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Study: New E15 gas can ruin auto engines.
Washington Examiner ^

Posted on 01/31/2013 6:08:17 AM PST by selfdefense

This week's warm Washington temperatures had some thinking about rolling the Lawn-Boy out of the garage for the first cut of the year. And we all know what that means: Difficult starts due to E10 gas that gels when it sits. Now, according to a new study, cars and truck may face the same fate thanks to President Obama's demand for a higher ethanol in the new E15 gas.


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Crime/Corruption; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: corrupt; epa; government; obama
Another scenario designed to destroy the American economy ( In my Opinion ). Now needless car expenses to an already cash strapped society.
1 posted on 01/31/2013 6:08:26 AM PST by selfdefense
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To: selfdefense

"...but we can create so many "new" jobs for the destroyed medical professions.....MECHANICS

2 posted on 01/31/2013 6:14:45 AM PST by Doogle (USAF.68-73..8th TFW Ubon Thailand..never store a threat you should have eliminated))
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To: selfdefense

Two words: PowerStroke Diesel. :-)

(or is that three words?)

NO smog equipment, NO smog check. GIANT HONKIN’ carbon footprint!

2nd mortgage to pay the fuel bill, yes. But, hey, ya gotta make choices in life...


3 posted on 01/31/2013 6:20:22 AM PST by Nervous Tick (Without GOD, men get what they deserve.)
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To: Nervous Tick

>> rolling the Lawn-Boy out of the garage

My neighbor has a Lawn Boy in his garage; I think his name is Jose, and once he gets amnesty he’s gonna bring his family over and they’re going to move into Section 8 housing.


4 posted on 01/31/2013 6:23:01 AM PST by Nervous Tick (Without GOD, men get what they deserve.)
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To: selfdefense
Watch the pump! E15 is bad news if you don't have a Flex Fuel car.

And despite more oil production, there are less refineries. It's the governments way of increasing the price for political reasons.

5 posted on 01/31/2013 6:25:19 AM PST by sr4402
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All my small engines that use the 10% ethenol (all gas) also get the marine Sta-Bil (blue stuff) that has the corrosion additive to offset the effects of the alcohol. Also put in Marvel Mystery oil in the gas to return the lubricating properties of the gas that have been removed by the alcohol.


6 posted on 01/31/2013 6:29:08 AM PST by USCG SimTech (Honored to serve since '71)
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To: USCG SimTech

Is there any sort of an online resource to tell people how much of these additives to use in cars?


7 posted on 01/31/2013 6:34:57 AM PST by varmintman
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To: USCG SimTech

>> also get the marine Sta-Bil (blue stuff)

I’m gonna have to look into that. I am using the “red stuff” Sta-Bil for my small engine gas, thinking *it* was the antidote to ethanol poison.

Thanks for the heads up.

Where do you get the “blue stuff”?


8 posted on 01/31/2013 6:35:21 AM PST by Nervous Tick (Without GOD, men get what they deserve.)
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To: Nervous Tick

Now that’s funny.


9 posted on 01/31/2013 6:37:00 AM PST by rktman (Live the oath you took or get out of office!)
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To: Nervous Tick

Lots of places carry it along side the red.

http://www.walmart.com/ip/STA-BIL-Marine-Formula-Fuel-Stabilizer-32-oz/16645043


10 posted on 01/31/2013 6:38:08 AM PST by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
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To: Nervous Tick

Why not buy ethanol free unleaded regular to begin with. It’s about the same price as premium or about 30 cents per gallon more. I would still use the red Stabil if you keep the gas for more than 1 month. Stabil makes another product for daily use to counteract the ethanol in gas. It is clear to light yellow in color, but you’re better off getting the ethanol free gas if it’s available in your area.


11 posted on 01/31/2013 6:50:54 AM PST by derSchurfer (When the Rule of Law is ignored good citizens will take the law into their own hands.)
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To: selfdefense

Something fishy about the “recent study” that E15 can ruin engines.

Automotive and petroleum engineers have been studying fuel mixtures since the late ‘30s and that incluudes alcohol mixtures and pure alcohol. The behavior of the E15 mixture in engines has certainly been known for a long time.

If E15 is harmful to engines, why have the automotive and petroleum industries (and government?) allowed it to be sold? Could additives such as those mentioned in other posts solve the problem. If so, why doesn’t the E15 we receive already have the additives?

We have no business being sold a product that will damage our engines. Maybe it’s only older engines or “Lawn Boy” engines. There should be warnings at the pumps about those dangers.


