Posted on 04/03/2014 4:52:36 PM PDT by Rashputin
How do you get any plainer than this:
1 John 3:2 Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.
3 And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure.
4 Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.
And this:
7 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.
8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
I don't know about Yeshua; but Jesus died for the Church, as follows:
"Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;" (Eph 5:25 KJV)
>>>His chief commandment is to obey all of his commandments.<<<
I agree. And these are his commandments:
"Master, which is the great commandment in the law? Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets." (Mat 22:36-40 KJV)
>>>Paul and James stated in the clearest of terms that only doers of his law will be justified. Do you not believe them?<<<
Did you take Romans and James out of context? I believe you did. Maybe you can explain the context you used in making that general accusation.
>>>John stated the direct opposite of what you say in 1John 3<<<
I doubt it. Jesus said all the law hangs on the two Great Commandments. He summarized them into one commandment here:
"This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you." (John 15:12 KJV)
Are you assuming John didn’t know what Jesus said, and was, instead, relying on the 600+ laws and ordinances of Moses?
Jesus simplified the "law" even further in Matthew 7:12:
"Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets." (Mat 7:12 KJV)
Paul confirmed:
"For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself." (Gal 5:14 KJV)
"Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law." (Rom 13:10 KJV)
John explained Jesus's commandment this way:
"And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment." (1 Jn 3:23 KJV)
That blows a few holes in your understanding of 1st and 2nd John, doesn't it?
>>>You think that saying the "sinner's prayer" can save you? Can you find it anywhere in God's word?<<<
I have no idea what the sinner's prayer is.
BTW, do you follow the Torah? Do you follow all the laws and ordinances of Moses?
Philip
Where would you get the idea that it is “Gods will” that we not be observant of his commandments today?
so can someone answer my yes or no question about circumcision?
Ahhh, now I think we're getting to the root of the matter - so to speak.
ES - I'm getting a glimpse of some dark underlying theme here in that some seem to embrace a false idea they are no longer capable of sin? Needs more study...
Sorry, I missed the question. Which # is it?
sorry, see post #153
also #179
I have not read the previous posts and this is the first I believe I was ‘pinged’ to. However, I see another opportunity for Jesus (Yeshua) followers to hurl fecal matter at each other.
The NT is clear. Trust and Obey. In that order too! When we submit to Jesus Christ (Yeshua HaMashiach)as Savior and Lord that means something. It means we submit to His ways and emulate Him. That is what a disciple will do. And frankly if we look at what the apostles taught through epistles, we ‘know’ what ways are His Ways. Meaning the apostles spend an enormous amount of time preaching the Gospel, for others to spread the Gospel; for us to live holy lives; to love God with all our heart, mind, soul, and strength and to love each other as He loved us.
Now whether or not one observes festivals, new moons, certain days etc. or not, the above is what was COMMANDED.
Paul was clear on the matter. If some followers of Jesus Christ want to observe such functions, fine but not to impose it on others and the others should not condemn those who do observe. Only cultists like the Romans, Mormon, JWs et al. impose things on others where Christ gives us freedom.
And to nip things in the bud, please I ask all to spare me the antinomian straw man. I don’t think anyone addressed advocates the moral laws were “nailed to the cross.” Followers of Jesus Christ uphold the moral laws not thumb their noses at them.
So I suggest we all pray for one another, love one another because those WERE HIS COMMANDS.
There are practical reasons behind many of the commandments in the Torah that had to deal with life in general of that time period. Circumcision around the 8th day was the opportune time to perform it for health of the child reasons (No antibiotics, less medical knowledge, etc. in those days). Remember, most of these laws were to the benefit man, not man made for the law (i.e., March 2:27 Then he said to them, “The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath.).
There is that discernment/knowledge thing again:
Hosea 4:6 (NIV) my people are destroyed from lack of knowledge.
“Because you have rejected knowledge, I also reject you as my priests;
because you have ignored the law of your God,
I also will ignore your children
Amen Sir!
>>>Ahhh, now I think we’re getting to the root of the matter - so to speak. ES - I’m getting a glimpse of some dark underlying theme here in that some seem to embrace a false idea they are no longer capable of sin? Needs more study...<<<
You make no sense. Why not bother someone else with your holier-than-thou attitude?
Philip
this is like nailing down jello, all i am looking for is a simple yes or no.
must Genesis 17:9-14 ( part of the Torah ), be obeyed today?
It's not a "holier-than-thou attitude". I'm trying to understand why some "seem" to feel a need that they are no longer sinners. It's pretty obvious that we all "miss the mark" of being righteousness in the example that has been set, and that "we all" need to "work" on that problem - no?
It’s not a “holier-than-thou attitude”. I’m trying to understand why some “seem” to feel a need that they are no longer sinners
LOL, so much effort put in about following the law, but i guess it’s doesn’t include bearing false witness against your neighbor.
NO ONE REMOTELY HINTED ON THIS THREAD THAT THEY ARE NO LONGER SINNERS.
I had to be put in the hospital for several days due to a complication from not being circumcised as an infant that developed into an emergency condition as a toddler. I would have probably died if not for modern medicine. So there is a reason for having it done - at least in some cases (i.e., mine). I still have vivid memories of that ordeal even tho I was only about a 3yo at the time.
Does that help?
It must be obeyed by those that are “of the circumcision.” This is an elective issue; if you believe that something is sinful, but keep doing it, you are sinning.
Does that help?
It’s an answer which i thank you for. Best as i can understand it, the answer appears to be “no”.
Like I said, I just caught a glimpse of it. There one moment, gone the next; but enough of a glimpse that it's causing me to wonder about it.
It must be obeyed by those that are “of the circumcision
oh, i see, so God has two laws -
1. for the “of the circumcision”
2. the other i guess for those “ not of circumcision”
my pagan Bible says in Christ there is neither Jew nor Greek.
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