CHRISTIANS AMONG MONGOL INVADERS (of Japan)

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[Destro]

The Koryo-Mongol Allied Invasion of Japan - The Myth of Kamikaze

[newsgatherer]

That there had been quite a few Christians among the Mongol soldiers, is seen in the many iron helmets, found on the battlefield after the war, that had the mark of the cross engraved on them.

The flaw in the logic is that a cross on a helpmet does not a Christian make.

Christian: One who believes in and follows Christ Jesus. And as such, by default one who is Born Again (John 3:3) Reaches out to all with the Gospel (Mark 16:15) And believes with all his or ehr hearth that Jesus is God and spreads the word of Christianity and salvation only through Christ (Romans 10:8,9&10)

Therefore, a Christian would be at odds, not alliiegence with the mongul hordes.

[Destro]

What you wrote is based on your ideology and interpretation of what it means to be a Christian and is not a historical analysis worthy of discussion. Lastly, you are not an arbiter of what a Christian is or who is a Christian and thus your point is doubly moot.

[PzLdr]

There were Nestorian Christians among the Mongols long before the invasion of Japan. Toghrul, the Wang Khan of the Keraits and a large number of his people were Nestorians, and were conquered by Temuchin prior to his proclamation as Chinnghis Khan in 1206. Hulegu's wife was a Nestorian, as were several Mongol generals. During the attack on the West (1236-1242), at-least one Englishman functioned as a translator/ambassador/spy for the Mongols. He was executed outside of either Vienna or Wiener Neustadt by the Austrians after his capture.

Since under the Jasagh, religious freedom was recognized, and guaranteed by the Khan,a Christian could indeed give his allegiance to the Khans, at least until Guyuk Kha Khan invited the Pope to submit at Karakorum after the Pope asked him to submit in Rome. Christian Georgia was a vassal state of the Mongols, as were the Russian principalities and at least one vassal state in the Holy Land. And the Pope did send missionaries (too few) at the request of Kubilai Khan.

[NZerFromHK]

Amen brother. The world has it own ideas of what a Christian is, but the Bible states what a true Christian is.

History reveals that the Mongols were not particularly (Eastern) Orthodox Christian just because it was alleged to be favourable to (Eastern) Orthodox members. It reveals that they are ecumenical as far as faith is concerned - Mongols adopted whatever religion their conquered land is - so for example in Yuan dynasty areas (China) they became Sinicized, in Central Asia they become - to the horrors of many here no doubt - Muslims - the Mughul Empire of India later on was Islamic yes, but bear in mind also that it was Mongol in ethnicity. In fact as the Yuan dynasty received the first ever official papal emissary to China from Rome later on, and as far as Christendom is concerned the Mongols are equal opportunity promoters.

[Destro]

That is such a distortion of history and of the Bible. The Mongols who adopted Christianity (some place it at 10% in the high end) became Christian before their conquests and adopted it from the conversion missions of Nestorian and Jacobite Christians.

Lastly I will write to you what I wrote to the other poster: What you wrote is based on your ideology and interpretation of what it means to be a Christian and is not a historical analysis worthy of discussion. Lastly, you are not an arbiter of what a Christian is or who is a Christian and thus your point is doubly moot.

[dangus]

Well, they were conquered Christians. Were they necessarily from China? Could they have not been from India, the nations which are now the "Stans" or Russia?

[Logophile]

This was to be the most serious threat of aggression from abroad that Japan was to experience until World War II of the twentieth century.

The Japanese were victims of foreign aggression in World War II?

[redgolum]

Interesting post.

There were a lot of Nestorian Christians in the East well before colonization. The Golden Horde also had a number of Christian generals and soldiers.

The crusader states at first looked to the Mongols as "Prestor John's Armies". They knew that some of the leaders where Christian, if not Catholic.

[Destro]

And what did the retarded Crusaders do when the mongols asked for passage through Crusader state land to get at the Mameluks in Egypt? They rated them out and gave passage to their enemies the Mameluks who defeated a reduced garrison Mongol army.

As a thank you the Mameluks wiped out the Crusader states and many Chirstian populations.

[sharktrager]

I am curious what in your assessment would put fighting with the Mongols at odds with being a Christian?

[redgolum]

The later crusades were known for their ,well for lack of a better word, stupid political maneuvers.

That is what spelled the end of the Kingdom of Jerusalem. Most of the European kings and nobles didn't want to get involved in more back stabbing politics when they had plenty back home. Basically, they lost interest.

[newsgatherer]

Mongols policy of rape and pillage is in direct conflict with John the Baptist:And the soldiers likewise demanded of him, saying, And what shall we do? And he said unto them, Do violence to no man, neither accuse any falsely; and be content with your wages. Luke 3

[Destro]

Screw off - the presence of Christianity in is a well established fact but since the Mongols kept no written record we don't know many details. You and your knowledge base is what needs to get out of the trashcan. Go read a history book or something.

[Destro]

What does "at present" have to do with the situation in 1259 AD? You are irrational and divorced from facts and ability to analyze them. Leave this ost to peole who know how to think.

[blam]

GGG Ping.

Play nice. Here's something I posted 2-3 years ago.

Christian Designs Found In Tomb Stones Of Eastern Han Dynasty

"When studying a batch of stone carvings of Eastern Han Dynasty (25-220 A.D.) stored and exhibited in the Museum of Xuzhou Han Stone Carvings, Christian theology professor Wang Weifan was greatly surprised by some stone engravings demonstrating the Bible stories and designs of early Christian times."