Posted on 05/12/2012 7:44:19 AM PDT by markomalley
Thanks! May God bless you and yours!
I’m uncomfortable leaving the marriage issue up to any Court, at any level.
It seems to me that at some point, Christians, conservatives, constitutionalists and traditionalists are going to need to come together on this issue and insist, through their duly elected representatives and/or state governor, that:
a.) Congress must restrict the appellate jurisdiction of the federal Courts in regards to marriage;
b.) The state government consider nullification in response to the failure of a.) and the inevitable federal court decision forcing recognition of homosexual marriage
Fair question.
Do I advocate re-criminalizing what was once termed “deviant sexual conduct”? Not in the present cultural climate as long as other factors such as rape, incest, or statutory rape are involved — in my state, even today anal and oral sex carry additional criminal penalties when they are not consensual. But we've got enough problems to deal with and I'm not inclined to try to re-criminalize sexual conduct between two heterosexual married people.
Of course, just because something is legal doesn't mean it's moral, and not everything which is morally permitted is a good idea.
I'm not Roman Catholic; I am not required to believe that all sexual activity must have at least the potential to lead to procreation. (Catholics please correct me here if I've misunderstood the official teaching of your church on this issue — that's the way it has been explained to me.)
However, anal and oral sex were once commonly prohibited by law. Prior to President Clinton getting a “Lewinsky” in the White House, these subjects simply were not discussed in polite company.
What is the standard reason given for heterosexual couples having non-vaginal intercourse? First, avoidance of pregnancy, and second, a desire to try something “different” that they feel will be more stimulating. Outside committed couples (I'm including live-in relationships in that category, trying to be as broad as possible) additional motives get cited such as “it's quicker” or a desire by men to dominate the woman involved.
I fail to see that any of those are good reasons for people to put their genitals in places they don't belong.
Just how many women really enjoy giving a “blow job” or receiving anal sex? While there are probably some out there, I think it's pretty clear we're talking about ways in which men can satisfy their urges by forcing something on their wives or girlfriends that few would choose unless they've become accustomed to it, and I fail to see how that reflects a loving marital relationship.
I have literally gagged several times in writing this note. I believe that is the way most normal people respond to the idea of these sexual “alternatives” and the fact that our society is accepting them says a great deal about how far our society has fallen.
The bottom line is that homosexuals do things which normal people do not do. Those things are disgusting, and should disgust normal people.
We agree on divorce rates being a bad witness.
Actually there have been many efforts to address the issue of making divorce more difficult on the state and local levels. There are legal complications to the so-called “covenant marriage” concept; other steps have been taken such groups of people in some communities making “quickie” marriage more difficult by judges, justices of the peace, and others refusing to conduct marriages on the grounds that they are not trained to do premarital counseling. However, it is legally impossible to bar people from getting a quickie marriage by driving to states and jurisdictions which allow that, and that was an issue even a half-century ago with people driving across state lines.
The root problem is that we live in a culture that devalues marriage and that is causing many difficulties.
I don’t see that divorce rates undermine man/woman marriage at all. In fact, they emphasize the difficulty for the community when families fall apart. Improperly supervised children, poverty-line children, and marginally educated children ALL testify to the BENEFITS of married parents caring for their own children based on the bonds established between caring parents and children.
THAT is why society gives small tax and other concessions to married male/female couples!
It’s not because they are “in love” or because that’s how they prefer their sexuality to be expressed.
The state has absolutely no interest in who you love, and the only interest they have in HOW you express your sexuality involves public health and the spread of STDs.
Divorce emphasizes how valuable it is for families to hang in there.
“I don’t see that divorce rates undermine man/woman marriage at all.”
I didn’t argue that; rather that the high divorce rates among Christians (no better than our secular neighbors, according to surveys I have read) undermine our moral authority in *arguing* for traditional marriage.
If Christians, conservatives and traditionalists want to defend marriage, they should be petitioning their state representatives to rewrite the family code to make it more difficult to divorce.
I, of course, agree that Christians should follow their principles. Anytime they don’t anyone could argue against that principle being valid, whether divorce, theft, etc.
However, since the principle is God-given, it always remains valid and always remains arguable. It only takes teh courage to do so in bad times.
So, I understand what you’re saying, but I want us to stand and fight and not give up and what is right just because some goofy Christians get off track.
Not just no, but hell no.
Freedom OF Religion doesn't mean the government can come in and start telling the faithful what to believe.
This is why I have been insistent over the years that Marriage stay a RELIGIOUS sacrament and that secular government have no say in it. Either for, or against.
Because when it comes right down to it, when you allow government to license your marriage, you opened yourself up to exactly this.
Once again, I was right. Some folks here need to come to terms with that.
Real Christians faithfully seek and follow Him. A real Christian nation made up of real faithful Christians would never acknowledge homosexual behavior as anything more than an abomination. And we would not be providing material support to our culture war enemies by sending our children to be educated in government schools. And we wouldn’t have permitted 55 million abortions. And we wouldn’t elect leaders who take advice from “top republican pollsters advising party to embrace...”. There are Biblical arguments against homosexual “marriage”, but those arguments are not credible coming from the mouths of unrepentant, antinomian Christians-in-name-only.
I’ve been repeating myself, but I think it is worth repeating...
You can’t win if you’re not at the table.
If you’re not at the table, you lose.
Too many on our side seem to want to lose.
When you get to the table, then you start playing your cards.
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