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Putting Themselves to Sleep
ScienceNOW ^ | 21 November 2012 | Greg Miller

Posted on 11/24/2012 11:24:40 PM PST by neverdem

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Since flumazenil antagonized the effects of benzodiazepines, they thought there were specific benzodiazepine receptors.
1 posted on 11/24/2012 11:24:51 PM PST by neverdem
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To: neverdem

Did that neurologist think to recommend patients to an endocrinologist to have calcium and parathyroid levels checked?


2 posted on 11/24/2012 11:37:10 PM PST by wastedyears (I don't want to live on this planet anymore.)
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To: neverdem
Many years ago I was reading "The Schwartzbein Principle". Schwartzbein discussed sleep issues and said that "GABA" helps "reduce the noise in your head" so you can sleep. I often find myself writing software algorithms instead of normal "dreaming". It's very productive the next day, but often results in being damn tired instead of being rested. On a whim, I picked up a bottle of GABA to evaluate the effects. It turned my normal mental machinations into a full blown circus. A bit like the kind of rave you might see in a heavy metal night club in an over the top Hollywood movie. I certainly didn't sleep well at all. About 6 weeks later, I tested it again. Same effect. GABA does not turn down the "noise" in my head. It might as well be a brass band playing. It turns up the noise for me.

When I'm forced out of bed before I'm adequately rested, I'm tired all day. I just blew off making the 900 mile drive home for Thanksgiving because my employer sent me to a very expensive security training class, then my niece stole the only sleep day I was going to get for a memorial for her dad. 11 days of forced 6:30 AM starts with work finishing at midnight to 1 AM. I was too burned out to safely drive.

3 posted on 11/25/2012 12:11:57 AM PST by Myrddin
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To: neverdem
Many years ago I was reading "The Schwartzbein Principle". Schwartzbein discussed sleep issues and said that "GABA" helps "reduce the noise in your head" so you can sleep. I often find myself writing software algorithms instead of normal "dreaming". It's very productive the next day, but often results in being damn tired instead of being rested. On a whim, I picked up a bottle of GABA to evaluate the effects. It turned my normal mental machinations into a full blown circus. A bit like the kind of rave you might see in a heavy metal night club in an over the top Hollywood movie. I certainly didn't sleep well at all. About 6 weeks later, I tested it again. Same effect. GABA does not turn down the "noise" in my head. It might as well be a brass band playing. It turns up the noise for me.

When I'm forced out of bed before I'm adequately rested, I'm tired all day. I just blew off making the 900 mile drive home for Thanksgiving because my employer sent me to a very expensive security training class, then my niece stole the only sleep day I was going to get for a memorial for her dad. 11 days of forced 6:30 AM starts with work finishing at midnight to 1 AM. I was too burned out to safely drive.

4 posted on 11/25/2012 12:12:10 AM PST by Myrddin
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To: neverdem; John Robinson
FR is double posting tonight.
5 posted on 11/25/2012 12:15:30 AM PST by Myrddin
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To: Myrddin

Been going on for a while. I think it is caused by an unusual delay after people click “Post” which causes one to either forget that you already posted, or think that it didn’t take and click again. Apparently the software does not have a way to tell that you only clicked “Post Reply” once before multiple “Post” clicks.


6 posted on 11/25/2012 1:36:16 AM PST by wideminded
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To: wideminded

By now all old hands presumably know to wait till the browser itself complains of a time out.


7 posted on 11/25/2012 2:40:27 AM PST by HiTech RedNeck (How long before all this "fairness" kills everybody, even the poor it was supposed to help???)
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To: wastedyears
"David Rye, a neurologist at Emory University..."A third of our patients are on disability," he says, "and these are 20- and 30-year-old people."

It looks like he refers them to the Social Security Administration for a check.

Impeach the kenyan or secession.


