Posted on 03/10/2015 11:23:16 AM PDT by Red Steel
Thank you for your interest in ATF's proposed framework for determining whether certain projectiles are “primarily intended for sporting purposes” within the meaning of 18 U.S.C. 921(a)(17)(C). The informal comment period will close on Monday, March 16, 2015. ATF has already received more than 80,000 comments, which will be made publicly available as soon as practicable.
Although ATF endeavored to create a proposal that reflected a good faith interpretation of the law and balanced the interests of law enforcement, industry, and sportsmen, the vast majority of the comments received to date are critical of the framework, and include issues that deserve further study. Accordingly, ATF will not at this time seek to issue a final framework. After the close of the comment period, ATF will process the comments received, further evaluate the issues raised therein, and provide additional open and transparent process (for example, through additional proposals and opportunities for comment) before proceeding with any framework.
The feds have been trying for years to get the list of CCDW holders in Kentucky. Don’t know if they have yet succeeded, what with our commie guv Brashear. It is against Kentucky law for that to happen, but I know he’d turn us over if he thought he could get away with it.
There are databases and then there are databases. Meshing that information takes time and trouble. Offering them a handy list of which weapons are where and who has them is beyond my tolerance. I'd rather give money to SAF for the lawsuit.
I had a case of IMI M193, then I tipped the boat over. Damn.
Seriously, for an old guy in need of cataract surgery, I suspect WPA Military Classic is probably sufficient. Never had a problem with it. Punches a nice hole in regular steel.
I’m waiting for them to ban Russian & Ukraine 7.62x39. Leaving us to the expensive brass stuff.
Where was it selling for $1.00 per round? I saw it for upwards of $.60.
Yeah, a more honest ATF answer: oh crap we didn’t expect all this! :-)
The cudgel and rubber hose treatment in the basement of some DOJ or BATF Lubyanka will eventually establish just who is guilty of actually owning one. But don't worry, if they refuse to initially confess to their crimes they will later. After all, we know The State would not arrest somebody unless they were guilty of something. Eventually, everyone confesses, Comrade. Everyone.
... and
Senate Judiciary letter signed by 52 senators.
And also
Fraternal Order of Police (FOP) said it was not necessary, and not historically a threat posed to LE.
No hoarding it.Having it.Better to have some than none.If they did buy a ton it cost them quite a bit over regular price two weeks ago.Price will go down some in a few weeks.
>>You know damn well every one of those 80k objectors is now on a *list*.
F... their lists. If you aren’t a “list” already, then you watch too much TV, because just about everything else will get you on a “list”.
As freepers consider the following material, please note that the ATF might not have become a burden to intrastate commerce if state lawmakers hadn’t foolishly ratified the ill-conceived 17th Amendment, foolishly giving up the voices of the state legislatures in Congress by doing so.
Next, consider that the Founding States had made the first numbered clauses in the Constitution, Sections 1-3 of Article I, evidently a good place to hide them from corrupt Congress, to clarify that all federal legislative powers are vested in the elected members of Congress, not in the executive or judicial branches, or in constitutional undefined federal agencies like the ATF (EPA, etc.).
So Congress has a constitutional monopoly on federal legislative powers whether it wants it or not. And by delegating powers to non-elected third parties like the bureaucrats running the ATF, Congress is wrongly protection federal legislative powers from the wrath of the voters in blatant defiance of Sections 1-3 referenced above imo.
Regarding the ATF, patriots need to learn to do the following every time they hear an issue concerning the corrupt federal government. Patriots need to try to find a clause in Congress’s Article I, Section 8-limited powers which is reasonably related to the issue that they are concerned about. And if they don’t find a related clause, which is probably what will happen with most issues, then they need to wise up to the idea of an unconstitutional law or federal agency that needs to disappear.
And here are some major constitutional negatives about the ATF. First, although the states have delegated to Congress the specific power, via the Commerce Clause, to regulate commerce that is traded across state borders, please consider the following.
Regardless what FDR’s thug justices wanted everybody to believe about the scope of Congress’s Commerce Clause powers when it wrongly decided Wickard v. Filburn in corrupt Congress’s favor in 1942 imo, FDR’s justices wrongly ignored that a previous generation of 10th Amendment-respecting justices had clarified the following. The states have never delegated to the feds, expressly via the Constitution, the specific power to regulate intrastate commerce.
”State inspection laws, health laws, and laws for regulating the internal commerce of a State, and those which respect turnpike roads, ferries, &c. are not within the power granted to Congress [emphases added].” —Gibbons v. Ogden, 1824.
