Posted on 04/23/2014 9:41:45 AM PDT by marshmallow
Pope Francis has phoned a divorced and remarried Catholic woman in Argentina to tell her that she could "safely receive Communion", according to an extraordinary report in La Stampa.
The woman's husband, writing on Facebook, claims that the Pope – introducing himself as "Father Bergoglio" – spoke to his wife, who'd been divorced before marrying him and told her that men or women who were divorced and received Communion weren't doing anything wrong. He apparently added that this matter is under discussion at the Vatican. (Quick health warning: given the complexity of this subject, we need much more clarity on what Francis reportedly said. I find it hard to believe that he would make such an unqualified statement.)
(Excerpt) Read more at blogs.telegraph.co.uk ...
“But if you are a Kennedy, as in Ted Kennedy and Jackie, or other famous person with money, you can get an annulment. It’s a racket.
In an annulment, both parties have to sign. If the other party can’t be found, or refuses to sign, the annulment is refused”
My wife received an annulment. It took 2 years and cost her $500. The annulment was granted because her ex-husband refused to attend Mass from the minute they were married. She had many statements from witnesses that attested to that fact. He refused to sign the paperwork. Made no difference. Annulment was granted.
Thanks for the ping. Unfortunately impossible to dismiss this story out of hand, considering his other questionable comments and actions, his propensity for making surprise personal calls to average Joes and his delight with Kasper’s theology.
So if people are sharing a residence in good conscience, and it's not a near occasion of sin to them, and they are not indulging in illicit sex, there's no reason to deny them Communion.
In mortal sin, one should voluntarily exclude himself, since receiving Communion in sat sate, is another mortal sin in itself.
Mortal sin of a public, defiant, and unrepentant nature is the one reason a person should be denied Holy Communion by the person who is distributing Communion (priest, deacon, etc.), and then only if their sin is "obstinate, manifest and grave."
"Obstinate" means they have been warned, but unrepentantly persist.
"Manifest" means it is publicly known, open, defiant.
"Grave" means serious, as in mortal, sin. Which any sexual sin would be, e.g. hetero porn, anybody?
"Can. 915 - Those who have been excommunicated or interdicted after the imposition or declaration of the penalty and others obstinately persevering in manifest grave sin are not to be admitted to Holy Communion."
I’m fully aware of that; I’m waiting for the day Nancy “Abortion is sacred to my Catholic faith” Pelosi presents herself for Communion and walks away empty-handed.
I just wanted to say thank you for the explanation of terms. It’s important to know what they mean.
No s***.
Neither do I.
Supposed to be "receiving communion in THAT STATE."
It's my fingers, my pore ol' geriatric fingers, I tell ya....
Just recently learned (via unbidden gossip! I hate gossip!) that decades ago they used to be a lesbian couple, but that their friendship has been non-sexual for decades. Carol depends on Sue very much to manage the household, since she is unable to walk and is losing her mental acuity.
This might be the kind of situation Pope Francis would be thinking of. My impression is that it's not unusual for some older lesbians to ditch sex in middle age but to remain devoted for life. Whether they have repented their younger lesbian sexual vice is between them and their Confessor, their God or their diary.
As for me, it's none of my business. There's surely no sin in their just living together.
Of course people live together for other reasons than having sexual relations and I wouldn’t think anything about people living together. We, at least I, was talking admitted actual homosexuals and the church.
I’m a Christian, not Catholic, but definitely am interested in the Pope since what he does reflects on Christianity to many people. So I read an update from this article’s author, and googled it, and what I found is that according to CNN, the Pope DID call this woman. The Vatican has confirmed it, but said it can’t say anything about the content of the call.
What this article’s author says in his update is that the problem is that in this controversy and every other one so far, the Vatican hasn’t come out and simply cleared up the controversy one way or the other. The suggestion is that the Vatican is deliberately creating such confusion, and with that I agree.
Lisbona said the pope told her she should go to Communion, though she did not provide many other details. She seems put off by all the fuss.Unfortunately this story has the ring of authenticity. I see no reason at present to doubt the veracity of the woman's claims as they simply reiterate what Cardinal Kasper has been spouting with the blessing of this Pope.
“This received too much public attention. He told me to go and take Communion in a different parish, but now I won’t be able to go anywhere,” she told the radio. The pope said he was “dealing with the issue” of Communion for divorced and remarried Catholics, and she added:
“Then he told me there are some priests who are more papist that the pope. He was completely normal with me on the phone and I tried to speak to him with the utmost respect. Now I am overwhelmed by the enormous effect this story has had and I feel moved by the fact that I spoke to Francis. I told him I would write to him again when I take Communion again.”
A Vatican spokesman confirmed the telephone call but would not comment on the conversation’s content.
“It’s between the Pope and the woman,” said the Rev. Thomas Rosica, a consultant for the Vatican press office.
Rosica said that any comments made by the Pope should not be construed as a change in church doctrine. “The magisterium of the church is not defined by personal phone calls.”
The Pope’s just winging it as he goes. Welcome to Popetown!
Thanks for the ping. Why am I not surprised?
Which indicates that what he did say does not comport with Church law.
As for Rosica? “It’s between the Pope and woman?” God help me if that doesn’t sounds like, “It’s between the woman and her doctor...”
There's certainly nothing in the New Testament that says a divorced person can't receive communion.
Did the Catholic church at some point add a teaching which declared that a divorced person can't receive communion?
She’s remarried. And without an annulment of her previous marriage she’s committing adultery with her new husband and is therefore in a state of mortal sin and not worthy to receive communion.
She’s a mistress living with a married man who rejected his wife.
I'm not Catholic nor am I in favor of divorce except as a last resort when all other efforts fail. That said as a widower in my late 20's I married a divorcee in her mid 30's. Her divorce came from abuse then abandonment. Our marriage has lasted over 28 years under a circumstance not many endure.
Oddly enough it was a Nun's counseling to my then girlfriend now wife {also non Catholic} told her go ahead with our wedding. Her dad was a sadist in all respects had tried to stop the wedding and made false accusations against both of us.
Our wedding was in a hospital chapel overseen by a Catholic hospital with our Baptist preacher officiating and several Nuns and the Chaplain {a Priest} in attendance. We still have the cross he blessed.
Divorce hurts. The issues of the divorce should be addressed before a person consider getting involved with anyone else. Otherwise the problems of the previous marriage enter the new one. In my wife's case her minister knew all the circumstance of her divorce and said she'd done all she could. He also after time had lapsed said go ahead and date. She had asked after she met me two years later. The judge granting the divorce looked her husband in the eye and said "you did everything wrong in the marriage she did nothing wrong I grant her the divorce" She went to get her divorce on a gurney taken to the court house by paramedics. He had left her two years earlier.
Sometimes divorce is the only answer just as some times marrying again is the only logical answer. Both should be done only after prayer and counseling.
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