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Philippines Looks to Revive U.S. Naval Base: Look to Subic Bay to Counter Chinese Moves
The Wall Street Journal ^ | September 16, 2013 | Andrew Browne

Posted on 09/16/2013 9:52:18 PM PDT by 2ndDivisionVet

SUBIC BAY, Philippines—In 1991, after the Philippine Senate voted to close Subic Naval Base—then the largest American overseas military facility—an emotional Sen. Agapito Aquino summed up the popular mood. It was, he said, "the dawn of our nation's birth."

Tossing out the Americans from Subic and nearby Clark Air Base, he added, had ended the country's "crippling dependence" on its former colonial overlord.

Now, the Philippines wants American forces back in Subic to counter Chinese moves off the Philippine coast. Just west of Subic, Chinese ships have fenced off the Scarborough Shoal, one of the world's richest fishing grounds, which falls within the Philippines's 200-nautical-mile exclusive economic zone.....

(Excerpt) Read more at online.wsj.com ...


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: china; navy; philippines; subicbay
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

I don’t expect an invasion, but merely economic slavery to China. The Philippines has lots of raw materials, right? It will just be as China is doing in Africa.


21 posted on 09/16/2013 11:49:02 PM PDT by Cowboy Bob (They are called "Liberals" because the word "parasite" was already taken.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
The Philippine Senate deserves the major role in the U.S. military pullout beginning at the end of 1991. The major U.S. bases were at Subic Bay and Clark AFB. The U.S. was paying the Philippines hundreds of millions of dollars for leases on these major bases and secondary sites as: NAS Cubi Point, Naval Support Depot, and Naval Ship Repair Facility.

Negotiations over the lease amount paid by the U.S. to the Philippine government ran into an impasse in the Philippine Senate. A majority of the Senators wanted to substantially increase the lease amount. While the negotiators were bickering, My. Pinatubo erupted and buried one of the major bases, Clark AFB, under tons and tons of volcanic ash. The base was a total loss.

The loss of Clark AFB was the final nail in the negotiations coffin for the Americans. They told the Philippines they were withdrawing from the bases and redeploying assets over the years 1992-1994. As they left, the Americans packed up their equipment and supporting logistics. The Filipinos got the empty shells of these bases. Eventually the Americans were gone, 80,000 Filipinos that worked on the U.S. bases lost their well paying jobs, and the Philippines lost their lease income.

Now the Chinese dragon is stirring up things, the Philippines want the military muscle of the Americans back in their country. They want Americans to block Chinese ambitions. I don't see this happening. The Philippines bit the hand that fed and helped protect them in 1991; we're gone and not coming back.

22 posted on 09/17/2013 1:34:29 AM PDT by MasterGunner01
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To: AlexW
Now, the Philippines wants American forces back in Subic to counter Chinese moves off the Philippine coast.

IE, the fishermen want the protection again and the country misses the MONEY!

All the President's Men: Follow the Money, Honey!

23 posted on 09/17/2013 1:43:10 AM PDT by sr4402
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To: Cowboy Bob

China has already invaded territory claimed by the Phillipines, and protests have been officially made to the United Nations and to ASEAN.


24 posted on 09/17/2013 1:56:41 AM PDT by WhiskeyX ( provides a system for registering complaints about unfair broadcasters and the ability to request a)
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To: MasterGunner01

“The Philippines bit the hand that fed and helped protect them in 1991; we’re gone and not coming back.”

Remember the closing of the range in Puerto Rico (Vieques?); they made a big stink about the danger to the natives, they got Al $harpton involved, and the US military complied and shut it down. The day after, the Puerto Ricans looked at their empty restaurants and dry cleaners and all of the other perks that come with a base, and asked if we could re-open it.

Be careful what you wish for...


25 posted on 09/17/2013 2:05:54 AM PDT by kearnyirish2 (Affirmative action is economic war against white males (and therefore white families).)
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To: American Constitutionalist

“Make them the 51st state with certain limitations.”

They want independence, and as a Catholic I’d prefer they had it. Spain warned them when they wanted independence from Spain that the US would not put the Church in the same position Spain had, and they were right. We are a Protestant (officially atheist) country.

“It would make a perfect strategic spot to counter China and take advantage of growing economic advantages being in Asia.”

When will we stop pretending we didn’t make Red China the powerhouse that it is, and continue to do so? If Red China is really an enemy (and as a Catholic I believe they are), then why don’t we stop building their infrastructure and training their students/spies?


26 posted on 09/17/2013 2:09:15 AM PDT by kearnyirish2 (Affirmative action is economic war against white males (and therefore white families).)
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To: WhiskeyX

“China has already invaded territory claimed by the Phillipines,”
__________________________________________

No, China is trying to claim the Spratleys for the vast oil reserves. So does Malaysia.
Everything in the South China Sea has a number of disputes.
It does not mean that China will invade or go to war against the Philippines.
No one has invaded anything.


27 posted on 09/17/2013 2:26:32 AM PDT by AlexW
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

When obama hears this, he will offer asylum to the whole population if they give the islands to China.


