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Church Unity in the First Three Centuries (Long)
Orthodox Outlet for Dogmatic Enquiries ^ | 2001 | Met. Iakovos Zizioulas

Posted on 02/16/2015 12:58:16 PM PST by NRx

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To: impactplayer

Sorry - That answer looks flippant to me - I apologize. I found something which may be of interest which applies to Daniel as seen by some of the early church fathers. I’d like to know what you think:

The Early Church Fathers and the Last Days of the Jewish Age
MAY 25, 2014ADAM MAARSCHALK3 COMMENTS

The following resource was compiled by Bishop George Kouri, an author and the pastor of The King’s Church in Jacksonville, Florida. He references the stated beliefs of Barnabas, Clement of Alexandrea, Origen, Tertullian, Athanasius, Irenaeus, and Hippolytus concerning “the last days”, “the end of the age,” and Daniel’s 70th Week (Daniel 9). This is not exhaustive, and there’s no doubt that leaders in church history have held quite a variety of views about these and related topics in the field of eschatology. When researching their beliefs, though, it’s easy to see that many did not view the Biblical “last days” as being about the (alleged) end of world history, but rather as the last days of the old covenant age. Here are just a few examples, as provided by George Kouri (all emphasis in the original):
BARNABAS:
Written anonymously around 100 AD, the “Epistle of Barnabas” is the earliest extra-Canonical source we have. Although not included in the Canon of the New Testament, it is an incredibly early documentation of the early Church’s beliefs about the last days. The Apostle John was probably alive when it was written. And although the authorship is disputed, we will refer to Barnabas as the author.
The Epistle of Barnabas sets forth the common view held by the early Church that the seventieth week of Daniel ended with the destruction of the Temple in 70 AD, as Messiah’s Day dawned and Christ’s Church was born. Barnabas writes, “For it is written, ‘And it shall come to pass, when the week is completed, the temple of God shall be built…in the name of the Lord.’ I find…that a temple does exist. Having received the forgiveness of sins…in our habitation God dwells in us….This is the spiritual temple built for the Lord.” (EOB, 16:6)
Barnabas uses the expression “the week,” but does not mention Daniel. Yet scholars agree from the context that this is definitely a reference to Daniel’s 70th week. And it is assumed by many scholars that the prophecy of Daniel’s seventy weeks was so well known and so widely expounded in the early Church that it needed no further explanation. The early Church did not avoid Daniel’s prophecy.
This early Christian writer connects Daniel’s vision of seventy weeks with the prophecy of Haggai 2:7-9 and the building of a “spiritual temple,” the Church. The author of the Epistle of Barnabas obviously believed that Daniel’s 70th week was fulfilled with Christ’s first advent. This was when the Old Temple was destroyed and the new “spiritual temple” was initially established. Writing in 100 AD he clearly believed the 70th week of Daniel was already completed.
It seems clear from this passage in the Epistle of Barnabas that less than a century after Christ’s passion (remember that according to Daniel the Messiah would be cut off in the middle of the 70th week), it was the widespread belief of the Church that the 70th week of Daniel was completed. It is certain that Barnabas placed the end of the 70th week no later than 70 AD. His mention of the building of the Church (which was able to grow largely unimpeded after 70AD) makes it probable that Barnabas saw 67 to 70 AD and the destruction of Herod’s Temple as the end of the Jewish or Old Covenant Age and the dawning of Messiah’s Day. As David B. Currie writes in his book, Rapture, The End-Times Error That Leaves The Bible Behind, “He (Barnabas) assumes his readers will agree that the events of ‘the week’ led to the building of the Church” (Page 422).
