about it. And differences in knowledge and understanding will make a big difference in a discussion.
I think, friend, that you should take your own advice in surrendering yourself to God. You have responded to a question as though it was an accusation, when it was a question I was moved to write.
How well do I know the Bible? No where as well as I would like to, or feel I should, but what? Should I brag? I’ve been in it as long as you have breathed upon this earth.
You are very touchy, and that does come from ego, but isn’t that a thorn in all our flesh?! It’s sneaky, and kind of like the hydra of myth, as is fear!
Good luck, and for goodness sake, and I do mean that literally, try to be happy!
I’ll never forget, one church I was attending, the gifts of the Spirit came to the fore. Everyone was was taking tests (rather expensive tests to type personality), nobody had “tongues”, someone mentioned it I believe and received a universally stern response. Before you knew it nobody was wearing makeup, everyone was pregnant, people were trying to out-humble each other, and growing increasingly testy as a result. Next thing you know the elders were chasing the pastor through the graveyard at midnight and tossing black cats over their shoulders!
If such a thing befalls your local assembly (the 80’s will be hard to top in this lifetime), pick yourself up, dust yourself off, find another local assembly, and rejoice that God has found such amusing ways to remove the sticks from Christian butts ;)
That was an accusation. You might have simply said, “What difference does it make to you?” What you said, though, is in the same vein as “have you stopped beating your wife?” That reminded me of something I come across often in internet debates. One person says to another something like, “You haven’t been telling the truth. You’ve distorted the facts to serve your agenda.” The other person says, “I didn’t lie. Those are the facts and they speak for themselves.” Then the first person says, “I never said you lied! Don’t put words in my mouth!”
On the comments you made about me, believe what you will.
Well, Faith Presses On, don’t forget to laugh about the goings on of all us silly humans, myself certainly included. I’m glad I spoke with you, I gave you good advice that I believe I need to follow. Since being hit on by a very persistent gay person (who didn’t care that I am straight) while in Sunday School, I haven’t been back to church. High time I went :)
And no, the question was “What difference does that make to you if you are not looking to deceive?” which is a question it is possible to answer without incriminating yourself in a charge you may or may not be guilty of.
“Have you stopped beating your wife?” presupposes that you have been beating your wife. “What difference does that make to you if you are not looking to deceive?” leaves open the possibility that you are not looking to deceive.
I might be a starting Freshman, but I have dealt with a fair amount of contract law in my years of being a working stiff.
As I said, believe what you will about me.
And what you wrote was indeed an accusation, and I am not in any way going to change my conclusion on that. For one thing, you now admit as much in your last post. It was “a question it is possible to answer without incriminating yourself in a charge you may or may not be guilty of.” A CHARGE, as I said, made by you. It “(left) open the possibility that you are not looking to deceive.” Fine. That’s a distinction, in fact, that I noticed, but rejected as changing the issue at hand. “Leaving open the possibility” of innocence is not the same as not making a charge against someone in the first place. Our justice system is built on charging, or accusing people, but “leaving open the possibility” of innocence, in that a legal charge is not in itself equal to legal guilt. Following the charge, there has to be some formal process of proving the guilt of the charge. And, as we know, accusations and charges against people can themselves be taken as proof of guilt, rightly or wrongly depending on the situation, and false accusations can and do happen, and when made, are damaging.
In this case, you weren’t saying “you’re being deceptive,” but “I think you’re being deceptive and that will be my opinion if you don’t prove otherwise.”
So what was your basis for doing so? Accusations and charges aren’t to be made lightly. Deception is a most serious charge, and Christians understand how serious deception is all too well. The second I read that in your reply I recognized the gravity of it. As I mentioned, Satan in a serpent’s form deceived Eve in the Garden of Eden. Deception is for a wolf to put on sheep’s clothing for the purpose of catching and eating the true sheep, as Jesus talked about. So again, what was your basis for throwing out the most serious charge of deception?
You need help.
Forget it...you are only getting into a time loop of endless argument.
I was hanging out with my ex this weekend, he’s from upstate NY. Heck of a guy, but he’s got this guilt thing going on that manifests as stubbornness and martyrdom, which is a bad combination. There is no employment up there even in good times, I know a couple of people and they complain about the same thing.
Thankfully he has found a church home where he gets a lot of support, the pastor is his best friend. All he ever reads anymore is non-fiction, these days archaeology, and he seems to be veering toward the young earth model. I grew up Evangelical, which can be wonderful, weird, and not for the faint of heart. There are very distinct stages I went through, with many an opportunity to look back, blush, and be grateful for the distance of time from a particular a-hole version of myself. More than likely that is a process that will continue as long as I do ;)
You’re right, control-alt-delete :)
Blue screen of OMG shut up already.....LOL
...whimper...
You can believe what you will about me, as I’ve said.
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