12 posted on 01/31/2013 6:51:28 AM PST by cymbeline
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To: derSchurfer

I can never understand why all the FReepers who complain about expensive problems with their OPE don’t do exactly as you say, or head to the local airport for some avgas.

Yeah it’s a bit more per gallon, but how much cost are we really talking about vs the problems they claim to have?


13 posted on 01/31/2013 6:53:46 AM PST by nascarnation (Baraq's economic policy: trickle up poverty)
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To: varmintman; All
You may wish to check this site out.
14 posted on 01/31/2013 6:54:02 AM PST by Obadiah (We must commit to remove every Senate Blue-dog Democrat from office in 2014!)
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To: thackney

thx, I’ll look for it next time I’m at WallyWorld. If I find the blue stuff, it’ll take some of the sting out of finding no 9mm or .22, *again*. :-)


15 posted on 01/31/2013 6:57:58 AM PST by Nervous Tick (Without GOD, men get what they deserve.)
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To: Nervous Tick

It will also be commonly found in any place that sells boating stuff, Academy Sports, BassPro, etc.


16 posted on 01/31/2013 6:59:53 AM PST by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
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To: cymbeline

>> If E15 is harmful to engines, why have the automotive and petroleum industries (and government?) allowed it to be sold?

ROFLMAO!! Now THAT’S funny!

If abortion is so harmful to babies, why has the government allowed it?
If over-the-top debt is really such a bad thing, how could the government allow themselves to get into it?

But seriously... ethanol damage in engines not specifically designed to burn ethanol is NOT a “black helicopter” conspiracy. There is sound, obvious, and reproducible science behind it.


17 posted on 01/31/2013 7:03:53 AM PST by Nervous Tick (Without GOD, men get what they deserve.)
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To: derSchurfer

>> Why not buy ethanol free unleaded regular to begin with.

Uh... because that would require me to plan ahead? :-)
But seriously, I did buy and use five gallons of av gas from a pilot friend and it worked great. It’s just not as instant-gratification convenient as buying gas anywhere and adding something to it.

>> Stabil makes another product for daily use to counteract the ethanol in gas. It is clear to light yellow in color

OH NO!!! There’s a YELLOW one too? If you mix the blue stuff with the red stuff and add the yellow stuff, do you have WHITE Sta-Bil? j/k thanks for the tip, I’ll look for it.


18 posted on 01/31/2013 7:09:22 AM PST by Nervous Tick (Without GOD, men get what they deserve.)
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To: derSchurfer
Why not buy ethanol free unleaded regular to begin with. It’s about the same price as premium or about 30 cents per gallon more.

In some areas it is not available. It is over 100 miles (one way) from my place near Houston to the nearest store claiming to sell ethanol free gasoline.

19 posted on 01/31/2013 7:11:36 AM PST by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
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To: cymbeline

This didn’t come from automotive and petroleum industries.

- - - - - - - -

In March 2009, Growth Energy (a coalition of U.S. ethanol supporters) and 54 ethanol manufacturers applied for a waiver to increase the allowable amount of ethanol in gasoline from E10 to E15. The waiver application included data on the impact of E15 on vehicle emissions, fuel system materials, and driveability. Additional data were developed by DOE, which in 2008 began testing for potential impacts of various ethanol-gasoline blends on the emission control systems of MY2007 and newer light-duty motor vehicles. This testing followed enactment of the Energy Independence and Security Act of 2007, which calls for significantly increasing the amount of biofuels, such as ethanol, to be used in transportation fuel.

On October 13, 2010, based in large part on DOE test data, EPA partially granted Growth Energy’s waiver request. This partial waiver allows fuel and fuel additive manufacturers to introduce E15 into commerce for use in MY2007 and newer light-duty motor vehicles, subject to certain conditions. EPA denied the waiver for E15 use in MY2000 and older light-duty motor vehicles, and all heavy-duty gasoline engines and vehicles (e.g., delivery trucks), highway and off-highway motorcycles, and nonroad engines, vehicles, and equipment (e.g., boats, snowmobiles, and lawnmowers) due to insufficient test data or other information to support a waiver for these vehicles and engines.

On January 21, 2011, after additional DOE test data were made available to the public (see EPA Docket #EPA-HQ-OAR-2009-0211 at www.regulations.gov), EPA took further action on Growth Energy’s waiver request application by partially approving the waiver to allow the introduction into commerce of E15 for use in MY2001-2006 and newer light-duty motor vehicles, subject to the same conditions that apply to the partial waiver decision for MY2007 and newer light-duty motor vehicles. Taken together, the two waiver decisions allow the introduction into commerce of E15 for use in MY2001 and newer light-duty motor vehicles if the waiver conditions are met.