8 posted on 11/25/2012 4:47:54 AM PST by ex91B10 (We've tried the Soap Box,the Ballot Box and the Jury Box; ONE BOX LEFT!)
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To: ex91B10

That’s what I was thinking. Great way to get more freebies.

Wonder if they ever considered these people are easily bored?


9 posted on 11/25/2012 7:45:52 AM PST by bgill (We've passed the point of no return. Welcome to Al Amerika.)
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To: neverdem; Myrddin

Thanks again neverdem, your posts contain a ton of interesting info!

Myrddin...if I’m understanding correctly, what you experience with GABA supplementation is the opposite of what it’s ‘sposed to be. Like Ritalin(!?) for hyperactivity - GABA is causing a paradoxical reaction in you. That’s very interesting.
Could it be the source of supplementation that’s “off”? IDK, but I feel for you. There are lists of various GABA-containing foods, I wonder if your reaction to them would be different?
Also, I’m not as up with the research, but I wonder if it’s a GABA problem, or a hyperactive GABA RECEPTOR problem.

I agree with the poster who mentioned checking endocrine function...
just me, but I’d go for blood testing with an eye toward ‘treatment’ with whole food supplements...YMMV.
FRegards,
spank


10 posted on 11/25/2012 8:17:41 AM PST by spankalib (The downside of liberty is the need to tolerate those who despise it.)
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To: Myrddin

It is a major principal of meditation to “turn off the noise in your head” before meditating. However, I finally got an interesting hypothesis as to why.

Some people who were very expert at meditation discovered that with extended periods of silence in the head, the mind tends to drift to either an unusual degree of focus, which allows it to consider a narrow situation at hand, ignoring distractions; or the mind becomes very unfocused, a very inspirational state of mind for both creativity and “quantum leaps” in problem resolution.

However, the “internal dialogue” disrupts these shifts in either direction, sticking the mind in the middle, where the mind is involved with the overall situation of a person in the here and now.

This middle position is optimal, they concluded, if you are “being chased by a tiger.” That is, it is survival oriented, far more so than with a state of narrow focus *or* inspiration.

So, in the shadowy past, our ancestors came up with the trick of talking to ourselves, and parents unknowingly indoctrinate their children in this technique to this day, “even though tigers are few and far between these days.”

Thus they concluded, if you use any of the techniques to shut up the internal dialogue, that little bit of mind discipline will give you access to both a strong state of focus, and an inspirational unfocused state.

In practical terms, say if you were doing your SAT test. Just the ability to focus on the test and ignore all the distractions around you might be worth 10-20 IQ points. A much more enhanced ability to concentrate.

Likewise, when faced with an irresolute and complicated problem, or just needing a big shot of inspirational creativity, unfocusing your mind could open the gates.

However, there is more to it than that. The internal dialogue, and the vacillations between a slightly more focused and a slightly more unfocused state of mind are very energy consumptive. A person too skilled with talking to themselves both sounds like an “airhead surfer”, and are exhausted by all the energy used to keep them in that state.

When such people use one of the techniques to control their internal dialogue, the change is dramatic. I knew one such surfer airhead type who applied himself to a technique for a good two week, and he was like a different person.

Not just speaking in coherent sentences, but full paragraphs, and his brain filled with energy and good ideas. He was very pleased with the result, but somewhat apprehensive, because were that rate of improvement to continue, he imagined it would be overwhelming.

He did describe his new ability as like having “a knife switch in his head”, so he could turn his dialogue on or off at will.


11 posted on 11/25/2012 8:32:19 AM PST by yefragetuwrabrumuy (DIY Bumper Sticker: "THREE TIMES,/ DEMOCRATS/ REJECTED GOD")
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To: neverdem
Who's to say what's normal, but maybe we're not doing it right, or at least not as we used to.

Look up "First sleep and Second sleep" for another idea about how we might be wired and why some of us struggle with going back to sleep.