CLEMENT OF ALEXANDREA
Within a century of Barnabas, Clement became bishop of Alexandria until his death in 215 AD. Clement taught that the blessings of the New Covenant required the end of biblical Judaism within the 70 weeks of Daniel. Clement writes of the destruction of the Temple by the Romans in 70 AD in the prophetic language of Daniel’s seventy weeks, “Vespasian rose to the supreme power (Emperor of Rome) and destroyed Jerusalem, and desolated the holy place” (STO, XXI, 142-143).
Clement of Alexandrea believed the Jewish Age, the abomination of desolation spoken of by Daniel and the great tribulation were behind, not ahead of the Church.
ORIGEN (185-254 AD)
A student of Clement of Alexandrea, Origen agreed that the destruction of the Temple by the Romans in 70 AD marked the end of the Jewish Age and the fulfillment of Daniel’s prophecy regarding the 70 weeks. Origen writes,“The weeks of years up to the time of Christ the leader that Daniel the prophet predicted were fulfilled” (TPR, IV:1:5).
Like Clement, Origen also believed the Jewish Age, the abomination of desolation spoken of by Daniel and the great tribulation were behind the Church, not ahead of it.
TERTULLIAN
In 203 AD Tertullian wrote his famous treatise Against The Jews. This early Church father also taught that Daniel’s 70th week had been fulfilled in 70 AD: “Vespasian vanquished the Jews…and so by the date of his storming Jerusalem, the Jews had completed the seventy weeks foretold by Daniel” (AAJ, VII; CID).
Contrary to modern postponement preachers and teachers, Tertullian believed the Jewish age, the abomination of desolation, and the great tribulation was behind, not ahead of the Church.
ATHANASIUS
Athanasius was bishop of Alexandria from 326 to 373 AD. Like the early Church fathers before him, he also taught that the 70 weeks of Daniel culminated and the Jewish Age ended in 70 AD: “Jerusalem is to stand till His coming (Daniel’s reference to Messiah’s appearing in His First Advent), and thenceforth, prophet and vision cease in Israel (the end of the Old Covenant or Jewish Age). This is why Jerusalem stood till then…that they might be exercised in the types as a preparation for the reality…but from that time forth all prophecy is sealed and the city and Temple taken” (INC, XXXIX:3-XV:8).
Athanasius clearly reflects the view of the entire early Church: once the Messiah had come, the role of the Temple in Jerusalem would be ended. “Things to be done which belonged to Jerusalem beneath…were fulfilled, and those which belonged to the shadows had passed away” (FEL, IV:3-4).
This important early Church father clearly believed that the Jewish age ended in 70 AD with the destruction of Jerusalem and the Temple.
IRENAEUS AND HIPPOLYTUS
Irenaeus was a contemporary of Clement of Alexandrea whose widely held view we dealt with above. Irenaeus and his pupil Hippolytus are the only two writers from the early Church period who believed in a still-future fulfillment of Daniel’s 70th week. They both placed the 70th week at the end of the gospel age and so are the first interpreters to postulate a gap between the 69th and 70th weeks (AG, V). Both predicted a specific date for the second coming that has long since come and gone.