28 posted on 09/17/2013 2:30:16 AM PDT by Right Wing Assault (Dick Obama is more inexperienced now than he was before he was elected.)
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To: max americana

In the News/Activism forum, on a thread titled Philippines Looks to Revive U.S. Naval Base: Look to Subic Bay to Counter Chinese Moves, max americana wrote:
My Filipino buddy here told me the running joke was that the RP didn’t kick out the Americans but it was actually Mt Pinatubo erupted and blanketed the region with ashes that the US didn’t want to clean up after the damage it caused on the bases.

At the time that was the excuse MSM was using. In fact if you research alphabet soup news services records that was the excuse that was being given particularly Clark Field


29 posted on 09/17/2013 2:50:52 AM PDT by mosesdapoet (Serious contribution pause.Please continue onto meaningless venting no one reads.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

A local businessman returning Cebu last week said its a done deal.


30 posted on 09/17/2013 3:02:35 AM PDT by damncat
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
*KMAC YOYO

*Kiss My A$$ Charlie Your On Your Own.

31 posted on 09/17/2013 3:14:47 AM PDT by Portcall24
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
However, China definitely does believe that everything up the RP shoreline belongs to them. And the Middle Kingdom would appreciate a bit more kowtowing while you're at it, by the way.
32 posted on 09/17/2013 3:44:26 AM PDT by Pecos (Kritarchy: government by the judges)
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To: kearnyirish2
When the Lefties and Greenies got the Navy to close the bombing and gunnery ranges on Vieques Island off Puerto Rico, the locals there weren't the only casualties. The Navy also shuttered Roosevelt Roads Naval Station on the main island and all the Puerto Rican employees were left without jobs.

Be careful what you wish for lest your wish be granted.

Personally, I'd like nothing better than giving Puerto Rico full independence. The only reason why we kept the island after the Spanish-American War of 1898 was as a coaling station to refuel the Navy's Atlantic Fleet and a logistics base. Today's Navy has long since retired its coal burning ships and has retired Roosevelt Roads Naval Station and the Vieques Island training site. There's no reason to retain Puerto Rico as a Commonwealth.

33 posted on 09/17/2013 3:50:27 AM PDT by MasterGunner01
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To: MasterGunner01

Puerto Rico would never want independence; they could see their future in the poverty of Cuba and Jamaica. I’d have no problem pulling out, but I’d imagine a moral argument could be made against it.


34 posted on 09/17/2013 4:13:10 AM PDT by kearnyirish2 (Affirmative action is economic war against white males (and therefore white families).)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
For a start, the Philippines itself would have to reverse a constitutional ban on allowing a foreign power to establish a permanent military base. But assuming that was possible, America still wouldn't be interested. Bases are potential sitting ducks for Chinese missiles. Plus, they are expensive. At a time of budget cuts, it's far cheaper to sign a treaty with friendly countries guaranteeing access for U.S. forces than to pay rent. In military-speak, America wants "places not bases."

The idea that we'd pay rent to become unpaid security guard for Pinoys is pretty amusing. Even the Koreans are starting to figure out that the alternative to footing (part of) the bill is becoming a Chinese province. I suspect the Pinoys would get a deal if they gave us - in perpetuity - a base there rent-free. But they are likely too greedy and too convinced we need that base more than they do, for convoluted and stupid reasons. And this is a moronic elites to grassroots perception. So the base will simply not materialize.

35 posted on 09/17/2013 4:14:34 AM PDT by Zhang Fei (Let us pray that peace be now restored to the world and that God will preserve it always.)
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To: AlexW; Berosus; buwaya; dagogo redux; DFG; Doofer; knarf; LadyDoc; Mark17; max americana; ...
PIng
36 posted on 09/17/2013 4:26:31 AM PDT by ASA Vet (Don't assume Shahanshah Obama will allow another election.)
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To: ASA Vet

Here is a good explanation about the Spratleys.:
http://www.arrl.org/news/the-spratly-islands-dxpedition-gets-wings

Scroll down to the paragraph: “DXpeditions Can Be Dangerous”.

I was a teenager when I first heard of the Spratleys.
The very first expedition to put them on the air, back in the 60s, was blown out of the water by “pirates”. They were to operate with the call 1S1S.
There have, as you can see, been successful expeditions since then.

At that time, I never dreamed that I would be an international traveler living in the Philippines.


37 posted on 09/17/2013 4:41:26 AM PDT by AlexW
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Be careful what you wish for, you may just get it.


38 posted on 09/17/2013 4:51:16 AM PDT by 2001convSVT (Going Galt as fast as I can.)
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To: MasterGunner01
You summed it up accurately.

And, Chinese merchants have been part of PI society for hundreds of years so Filipinos should be used to having them around.

39 posted on 09/17/2013 5:04:11 AM PDT by Eric in the Ozarks ("Say Not the Struggle Naught Availeth.")
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To: Eric in the Ozarks

“Chinese merchants have been part of PI society for hundreds of years so Filipinos should be used to having them around.”
_________________________________________________
They are also quite well to do. I know several of them in my town. No problem at all. It is not so easy to even know that they are Chinese.


40 posted on 09/17/2013 5:47:13 AM PDT by AlexW
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