12 posted on 11/25/2012 8:56:23 AM PST by GBA (Here in the Matrix, life is but a dream.)
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To: yefragetuwrabrumuy
Controlling one's internal dialog, what it's tuned to and being able to turn it off at will are skills most never master and thus most are rarely free and rarely master much in or of their perceived world.

Unless we develop our will and intent, we are ego ruled creatures, slaved to its whims and desires.

13 posted on 11/25/2012 9:04:55 AM PST by GBA (Here in the Matrix, life is but a dream.)
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To: GBA

In all fairness, most people do not know that they can, and few would be willing to try even if they did know.

There is no motivation unless with are inspired and encouraged by forces beyond ourselves. Otherwise, we live and die, until something comes along and fractures our zeitgeist. Then most people die, and the few that remain either cling to the old ways, or try something new.


14 posted on 11/25/2012 10:03:44 AM PST by yefragetuwrabrumuy (DIY Bumper Sticker: "THREE TIMES,/ DEMOCRATS/ REJECTED GOD")
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To: yefragetuwrabrumuy
Yes, I agree and see how the universal truth of the Bell curve predicts that.

Many of us are essentially lazy, often fearful creatures who do little more than necessary.

However, we bore easily and thus there are a few seekers, inventors, explorers and adventurers who will boldly go where others fear to tread, either on their own or by following another's example.

Outside factors can change the nature of things and whether we look outside or inside. For example, I wonder how much has been displaced/lost by the ubiquitous television/idiot box.

15 posted on 11/25/2012 11:31:24 AM PST by GBA
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To: yefragetuwrabrumuy

” ...who applied himself to a technique...”

What does that mean?


16 posted on 11/25/2012 1:05:03 PM PST by fanfan ("But if Muslims were asked to go to church on Sunday and take Holy Communion there would be war.")
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To: fanfan

He took the technique seriously and performed it a lot.


17 posted on 11/25/2012 1:18:20 PM PST by yefragetuwrabrumuy (DIY Bumper Sticker: "THREE TIMES,/ DEMOCRATS/ REJECTED GOD")
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To: yefragetuwrabrumuy

Which technique?

What helped him so much?


18 posted on 11/25/2012 1:27:12 PM PST by fanfan ("But if Muslims were asked to go to church on Sunday and take Holy Communion there would be war.")
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To: wastedyears
Did that neurologist think to recommend patients to an endocrinologist to have calcium and parathyroid levels checked?

Any doc worth his/her salt would order standard chemistry tests that include calcium just to have a baseline after getting a chief complaint as well as complete prior medical and surgical history. Parathyroid levels would be checked only if the calcium result is abnormal, possibly only if that calcium result is confirmed by a repeat test.

19 posted on 11/25/2012 4:53:27 PM PST by neverdem ( Xin loi min oi)
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To: Myrddin; wideminded; HiTech RedNeck; spankalib; yefragetuwrabrumuy; GBA; fanfan
Many years ago I was reading "The Schwartzbein Principle". Schwartzbein discussed sleep issues and said that "GABA" helps "reduce the noise in your head" so you can sleep. I often find myself writing software algorithms instead of normal "dreaming". It's very productive the next day, but often results in being damn tired instead of being rested. On a whim, I picked up a bottle of GABA to evaluate the effects. It turned my normal mental machinations into a full blown circus. A bit like the kind of rave you might see in a heavy metal night club in an over the top Hollywood movie. I certainly didn't sleep well at all. About 6 weeks later, I tested it again. Same effect. GABA does not turn down the "noise" in my head. It might as well be a brass band playing. It turns up the noise for me.

I wonder how much genetic/epigenetic testing might explain it, what the bill would be and if you could get a definitive answer. It's possible that they could just rule out what they know to test for on a routine basis.

I always thought of GABA as an inhibitory neurotransmitter, but medicine always has something new to teach me.

Coexistence of excitatory and inhibitory GABA synapses in the cerebellar interneuron network.

20 posted on 11/25/2012 5:26:51 PM PST by neverdem ( Xin loi min oi)
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