So regarding the subject of this thread, the feds minimally have no constitutional authority to regulate over the counter firearms sales imo.
In fact, it is disturbing to note that federal regulations for personal protection firearms seemingly started appearing in the books when Constitution-ignoring socialist FDR was president.
Franklin Roosevelt: The Father of Gun Control
Also, when the 18th Amendment was repealed by the 21st Amendment, not only should the corrupt feds have gotten their big noses out of booze-related intrastate commerce imo, but consider the following. In addition to the Supreme Court historically clarifying that Congress has no Commerce Clause power to regulate intrastate commerce, a later case opinion singles out agriculture as an example category of what feds shouldn’t be regulating, both alcohol and tobacco production falling under agricultural production.
”From the accepted doctrine that the United States is a government of delegated powers, it follows that those not expressly granted, or reasonably to be implied from such as are conferred, are reserved to the states, or to the people. To forestall any suggestion to the contrary, the Tenth Amendment was adopted. The same proposition, otherwise stated, is that powers not granted are prohibited. None to regulate agricultural production is given, and therefore legislation by Congress for that purpose is forbidden [emphasis added].” —United States v. Butler, 1936.
Also note that regardless that federal Democrats, RINOs, corrupt justices and institutionally indoctrinated attorneys will argue that if the Constitution doesn’t say that the feds can’t do something then they can do it, the Supreme Court has addressed that foolish idea too. Politically correct interpretations of the Constitution's Supremacy Clause aside, the Court has clarified in broad terms that powers not delegated to the feds, expressly via the Constitution, the specific power to regulate intrastate commerce in this case, are prohibited to the feds.
”From the accepted doctrine that the United States is a government of delegated powers, it follows that those not expressly granted, or reasonably to be implied from such as are conferred, are reserved to the states, or to the people. To forestall any suggestion to the contrary, the Tenth Amendment was adopted. The same proposition, otherwise stated, is that powers not granted are prohibited [emphasis added].” —United States v. Butler, 1936.
Are we having fun yet?
What a mess! 8^P
The 17th Amendment needs to be repealed to keep the corrupt feds out of intrastate commerce.
I was reading an article regarding the ATF ban last week and it said that the ATF Regulations are published every 10 years, the last being in 2005 and the most recent being in January 2015.
According to the article, in 2005 5.56mm ammo was specifically listed on the Regs as exempt for “sporting purposes”, but the 2015 Regs did not have 5.56mm listed as exempt any longer.
The question came up as to why the ATF is taking comments on something that they have already published. My concern is that this public retreat does not change the January published Regs. Does anyone else have any insight on that?
Bump
Very little I shoot is as small as .223
Some I shoot is still loaded with cast lead bullets. They are working on the supply side of that to end it.
They can simply forget it in TX. No matter what scheme they think up to disarm US, WE will not comply here.
This makes me wonder, exactly what is it that they plan to do that brings them to want to disarm us soooo Badly?
Makes no difference. It’s unconstitutional and WE will not comply.
HAHA!!!
As a retired bureaucrat, my interpretation is that the BATFE management is doing this as a desperate self-protective measure.
With the discovery of the ATF manual that took out the exception for M855 and SS109 ammunition before they made the announcement, the ATF management understood that it was hanging way out in the wind, with very little protection or support. The digital trail would show that they approved of the ban before there was any public comment or due process.
There is the little matter of Hillery’s emails... Giving the ATF management grave concern that a congressional committee might actually follow the digital and email trail of who approved of the modifications to the manual.
They have seen that President Obama is willing to kick almost anyone under the bus if it is convenient for him...
In my humble opinion, this announcement is an attempt, which will likely be successful, to short circuit any investigation.
They’ve had time to buy up devalued stock in the companies manufacturing the ammo, which will now run up as everyone buys as much as they can against the possible future banning.
At what point when (armed) acquaintances (and maybe whole families) start to disappear do we realize that it is happening? And do we wait in ambush for our turn, or do we proactively seek out THOSE WHO GAVE THE ORDERS and disappear THEM?
Shop around here put 1k rounds up for $975 and some idiots ran in and bought it.
More than one did at that price, I just shook my head when a worker behind the counter was talking about it with a bunch of us on Saturday.
Can’t blame him though, he didn’t twist their arm to open their wallet.
That sounds like a reasonable and logical assumption. I truly find it difficult to believe that the BATF gives a rats ass about 80,000 people who object their fascist rulemaking.
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