On February 27, 2012, EPA issued a memorandum (PDF) (6 pp, 2.4MB, February 27, 2012) concerning a minor technical error related to one of the DOE test vehicles from MY2001-2006. The error stemmed from a manufacturer’s mislabeling of the test vehicle model and had no material impact on the January 2011 waiver decision. A fact sheet about the memorandum is available here.

http://www.epa.gov/otaq/regs/fuels/additive/e15/e15-faq.htm#waiver


20 posted on 01/31/2013 7:13:08 AM PST by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
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To: Nervous Tick

http://www.goldeagle.com/brands/stabil/products.aspx


21 posted on 01/31/2013 7:15:39 AM PST by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
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To: Nervous Tick

Q: What is the difference between Marine Formula STA-BIIL®, STA-BIL® Fuel Stabilizer, and the new STA-BIL® Ethanol Treatment products?

A: Marine Formula STA-BIL® Ethanol Treatment was designed for use at every fill up for marine engines (boats, jetskis) to protect against the damaging effects experienced when using Ethanol blended fuels — including corrosion caused by water attraction, and fuel system plugging caused by deposit loosening.

STA-BIL® Fuel Stabilizer is designed for use during STORAGE of any gasoline equipment or vehicle stored for 30 days or more, or used infrequently. It will keep gas fresh for 12 months, and help prevent corrosion, and gum and varnish formation.

New STA-BIL® Ethanol Treatment is designed for use at every fill up for all gasoline automotive and small engines for protection against these same problems.

All STA-BIL® brand products are effective in all gasolines, including Ethanol blends, including E-85.

http://www.goldeagle.com/brands/stabil/faq.aspx#284


22 posted on 01/31/2013 7:18:23 AM PST by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
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To: cymbeline
If E15 is harmful to engines, why have the automotive and petroleum industries (and government?) allowed it to be sold? Could additives such as those mentioned in other posts solve the problem. If so, why doesn’t the E15 we receive already have the additives?

E10 is the stuff that has become commonplace, this is the proposed new blend that would increase the ethanol content (and the related problems) by 50%.

23 posted on 01/31/2013 7:18:59 AM PST by Charles Martel (Endeavor to persevere...)
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To: varmintman
Only a fool puts ethanol or any other US Government mandated crap into their car/van/truck engine.

This link will help you find gas stations in your area that offer Marine Gas and/or 100% pure unleaded gas.

Yes, it is more expensive but it's worth it.

http://pure-gas.org/

24 posted on 01/31/2013 7:21:07 AM PST by Prole (Please pray for the families of Chris and Channon. May God always watch over them)
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To: thackney

Thank you, sir!


25 posted on 01/31/2013 7:24:27 AM PST by Nervous Tick (Without GOD, men get what they deserve.)
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To: nascarnation
I can never understand why all the FReepers who complain about expensive problems with their OPE don’t do exactly as you say, or head to the local airport for some avgas.

Have you noticed the "canned" fuel mix that is now being sold in the lawn and garden section at the big-box hardware stores? In some places, it's easier to find that on the shelf than gasoline storage cans.

26 posted on 01/31/2013 7:24:51 AM PST by Charles Martel (Endeavor to persevere...)
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To: Prole

It is over 100 miles (one way) from my place near Houston to the nearest store claiming to sell ethanol free gasoline.


27 posted on 01/31/2013 7:29:44 AM PST by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
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To: USCG SimTech

My Highlander is going to get it’s third set of oxy sensors in 85,000 miles. Is the E-10 killing them?


28 posted on 01/31/2013 7:52:47 AM PST by Dr. Bogus Pachysandra ( Ya can't pick up a turd by the clean end!)
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To: Doogle

I didn’t know they made “horror” blowup dolls.


29 posted on 01/31/2013 7:57:29 AM PST by meatloaf (Support Senate S 1863 & House Bill 1380 to eliminate oil slavery.)
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To: thackney

Thanks for that info!


30 posted on 01/31/2013 8:22:25 AM PST by gibsosa
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To: Nervous Tick

The two words I would use are “turbo diesel”

Mine runs my Sprinter van tirelessly at 23 mpg cruising at 70 mph. It is a real peace of work. When required it runs biodiesel just as well as the real thing.


31 posted on 01/31/2013 8:28:50 AM PST by bert ((K.E. N.P. N.C. +12 .....The fairest Deduction to be reduced is the Standard Deduction)
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To: Nervous Tick

-——Where do you get the “blue stuff”?-——

The good stuff Walt makes is available all over the south west so I’ve heard.


