San Jose to Propose Turning PG&E Into Giant Customer-Owned Utility

WSJ ^ | 10 21 2019 | Rebecca Smith

[MV=PY]

“Is that like nationalizing it to make it “worker-owned?”

Here’s a quick overview.

There are four types of utilities in the US:

Investor Owned (IOUs)
Cooperatives (Coops)
Municipal (Munis)
Federally managed (Tennessee Valley authority, Bonneville Power Association)

Coops and Munis are “customer owned” (COUs)

IOUs are often regulated (prices and practices) because they are considered a monopoly.

Historically, a fair amount of volatility has existed in service territories and business organization types. Recently, for example, Boulder CO (municipality) tried to take over Xcel’s (IOU) territory.

San Jose could attempt to take over their portion of the PG&E territory.

Many of these kinds of deals wind up in long court battles depending on the hostility of the relationships. Sometimes the change occurs.

[Skybird]

For nearly 90 years, Nebraska has it’s own bit of “socialism on the plains” in the form of public power districts and no investor owned or private companies.

Overall, it seems to have worked out well, along with a one house unicameral legislature of 49 state senators. Both the creation of George W. Norris in the 1930’s.

[Pelham]

It’s rural transmission lines through forested areas that have been implicated in the fires.

The biggest problem inner city lines have is thieves trying to steal copper.

[_Jim]

re: “Customer-Owned Utility”

Not an oxymoron, but, a redundancy.

[_Jim]

re: “The biggest problem inner city lines have is thieves trying to steal copper.”

Ha. The joke is on them, everything (exc the ground wire) is aluminum on distribution lines.

[Pelham]

Apologists for PG&E need to show us even one objection by PG&E that state policy was forcing them to operate unsafely. They didn’t object. They’d been cutting corners on their own to keep their bonuses coming. They have been neglecting safety for years, long before the current crop of lunatics in Sacramento saddled them with all of the green power mandates.

PG&E has some poles in service that are 100 years old. They depreciated them for 20 yrs, then started over again without ever changing them. Rinse and repeat. I have a friend who spent his career in the power industry and participated in this.

[_Jim]

re:

“There are four types of utilities in the US:

Investor Owned (IOUs)
Cooperatives (Coops)
Municipal (Munis)
Federally managed (Tennessee Valley authority, Bonneville Power Association)”

---

I would argue there are five; Used to be Texas Power and Light was simply “the power company” and did not have public shareholders (but probably maybe private) but rather just ‘owners’ (to the best of my knowledge) - they were simply the assemblage of little powercos that became one big powerco which sold power and owned the distribution and transmission lines. THEN deregulation in Texas changed all that with the formation of TXU.

[Pelham]

Earlier this year there was one crispy critter who tried stealing copper line going to street lights. Stealing the copper Americans won’t steal anymore. Well, trying to steal it anyway.

[MV=PY]

Thanks for the info. Texas is a strange one with their deregulation of the retail side.

Every state has different stories.

I’d consider the old Texas Power and Light an IOU, even if it was privately held.

[MV=PY]

"For nearly 90 years, Nebraska has it’s own bit of “socialism on the plains” in the form of public power districts and no investor owned or private companies."

Thanks for the info.

I think munis and coops work well because they are locally controlled. If the customers get unhappy, the POUs respond to local political pressure.

That's a lot different than having the geniuses in far-off DC making decisions for you.