Principal says he was fired for leading volunteer prayer meeting (GA)

myfoxphilly.com ^ | May 2, 2015

[wintertime]

I have a better idea!

Abolish government schooling.

[Poison Pill]

In an ideal world, we wouldn’t have public education and this argument would be moot. I would much rather have my real estate and other taxes back and make my own educational arrangements.

[wintertime]

All schooling of children is indoctrination. Why? Answer: It is impossible for education to be religiously, culturally, and politically neutral. Such a state of neutrality is impossible in the mind of any sentient human.

Therefore!

Get government out of the education business. Begin the process of privatizing K-12 schooling. Let these non-neutral cultural, political, and religious worldview issues be settled in the private sector between private teachers and private principals.

[Poison Pill]

All schooling of children is indoctrination.

As I said in 62, in an ideal world, we wouldn't have public education. But we don't live in an ideal world, we live in this one. Sometimes you don't get to pick the hill you fight on.

[fr_freak]

I agree with the privatization of schools. There is a natural tendency of government to become overbearing and abusive in every area where they have power. The Founders knew this, and limited the power of the Fed accordingly.

However, cultural rejection of the concept that all cultures , religions, philosophies, etc. are morally equal is important. The Church vs. State argument always gets around to "well, would you be happy letting Muslims pray in school/city hall/whatever? Then we must ban ALL religion from everywhere", but this argument assumes that Islam, or Satanism, for that matter, is equal to Christianity, both in the sense of being a morally respectable religion AND of being equally important to the culture of the USA. Obviously, neither are true.

The Founders did not intend to provide for the acceptance of every single whacked out religion from the world over. They merely wanted to avoid a federally-sanctioned or mandated religion. The current interpretation of the First Amendment as a power of the Fed to regulate individual behavior inside local jurisdictions is a complete reversal of the very purpose of the Constitution, and that interpretation effectively strips the people of their right and ability to self-determination. If a community can't establish societal standards but are instead forced to accept foreign ones at the point of a gun, how can we possibly say they are in any way free?

[NorthstarMom]

The belief that there is no neutral is why we pulled our kids out of public school to homeschool them.

It has been the hardest thing I have undertaken, but after seven years I am still glad we made that choice.

[NorthstarMom]

You seem to be under the impression that the school is sponsoring the FCA group. It is merely using the building. Have you ever been to a school building in the evening after school hours? It is a busy place, many groups are using it and not all are school sponsored teams, clubs, etc.

Even churches can rent the space to use for worship on Sundays, that doesn’t mean the school is sponsoring the church. Our church rents the gym and a couple of classrooms to use for Wednesday night kids programs. Using space is not the same as sponsoring. It is a public building and after school hours it is used as a community center for all kinds of groups.

[Adder]

In an ideal world I would agree.

Unfortunately we do not have “education” we have indoctrination.

[wintertime]

you don't get to pick the hill you fight on.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

I did. I homeschooled my children. The government reports that now 4% of school-age children are homeschooled. The real number is likely twice that. Vouchers, charters, tax credits, and Internet schooling expand year by year and state by state.

Ideas are the most powerful thing in the universe. Remember, please, that we exist at all began as an idea in the mind of God. That government schooling is a illegitimate First Amendment and freedom of conscience abomination is a **powerful** idea and it is taking strong root in the hearts and minds of the citizens of this nation.

Powerful and intractable institutions can lose their legitimacy seemingly overnight. There are many examples. Our American Revolution is one. Government K-12 schooling is not immune.

[wintertime]

I agree with everything that you wrote. For this reason government should be as limited as possible since very little action taken by government is completely religiously, culturally, or politically neutral. The minimal amount of government that is needed should be as locally controlled as possible. And...If it is a service or product can be found in a Yellow Pages then it should probably be done privately, or, only when absolutely necessary, contracted by the government to private vendors.

The nation would be better off without government owned and run schools. They are an illegitimate First Amendment and freedom of conscience abomination. No child should be forced into such an environment ( godless or God-centered) and no taxpayer should be under police and court threat to pay for it. The content and consequences of these government indoctrination centers can never be neutral.

Government schooling never was, is not now, and never can be religiously, culturally, or politically neutral. Why? Because education can never be politically, culturally, or religiously neutral. Such neutrality is an impossible philosophic state of mind.

[Poison Pill]

You seem to be under the impression that the school is sponsoring the FCA group. It is merely using the building.

I'm sure there are all sorts of different arrangements made in school districts across the country for building use. Some clubs are associated with the student body, some aren't. Some pay, some don't. I get that. The issue in this story was not building use per se, but that the Principle was running the group which was wrong IMO and in the opinion of the local school board. For the record, I don't think what he did justified being fired.

We did sort of go off a building use tangent though. My opinion is that these public school buildings not be used for prayer groups.

[combat_boots]

Meriwether County Schools
2100 Gaston Street, PO BOX 70 Greenville GA 30222
Phone: 706-672-4297

[NorthstarMom]

To be clear, you are saying that the principal should not be running a prayer group on his own time? It was an after school group so it was not during school hours.

[Poison Pill]

To be clear, you are saying that the principal should not be running a prayer group on his own time?

Yes, in the school he should not be running a prayer group. I find the "on his own time" argument to be specious. School administators don't punch a time clock and don't work fixed hours. When does he start and stop getting paid? If while he is in the building the to lead the group he sees some violation of school policy (bullying, drug use, etc.) does he just ignore it because he is off the clock? He can't un-be the Principle when he is in the building.

[Theodore R.]

There is no stopping the social juggernaut until we are living under communism.

You are right; the American people will never understand though.

[NorthstarMom]

What about the reverse situation, if a church is used as a polling place, then the pastor of that church shouldn’t serve as an election judge? You are applying a standard based on the location of the meeting that violates this principal’s right to freedom of religion.

[ilovesarah2012]

Of course.

[ilovesarah2012]

I believe the government will try to make home-schooling more difficult. My daughter is expecting in a month and I have told her to please never let her go to a public school.

[HotHunt]

[cva66snipe]

I graduated high school in 1976. My principal was an active ordained minister. He officiated my sister and brother in law's wedding and likely many more of his former students weddings. He had the respect of the students and staff and control of the school.

In grade school we had voluntary assemblies about once a month and a local preacher would come by and talk to the students. Morning Pledge, devotion, and The Lord's Prayer, was part of beginning the school day. I miss the nation of my youth.