But their belief in a future 70th week was never widely accepted! St. Jerome specifically pointed out that the number of years in their system did not coincide with the historical events they purported to cover. He wrote, “If by any chance those of future generations should not see these predictions of his (Irenaeus) fulfilled at the time he (Irenaeus) set, then they will be forced to seek for some other solution and to convict the teacher himself (Irenaeus) of erroneous interpretation” (CID).
David B. Currie points out in his scholarly work, “As a point of history, the views of Irenaeus did give seed to premillennialism. But the early fathers of the Church strongly and universally denounced this concept. The early Church understood the presumptuous-parenthesis theory that rapturists employ…but they resoundingly rejected it” (David B. Currie, Rapture, page 425).
The prevailing view of the early Church fathers was that Daniel’s vision of the 70 weeks was fulfilled in 70 AD. The final or 70th week began with the baptism of Jesus and his presentation to Israel by John the Baptist. The Messiah was cut off in the middle of the 70th week when Jesus was crucified. The abomination of desolation and the great tribulation spoken of by Daniel were fulfilled in the destruction of Jerusalem and the Temple by the Romans in 70 AD.
These events marked the end of the Jewish age and the dawning of Messiah’s Day.


61 posted on 02/25/2015 2:20:41 PM PST by impactplayer
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To: Elsie

Obviously I was referring to the proof-texting.


62 posted on 03/01/2015 5:21:35 PM PST by D-fendr (Deus non alligatur sacramentis sed nos alligamur.)
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To: impactplayer
Jesus did submit himself for baptism. That baptism was in fulfillment of the Old Testament Covenants, as He explained to John when John questioned him Baptizing The Lord.

With the death of John the Baptist, the Old Covenant age stopped, to be renewed in the seventieth week of Daniel's prophecies. The Rabbis are already preparing the stones to rebuild the Temple and have collected the necessary items to sanctify the third Temple.

We are in The Church Age, and that is not the Catholic Church Age, it is the Age of the Spiritual Church established with Jesus' first coming (God with us) and the anointing of the Holy Spirit at Pentecost. When He, the Holy Spirit departs the World in the Rapture of the Saints (and that's not the New Orleans Saints or the Latter Day Saints), the times of the Gentiles will be fulfilled and the seventieth week of Daniel can start at any time thereafter when the Man of Sin is revealed and the strong delusion arrives.

The Holy Spirit will be going to and fro across the Earth to harvest any who will then bow to Christ during the Tribulation. I expect the Catholic Church will be quite active during that period, until the Man of Sin breaks all his covenants and proclaims he is god. Then the Seals will begin to be opened for the next 3 1/2 years of God's Wrath upon the Earth.

My advice, bow the knee to Jesus now, leave with the great departure, and don't stick around for the seventieth week of Dabiel.

63 posted on 04/26/2015 7:08:50 PM PDT by MHGinTN (Is it really all relative, Mister Einstein?)
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To: NRx
You folks certainly mean well and I commend you for shaking things up and getting Americans to stop and think objectively about religion. But no one from a Fundamentalist Protestant background is ever going to consider Eastern Orthodoxy or any other ancient "authentic" church so long as they are hostile or indifferent to the facticity of the Written Word of G-d which very much includes that "embarrassing" book of Genesis. You may prove your case on every other issue in existence, but so long as the "authentic" and "traditional" understanding is no different from the radical Protestant documentary hypothesis you are all whistling Ol' Dan Tucker to a cyclone.

And that's just the way it should be.

64 posted on 04/26/2015 7:19:54 PM PDT by Zionist Conspirator (The "end of history" will be Worldwide Judaic Theocracy.)
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To: MHGinTN

I, too, remain confident the Jesus is in charge. However we may differ on the sequence of the outcome, the final outcome is clear. I see Daniels seventieth week as already completed - the first 3 1/2 years during Jesus’ ministry, and the final 3 1/2 years leading up to the destruction of Israel. But there is room for discussion on “how”, just not on “what”, the end will look like. JESUS WINS!!!


65 posted on 04/26/2015 7:36:53 PM PDT by impactplayer
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To: Zionist Conspirator

We are not hostile to Scripture. We codified it. We are however, hostile to the bizarre interpretations that have been applied to it by man founded sects over the last 500 years.


66 posted on 04/26/2015 8:23:29 PM PDT by NRx (An unrepentant champion of the old order and determined foe of damnable Whiggery in all its forms.)
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To: impactplayer
God's power is not limited. In Revelation 4:1 I happen to believe John is telling us he experienced the rapture, and the end of the Church Age, because what follows all the way to chapter 19 is viewed from above and involves the things forecast to happen during Daniel's seventieth week.

There are several 'harpazo' events even in the Old Testament, but the big one is fixin' to occur (rapturo was the word Saint Jerome used) ... millions and millions being caught up into the clouds to meet the Lord in the Air.

There are many scholars who debate these issues, and they are all good Christian brothers and sisters. The neat thing about the Rapture is, if you are in Christ (regardless of which denomination or which Parish) you get Raptured whether you expect it or not, because you are The Bride of Christ by His Grace.

67 posted on 04/26/2015 8:51:38 PM PDT by MHGinTN (Is it really all relative, Mister Einstein?)
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