32 posted on 01/31/2013 8:31:09 AM PST by bert ((K.E. N.P. N.C. +12 .....The fairest Deduction to be reduced is the Standard Deduction)
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To: bert

>> my Sprinter van

I had to look that one up. Pretty cool wagon!

You must be one of them dreaded “rich folks”. :-)


33 posted on 01/31/2013 8:33:39 AM PST by Nervous Tick (Without GOD, men get what they deserve.)
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To: Charles Martel

>> Have you noticed the “canned” fuel mix that is now being sold in the lawn and garden section at the big-box hardware stores?

Oh, yeah. Stihl dealer pushes it too. IIRC it’s like eight bucks a quart.

But for that price it’ll keep all winter! :-)


34 posted on 01/31/2013 8:36:57 AM PST by Nervous Tick (Without GOD, men get what they deserve.)
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To: meatloaf

Muahhhahaaa!! That was a coffee-spitter!


35 posted on 01/31/2013 8:37:17 AM PST by gibsosa
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To: Nervous Tick
Two words: PowerStroke Diesel. :-)

Let's play the letter game Can you say EGR, DPF, and DEF? I knew you could.

36 posted on 01/31/2013 8:41:41 AM PST by showme_the_Glory (ILLEGAL: prohibited by law. ALIEN: Owing political allegiance to another country or government)
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To: Doogle; selfdefense

I generally never judged a book by it's cover..

However, this individual has, "scary" and "dangerous to freedom", written all over it.

She looks like something you'd expect out of a controlling homeowners association meeting...Just scary...

You know the country is screwed when people like Obama and this individual are given power...

This should be enough to make the freedom lovers in this country, recoil in shock.

37 posted on 01/31/2013 8:44:00 AM PST by dragnet2 (Diversion and evasion are tools of deceit)
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To: showme_the_Glory

You’re correct of course.

Maybe he’s talking about the “good old days” of diesels when they actually had much higher compression than gassers, could run super lean for economy at part throttle, and could ingest fuel that was considerably cheaper than gas.


38 posted on 01/31/2013 8:49:00 AM PST by nascarnation (Baraq's economic policy: trickle up poverty)
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To: thackney

Interesting that just across the La border are a bunch of them. I’m sure you know more about this than the rest of us.


39 posted on 01/31/2013 8:52:51 AM PST by nascarnation (Baraq's economic policy: trickle up poverty)
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To: showme_the_Glory
Let's play the letter game Can you say EGR, DPF, and DEF? I knew you could.

Wow, that was fun! Now let's play the number game! Can you say two-thousand-one? I knew you could!

Wasn't that a blast? Okay, let's try ANOTHER number! Can you say seven-point-three? Good job!

(No DEF. No DPF. EGR, I think so but so what.)

40 posted on 01/31/2013 8:53:41 AM PST by Nervous Tick (Without GOD, men get what they deserve.)
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To: USCG SimTech

Just curious, how much oil do you add per gallon approximately?


41 posted on 01/31/2013 8:56:02 AM PST by dragnet2 (Diversion and evasion are tools of deceit)
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To: derSchurfer

There are a lot of us that don’t have ethanol free gas within 50 miles or more.


42 posted on 01/31/2013 9:01:56 AM PST by FreedomPoster (Islam delenda est)
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To: nascarnation
Interesting that just across the La border are a bunch of them.

Once you get out of the EPA mandated reformulated fuel area, it become legal.


43 posted on 01/31/2013 9:02:58 AM PST by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
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To: selfdefense

44 posted on 01/31/2013 9:06:20 AM PST by JoeProBono (A closed mouth gathers no feet - Mater tua caligas exercitus gerit ;-{)
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To: thackney

Stupid stupid government.

Drought cited in ethanol production suspension
http://news.yahoo.com/drought-cited-ethanol-production-suspension-210621142.html


45 posted on 01/31/2013 9:14:09 AM PST by listenhillary (Courts, law enforcement, roads and national defense should be the extent of government)
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To: JoeProBono
Wait.. What year? ;?)


46 posted on 01/31/2013 9:17:24 AM PST by listenhillary (Courts, law enforcement, roads and national defense should be the extent of government)
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To: thackney
I am sorry to hear that.

I hate ethanol, as it is anything BUT healthy for a vehicle engine. It also burns at a rapid rate compared to old fashioned unleaded.

Have you considered visiting a friend or family member who lives in that area, and getting some gas while there?

47 posted on 01/31/2013 11:37:13 AM PST by Prole (Please pray for the families of Chris and Channon. May God always watch over them)
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